close passing prosecutions

[glasgowcyclist]

It may work in other countries. But I am personally against the introduction of any legislation that places automatic or implied blame on any part before an investigation.

I don't know about France but the presumed liability currently being sought in this country would apply solely to the civil aspect of damages and not the criminal aspect of fault.

GC

 

[PhilDawson8270]

I don't know about France but the presumed liability currently being sought in this country would apply solely to the civil aspect of damages and not the criminal aspect of fault.

GC

I do understand that, but I am still opposed to it. In any scenario.

 

[mjr]

+1

The clue is in the word "space". It's not saying that a driver's positioning on the road should be identical whether they are overtaking a bike or another car, but that they should allow the same clearance (as a minimum) in either case. I can't see how the graphic supports any other interpretation.

And that's my point. Motorists will happily squeeze past other vehicles with much less than 1.5m clearance and the illustration encourages them to do similarly close overtakes of cyclists because it's clearly not treating the cyclist as if they're a car. I don't agree with that interpretation and at best, the rule is dangerously ambiguous and should be rephrased with explicit distances, preferably backed by law.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

I do understand that, but I am still opposed to it. In any scenario.

Even where you're rear-ended by another driver?

GC

 

[DRM]

The thing is the French don't view cyclists as a bloody nusiance, when you are overtaken they give you lot's of room, most sundays in villages and towns there is the club run, so motorists are used to cyclists being on the road, however the main differance to the UK is French roads are generally long and straight, but it is a better mindset from drivers, alot of whom probably ride as well, so they know what it is like to be on a bike so are more careful around cyclists.

 

[PhilDawson8270]

Even where you're rear-ended by another driver?

GC

Even then. That has been abused, with the crash for cash scams. Admittedly you would be daft to crash for cash on a bicycle But yes, even in that scenario I don't agree with it.

 

[PK99]

The thing is the French don't view cyclists as a bloody nusiance, when you are overtaken they give you lot's of room, most sundays in villages and towns there is the club run, so motorists are used to cyclists being on the road, however the main differance to the UK is French roads are generally long and straight, but it is a better mindset from drivers, alot of whom probably ride as well, so they know what it is like to be on a bike so are more careful around cyclists.

Not in my experience over a number of years in France and specifically last week touring in Provence:

1. Up hill. Armco to my right. Secondary road position. Large HGV overtakes too close and gets closer to the point where I could have touched the Armco on my right and his wheel on my left. I have never has such a close pass in the UK - my wife was riding behind and was terrified for my safety and asked if I was ok and needed to stop when she caught up a few moments later.

2. Group of 13, split into two sub groups. with the length of a cricket wicket between. Large farm with large trailer attached, overtakes rear group, stays wide but passes second group very close and pulls in, the trailer forcing the riders almost into the verge.

3. Riding up the Gorges du Verdun. Rock wall to the left. Stone parapet and deep drop to the right. Winding bends. Car overtakes on bend and is met by car coming the other way. Pulls in hard at an angle part way along the group leaving zero space at the front. Both cars and cyclists forced to a standstill.

There were many other close passes less dramatic, but equally well short of the mythical 1.5m

And one not passing related:

I'm going down hill (on the route from Sault to Gorges de Nesque. Long. Straight. Steep. 20/25mph. Wide cycle lanes both sides. Car pulls out of side turning. Stops front wheels into the main carriageway, completely straddling the Cycle Lane. I'm forced into emergency braking to the point of locking up. Only escape is to swing very sharply behind him. How I managed to first avoid T-boning him and second to stay upright on the swing behind I still do not know. Garmin trace clearly show heart rate spike.

A typical cycling week for me is 150 miles in the Surrey Hills and the Thames Valley west from Kingston - in 10 years I can recall one event where I felt as directly in danger as those 4 events in a single week in Provence.

 

[Big Andy]

It isn't automatically at fault though. It is simply that the onus is placed on the driver to show that they are not at fault.

Well thats slightly better. However guilty until proven innocent is still a slippery slope.

 

[doog]

The thing is the French don't view cyclists as a bloody nusiance, when you are overtaken they give you lot's of room, most sundays in villages and towns there is the club run, so motorists are used to cyclists being on the road, however the main differance to the UK is French roads are generally long and straight, but it is a better mindset from drivers, alot of whom probably ride as well, so they know what it is like to be on a bike so are more careful around cyclists.

I thought the same rather wistfully but after multiple tours through France I'm firmly of the belief that familiarisation breeds contempt with the French. They tend to indicate more so than the Brits when overtaking but their speed is often higher (or not reduced at all) and I notice no real difference in relation to passing distances.

I also find Sundays to be quite hazardous in rural areas - usually after dinner, cant think why

 

[Lonestar]

I also find Sundays to be quite hazardous in rural areas - usually after dinner, cant think why

I found the Saturday night commute back quite hazardous but I did get some good overtakes and signalling...also quite a few strong smells of grass,man.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

Metropolitan Police are upping the stakes by suggesting that repeat offenders are at risk of having their vehicle seized.

 

[mjr]

Metropolitan Police are upping the stakes by suggesting that repeat offenders are at risk of having their vehicle seized.

And blimey, http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2002/30/section/59 appears to give them that power.

 

[steveindenmark]

I think the only way this could get to court is if the car that closely passes you is being followed by a police car who sees the incident.

Closes passes on head cams often don't look like close passes because of the distortion.

I like the idea, but proving it is a different thing.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

I think the only way this could get to court is if the car that closely passes you is being followed by a police car who sees the incident.

Closes passes on head cams often don't look like close passes because of the distortion.

I like the idea, but proving it is a different thing.

I suspect it's primarily targeted at offenders caught in situation like the West Midlands Police 'Operation Close Pass' where it is unmarked police cyclists who are providing the evidence. If it creates some worry in wider motoring circles that's all good.

 

[steveindenmark]

I suspect it's primarily targeted at offenders caught in situation like the West Midlands Police 'Operation Close Pass' where it is unmarked police cyclists who are providing the evidence. If it creates some worry in wider motoring circles that's all good.

Thats lovely. I like that.

Now we can all wear those viz vests with POLICE on the back :0)