Cyclist may sue tram firm after rails cause injury after fall

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rosscbrown

New Member
From the Edinburgh Evening News:

"A STUDENT nurse has told how she was saved by her cycle helmet after her bike clipped the Princes Street tram lines and threw her into the middle of traffic.

"Joanna Arendt, 36, was returning home when her wheel jammed in the rails and she was thrown off. She was left with injuries to her arms and legs and only escaped more serious injury after her helmet took the brunt of the impact.
"Doctors cannot even say yet if the Polish woman's arm is broken as the swelling is so bad.

"Now, along with boyfriend Sabar Hussain, a psychiatric nurse, she is considering action against tram firm TIE for failing to alert cyclists to the dangers of tram lines."


You can read the full news report here.

So this should be an interesting court case to follow should the cyclist decide to start such an action.

Now for some commentary from me:

1) "Saved by her cycle helmet" - always makes a good story that. The evidence here is a dent to her helmet. Well that much be the case then.

2) "...threw her into the middle of traffic" - as I understand it she *was* in the middle of traffic. The taxi driver behind was obviously keeping a save distance (as evidenced by the cyclist not getting run over) and thus their was no immediate danger to her life by the incident.

3) "Doctors cannot even say yet if the Polish woman's arm is broken" - she'll probably need some form of evidence beyond a "not sure" medical report if she wants to successfully sue the company. Then again maybe she could make a psych case out of it.

4) "Cycling groups in the Capital have already urged authorities to put up warning signs after a series of accidents, although tram bosses insist a series of awareness-raising exercises have already been carried out." - Let me get this right, this person has been cycling in Edinburgh for six years yet has been completely sheltered from the progress of our wonderful tram project. Possible arguments to test in court i) "Trams, they need tracks? No one told me that." ii) "I didn't know Edinburgh was getting trams, nor do I believe any reasonable person might hold that opinion" or iii) "With all the reports of this tram project being delayed and close to cancelation I really didn't expect for the tram line to be so advanced in the city centre". I'd really quite like a court to decide which statement is most plausible.

5) The cyclist continues, "I think either signs have to be put up to tell other cyclists, or just for [the city] not to have cycling on Princes Street at all." - The cyclist describes herself as a "careful cyclist" but if she didn't notice the shiny metal strips in the road, what the odds she would miss the signs too. As from banning cyclists from the street, that's a bit mad. Cyclists have managed to share the road with trams since trams were first deployed world-wide. Should cyclists be banned from the entire tram route? Special bridges constructed to allow cycling to cross the tram lines in safety.

6) The cyclists's partner adds, "We are very angry about this. It's clearly dangerous for cyclists, especially if it has been raining." - Really, tram lines are clearly dangerous? No need for signs then.

Okay, I'm done. For the sake of balance, some counterpoints:

1) Unlike a functional tram network, the tram lines here do start part way down the road - see here.
2) Further down the line, at tram stops, the planners have added cobbled sections of road (to mark the tram stops). Is adding another complication for cyclists really a good idea?
3) Painted crossing 'lanes' for cyclists would be nice - I often find it difficult to judge the correct approach to the lines when crossing over the road. Still, this would be little help while overtaking buses, etc.

Right, I really am done now. Honest.
 

jimboalee

New Member
Location
Solihull
Pub quiz question.

Which came first, Trams or bicycles?
 

jimboalee

New Member
Location
Solihull
Newsflash.



Edinburgh nurses disciplined for taking mattresses from hospital beds to use as 'Personal Protection Equipment' while riding their bicycles home.
 

marinyork

Resting in suspended Animation
Location
Logopolis
Bicycle – 1817

Tram – 1807.



Case dismissed.

There's the slight point that the tram network was got rid of in many cities very roughly around the 1960s. Tram networks that do exist in UK cities are nowhere near as extensive as they were in the past. One of the problems you can be a cyclist like me and meet tram lines every day of the week or live down the road and rarely ever come across them.
 

marinyork

Resting in suspended Animation
Location
Logopolis
6) The cyclists's partner adds, "We are very angry about this. It's clearly dangerous for cyclists, especially if it has been raining." - Really, tram lines are clearly dangerous? No need for signs then.

You've not done enough riding on tram lines in the wet Ross if you dismiss this, you just plain don't know what you're talking about. I would point you in the direction of an unfortunate accident near here recently where also a report on the dangers of a specific bit of road and cycling have been documented.

Other than that there have been two cycle tram related fatalities here over the years and people have campaigned for safety improvements, I find your comments almost verging on victim blaming.
 

gaz

Cycle Camera TV
Location
South Croydon
I find this quite amusing. How can anyone take her seriously?
Is it the tram companies responsibilty to sort this out? Probably not. Go to the council!!

I hope she recovers quickly
 

slowmotion

Quite dreadful
Location
lost somewhere
How on earth do all those cyclists manage in Amsterdam....
 
Although I sympathise about riding near tram lines as they are horrid (I normally detour a mile or so to avoid them, that bad), this seems to be along the lines of 'I rode into a parked Volvo so am going to sue the car manufacturer'.

By all means, as Gaz suggests, asking the council to put up more warning signs, but directing her anger at the tram company? No way.
 
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rosscbrown

New Member
You've not done enough riding on tram lines in the wet Ross if you dismiss this, you just plain don't know what you're talking about. I would point you in the direction of an unfortunate accident near here recently where also a report on the dangers of a specific bit of road and cycling have been documented.

Other than that there have been two cycle tram related fatalities here over the years and people have campaigned for safety improvements, I find your comments almost verging on victim blaming.


Perhaps I am being too harsh but I do think legal action in this case is somewhat frivolous. My point wasn't specifically directed at the 'in the rain' portion of the quote but rather that tram lines are inherently dangerous and extra care should be taken. I am all too aware that metal surfaces are particularly hazardous in the wet - take those metal studs at pedestrian crossings - I almost came off as a result of one of those yesterday morning. "Death trap when wet" is an intrinsic feature of such road technology and as such shouldn't need a sign...

I don't recall the report suggesting the incident happened in the wet, but I might be mistaken so I'll re-read.
 
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rosscbrown

New Member
I find this quite amusing. How can anyone take her seriously?
Is it the tram companies responsibilty to sort this out? Probably not. Go to the council!!

I hope she recovers quickly

The tram system in Edinburgh is build by a company called "tie" - a fully owned subsidiary of the council. The tram system will eventually be operated by Lothian Buses, again a company owned in its entirety by four local councils.
 

gaz

Cycle Camera TV
Location
South Croydon
The tram system in Edinburgh is build by a company called "tie" - a fully owned subsidiary of the council. The tram system will eventually be operated by Lothian Buses, again a company owned in its entirety by four local councils.
So because tie are owned by the council that means I can ring them about my bins not being collected? I think not. At the end of the day tram tracks are there. If there isn't enough warning of there presence it is up to the council to put up signs or paint something and not the company that manages the tram lines (even if they are owned by the council)
 

marinyork

Resting in suspended Animation
Location
Logopolis
Perhaps I am being too harsh but I do think legal action in this case is somewhat frivolous. My point wasn't specifically directed at the 'in the rain' portion of the quote but rather that tram lines are inherently dangerous and extra care should be taken. I am all too aware that metal surfaces are particularly hazardous in the wet - take those metal studs at pedestrian crossings - I almost came off as a result of one of those yesterday morning. "Death trap when wet" is an intrinsic feature of such road technology and as such shouldn't need a sign...

I don't recall the report suggesting the incident happened in the wet, but I might be mistaken so I'll re-read.

I don't see legal action as that unreasonable. Sure people are responsible for their own risks but if Edinburgh is stupid enough to copy the mistakes made by other tram systems elsewhere then that's their lookout.

Edinburgh as far as I can tell has a system where tarmac is used inbetween the tram lines so they are a lot harder to spot. It's both a blessing and a curse, better grip but harder to spot. I think there should be signs in certain places. There are other safety features one can implement.
 

snorri

Legendary Member
We only have the report from the Edinburgh Evening News to go on, there are various factions at work putting their own slant on both Ednburgh trams, and cycling in Edinburgh, treat all reports with a little suspicion. :huh:
 
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