The long road to ruin

[GrumpyGregry]

But rural communities would be devastated. Many, if not most, villages don't have a bus service, and many that do have one get a bus, say, 3 times a week. People who can't afford to run a car will be forced into towns, turning villages into rich people's dormitories.

Devasted? Hardly.

If the demand for public transport services to rural communities increases the supply will increase to meet it. Basic economics. Someone will want to make a buck. And the extra fuel taxes could be used to provide subsidy. Local retail suppliers will become more viable again breathing life into communites already heading for dormitory status, and everyone can shop online these days...

 

[GrumpyGregry]

Oh yeah, and these poor impoverished folk can buy fuel efficient vehicles and ditch the gas guzzlers they nearly all seem to drive these days.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

So people living in the country should have their motoring subsidised ? Is that really what you are saying?

that would encourage anyone commuting by car to move to the country so they'd get subsidised fuel

They already do. Highway authority income in counties with large rural areas is chiefly generated by community charge in URBAN areas. The townies have always subsidised the rural roads network.

Trunk roads are paid for out of general taxation so folk in say, south London, chip in for the A24 and A27 that they never ever use.

 

[Profpointy]

They already do. Highway authority income in counties with large rural areas is chiefly generated by community charge in URBAN areas. The townies have always subsidised the rural roads network.

well that's all right then. So how do we get the townies driving more as well

 

[GrumpyGregry]

This is a fascinating read.

In 2010 the population of rural England was 9.8 million, or 19% of the total population.
• The rural population is predominantly aged between 45 and 64, and is generally older than
the urban population.
• Between 2001 and 2010 the population of Less Sparse Villages, Hamlets and Isolated
Dwellings increased by 7%, greater than any other rural or urban area type.
• In 2009/10 net internal migration to rural areas was 54,000, compared to -75,000 for urban
areas.

 

[MikeG]

Devasted? Hardly.

If the demand for public transport services to rural communities increases the supply will increase to meet it. Basic economics. Someone will want to make a buck. And the extra fuel taxes could be used to provide subsidy. Local retail suppliers will become more viable again breathing life into communites already heading for dormitory status, and everyone can shop online these days...

Oh yeah, and these poor impoverished folk can buy fuel efficient vehicles and ditch the gas guzzlers they nearly all seem to drive these days.

You don't live in a village, do you? Your prejudices are showing.......

There are some devastatingly poor people in Britain's villages, including many, many pensioners. They can barely afford to drive now, and your "basic economics" will drive them out of their houses and into towns. Thing is, chaps, if you don't see this as a complicated problem (which from the simplistic proposals I assume you don't), then you really don't understand the issues.

Oh, and the shopping online thing? Many villages have internet connections at dial-up connection speed. Try buying from Tesco Direct with 512 MBPS. But we shouldn't moan, hey............it's all just basic economics.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

well that's all right then. So how do we get the townies driving more as well

We don't. We scrap the town centre car parks, ban pavement parking, introduce penal charges for residents parking schemes, pedestrianise everything in town centres, impose 20mph rigidly enforced speed limits where people live and work, build cycle lanes/routes (which given there will be few cars will consist largely of bus lanes and signs, and introduce town centre road charging for single occupancy cars and force the fat lazy townie mofo's out of their pernicious, dirty, smelly, noisy tin boxes, and onto two wheels, two legs and public transport.

Then the subsidy has to stop.

 

[Profpointy]

thinking about this subsidy for different vehicle types and country people - give the importance of educating our children we need to subsidise 4x4 fuel as these are needed for the school run and for country people. Someone in the Chelteham paper wrote in saying she needed a 4x4 as she lived "out in the Cotswolds" which I understand is a bit like the Serrengetti with only rough tracks

 

[GrumpyGregry]

You don't live in a village, do you? Your prejudices are showing.......

I live in a small market town. I've lived for extended periods in tiny villages in very rural Wales. As to prejudice it is okay to parade yours then?

There are some devastatingly poor people in Britain's villages, including many, many pensioners. They can barely afford to drive now, and your "basic economics" will drive them out of their houses and into towns.

The majority of the rural population is not of pensionable age. The majority of the rural poor is not of pensoinable age. and you are talking about less than 1/5th of the population of the country. Far more devastatingly poor people live in urban contexts. The vast majority of pensioners live in urban contexts.

Thing is, chaps, if you don't see this as a complicated problem (which from the simplistic proposals I assume you don't), then you really don't understand the issues.

Pathetic argument. Play the ball not the player or shut up. You really overuse the "you don't understand the complexity of the issue" line you know.

Oh, and the shopping online thing? Many villages have internet connections at dial-up connection speed. Try buying from Tesco Direct with 512 MBPS. But we shouldn't moan, hey............it's all just basic economics.

Yeah. The townies should subside rural internet connectivity too. Is there anything country folk actually pay for themselves? I deliver internet services to rural Adfrica for a living, amongst other things. 512 Mbps is a chuffin' motorway.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

thinking about this subsidy for different vehicle types and country people - give the importance of educating our children we need to subsidise 4x4 fuel as these are needed for the school run and for country people. Someone in the Chelteham paper wrote in saying she needed a 4x4 as she lived "out in the Cotswolds" which I understand is a bit like the Serrengetti with only rough tracks

But without the lions one hopes. Wouldn't want tarquin eaten by a lion.

 

[Profpointy]

But without the lions one hopes. Wouldn't want tarquin eaten by a lion.

loads of wild animals in the country - a fox bit a child once - aledgedly

 

[GrumpyGregry]

loads of wild animals in the country - a fox bit a child once - aledgedly

But if the driver of a VW Fox kills or mains a child that is, of course, acceptable.

 

[MikeG]

.........Pathetic argument. Play the ball not the player or shut up. .........

Charming.

 

[Profpointy]

Mike, are you really saying fuel should be subsidised for residents of the countryside ?

Thus someone commuting 50 miles daily from a village would be OK, but form town to town would not?
Why not cheap beer for country folk ?

 

[GrumpyGregry]

Charming.

Look on it as a yellow card for playing the man.