Another legal lights topic

[Metal8]

Don't want to go over old ground really but does anyone know of any prosecutions where legal vs illegal lights has been highlighted?

I know that it could be if a sharp lawyer looked into it very closely but couldn't a valid defence be that almost all bike lights sold in the UK do not conform to the Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations?

If they are on, can be seen and do not dazzle oncoming road users (My pet hate

) then that should be good enough?

I have Smart and Cat Eye lights, not expensive but do the job in city environs.

One thing, where the hell do you attach lights to if you have a pannier rack and have up and over luggage when the seat post or seat stays can't be seen?
I know I could get a light with built in reflector for the back of the rack but that would be another expense.
Also, I have top bar brake levers on my drop handlebars so no room for lights.
Struggling to find lights to fit where the front reflector is just now.

 

[Metal8]

Most infringements of the RVLR on a bike would be dealt with either by FPN or, if it actually gets to court, at magistrates courts as a summary only offence. Magistrate courts are not courts of record so don't tend to be reported in the legal journals/web-sites - and don't create precedent.

What about if car knocks you over, you get injured and need insurance claim etc?

 

[raleighnut]

Don't want to go over old ground really but does anyone know of any prosecutions where legal vs illegal lights has been highlighted?

I know that it could be if a sharp lawyer looked into it very closely but couldn't a valid defence be that almost all bike lights sold in the UK do not conform to the Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations?

If they are on, can be seen and do not dazzle oncoming road users (My pet hate

) then that should be good enough?

I have Smart and Cat Eye lights, not expensive but do the job in city environs.

One thing, where the hell do you attach lights to if you have a pannier rack and have up and over luggage when the seat post or seat stays can't be seen?
I know I could get a light with built in reflector for the back of the rack but that would be another expense.
Also, I have top bar brake levers on my drop handlebars so no room for lights.
Struggling to find lights to fit where the front reflector is just now.

Bracket on the rack?

http://www.googleadservices.com/pag...ahUKEwi7w5eKv6_PAhVMBMAKHVkuBC4Qwg8IKg&adurl=

 

[raleighnut]

For the front a bar extender mount on the stem.

 

[martint235]

Don't want to go over old ground really but does anyone know of any prosecutions where legal vs illegal lights has been highlighted?

I know that it could be if a sharp lawyer looked into it very closely but couldn't a valid defence be that almost all bike lights sold in the UK do not conform to the Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations?

If they are on, can be seen and do not dazzle oncoming road users (My pet hate

) then that should be good enough?

I have Smart and Cat Eye lights, not expensive but do the job in city environs.

One thing, where the hell do you attach lights to if you have a pannier rack and have up and over luggage when the seat post or seat stays can't be seen?
I know I could get a light with built in reflector for the back of the rack but that would be another expense.
Also, I have top bar brake levers on my drop handlebars so no room for lights.
Struggling to find lights to fit where the front reflector is just now.

You could easily mount Hope1 lights without interfering with your brake levers. And my carradice has a loop to attach a light to so the light is still the rearmost thing on the bike.

Out of interest, why do my two Hope1 not conform to lighting laws for a bike?

 

[Deleted member 1258]

I've used these in the past to fit a rear light to a carrier

https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/lighting-spares/hebie-arc-j82s-sl-universal-rack-fitting-light-bracket/

 

[Andrew_Culture]

Have you considered gaffa tape and a chain? It appeared to be doing the job on this bike I spotted outside Tesco in Stowmarket:

 

[raleighnut]

Have you considered gaffa tape and a chain? It appeared to be doing the job on this bike I spotted outside Tesco in Stowmarket:
View attachment 145650

e-bike too by the look of things.

 

[Metal8]

Have you considered gaffa tape and a chain? It appeared to be doing the job on this bike I spotted outside Tesco in Stowmarket:
View attachment 145650

Ha ha that's brilliant

I looked at one of these for the rack
http://www.fawkes-cycles.co.uk/2475870/products/rsp-rear-carrier-light.aspx

 

[Andrew_Culture]

e-bike too by the look of things.

Well the big battery on the e-bike could help power the many torches!

 

[mjr]

Don't want to go over old ground really but does anyone know of any prosecutions where legal vs illegal lights has been highlighted?

Not under current regulations. Feel free to dig around on www.bailii.org if you like. I found only http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/QB/2014/977.html that even mentioned lights on a pedal cycle recently and seems to have considered only whether they were visible or not, rather than full compliance.

I know that it could be if a sharp lawyer looked into it very closely but couldn't a valid defence be that almost all bike lights sold in the UK do not conform to the Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations?

No. Almost all bike lights sold in the UK are acceptable as additional lights (alongside compliant lights) or for off-road use... as I understand it, that's why Trading Standards can't prevent their sale.

If they are on, can be seen and do not dazzle oncoming road users (My pet hate

) then that should be good enough?

It mostly should be, yes. However, it's far easier to meet those conditions and be able to see a decent distance ahead with compliant lights. I am a bit puzzled by the market failure that has led to the current situation of most bike shops selling only crap lights, most cyclists buying only crap lights and soooo many people on forums defending crap lights as if they're as good.

Struggling to find lights to fit where the front reflector is just now.

Is that on the front crown? Lights mounted there seem to be mostly dynamo-powered. I guess a crown bracket isn't great for holding a heavy battery.

 

[2Loose]

Out of interest, why do my two Hope1 not conform to lighting laws for a bike?

Please enlighten us MJR, perhaps pointing me in the direction of lights that do actually conform while you are about it.
(I am now trying to find a way of reading the tiny number on my Exposure Sirius...)

 

[johnnyb47]

I think the police have got more pressing things to deal with than pulling over Joe blogs on his bike with some offensive Chinese lights bolted to his bike.There under so much pressure with policing shortages. With the constant problems they face with non insured drivers , accidents to attend ect I think the very worst a cyclist would get from a police officer is some good advice about how offensive his / her lights are. Even if it was referred to court it would most probably get dismissed with a ticking off from the judge. I cant remember the last time i saw a police man or police car where I live to be honest.

 

[marknotgeorge]

Rose and Bike Discount in Germany sell compliant lights. Strictly speaking, they're compliant to the German StVZO standard, but that means they're company here too. They're not expensive, either.

 

[marknotgeorge]

Is that on the front crown? Lights mounted there seem to be mostly dynamo-powered. I guess a crown bracket isn't great for holding a heavy battery.

I once bought a bracket from SJS (I think) made by B&M that allowed lights designed to fit on the handlebars to be mounted to the fork crown. Plastic, but quite substantial.