Good Greg Lemond article

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yenrod

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Lemond questions Armstrong approach
Eurosport - Fri, 10 Oct 21:41:00 2008

Three-time Tour de France winner Greg Lemond has played down the anti-doping efficiency of self-policing by cycling teams - and says Lance Armstrong must do more if he is to prove he is 100 per cent clean.

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Lemond, the first American to win the Tour de France, in 1986, was a strong critic of Armstrong throughout the 37-year-old Texan's seven-year Tour de France reign.

It started over seven years ago when Lemond criticised Armstrong for admitting to working with Italian sports doctor Michele Ferrari, who famously declared that the banned blood booster EPO (erythropoietin) was not dangerous.

Now, Lemond has criticised his fellow champion for trying to be too transparent.

When he makes his comeback at the Tour Down Under in January, 2009, Armstrong will do so alongside anti-doping expert, Don Catlin, whom he has employed in a bid to prove that his performances will be beyond reproach.

Following in the footsteps of such teams as CSC and Garmin-Chipotle, who have similar anti-doping experts working with them, Catlin will put the results of Armstrong's blood values and testosterone/epitestosterone ratio online.

But LeMond believes it is a mixed blessing.

"What they're doing is good, but really that testing has got to be done by an independent group, and not policed from inside," said Lemond.

"What good is self-policing? It's like a wolf guarding a hen house. You've got to have a group with no self-interest. It should be up to a group like WADA."

Lemond says the authorities would get a better idea of who the cheats are if they started analysing such parameters as VO2max and the power output via the hi-tech SRM systems used on bikes, and not just blood and urine samples.

"If anybody read half of what's out there about physiology and how you produce power in aerobic sports... It's very simple."

He added: "There are certain physiologists who could blow the sport apart. But they all earn their living by the sport, too, so they have something to lose, so there's this omerta (code of silence)."

Cycling's doping scandals this past decade can be blamed mainly on the popularity of banned blood booster EPO.

EPO enhances performance by raising the volume of red blood cells in the blood, otherwise known as the haematorcit, thus allowing more oxygen to be pumped to the muscles which in turn can work harder and longer.

Despite efficient anti-EPO tests, Lemond believes athletes can still easily escape being caught using either EPO or (autologous) transfusions of their own blood.

"It's all very well checking blood values. But if you're a smart doctor, you just always keep your rider's blood values high," he added. "EPO is only detectable within a few days, and that's why it's hard to detect it.

"Autologous blood transfusions, however, are not detectable at all - except through a carbon monoxide test, which is something Michael Ashenden (project co-ordinator of the Science and Industry Against Blood Doping) has proposed.

"It tests the volume of haemoglobin (which transports oxygen to the muscles) in the body, and can prove a positive for autologous blood transfusions. That's the kind of testing we must do, along with profiling athletes' natural oxygen intake and watts."

Lemond said another key to checking who is cheating is to analyse the power output, in watts, of cyclists on some of the big climbs.

"Cycling is so black and white when it comes to watts and we can have that data now - it's not a mystery. Last year there were climbers doing 450 watts but weighing 58-60kg - that's nearly 8 watts per kilo," he added.

"That's impossible - unless we've all had some kind of genetic mutation over the past 15 years."

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yenrod

Guest
>Last year there were climbers doing 450 watts but weighing 58-60kg - that's nearly 8 watts per kilo,"

This is what interests me, now, in pro cycling.

Is something other, to be put towards, for this improvement ;)
 
When someone like Lemond talks about performance you have to sit up and take notice. Is he the last uncontentious clean winner?
 

Noodley

Guest
Keith Oates said:
LeMond has had his day, he should now shut up and let the present riders do the talking!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The silence of present day riders is deafening.
 

Keith Oates

Janner
Location
Penarth, Wales
It's their choice. LeMond was instrumental in bringing radios to the peleton, for that alone he stands accused of contributing to the decline of exciting cycle racing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

yello

Guest
Keith Oates said:
LeMond has had his day, he should now shut up and let the present riders do the talking!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Keith, you genuinely surprise me. Greg Lemond is surely entitled to his opinion.
 

Noodley

Guest
Keith Oates said:
It's their choice. LeMond was instrumental in bringing radios to the peleton, for that alone he stands accused of contributing to the decline of exciting cycle racing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hardly good reason to silence his views on doping.

I would also argue that it is not a very free choice which current riders have. Look at what happens to those who have spoken out in the past.
 
Keith Oates said:
LeMond has had his day, he should now shut up and let the present riders do the talking!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So a vehemently anti-doping ex-rider should just shut up and not ask difficult questions? Come on Keith, I never had you down as a sock-puppet for LA.;)
Lemond knows a damn sight more than any of us about rider performance, his comments about wattage are very interesting. We need someone of his standing on the side of the fans and the clean riders.
 

Keith Oates

Janner
Location
Penarth, Wales
Some people are against Armstrong because he is outspoken and doesn't come over as a friendly person, I can accept that. For me whenever I see or hear about LeMond I see red, don't ask me to explain it in detail, it just happens. I think he's just jealous of Armstrong as he has overtaken him as the most successful American stage racer and I thought that going to Armstrongs come back announcement to stir up trouble was 'sick' !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Keith Oates said:
Some people are against Armstrong because he is outspoken and doesn't come over as a friendly person, I can accept that. For me whenever I see or hear about LeMond I see red, don't ask me to explain it in detail, it just happens. I think he's just jealous of Armstrong as he has overtaken him as the most successful American stage racer and I thought that going to Armstrongs come back announcement to stir up trouble was 'sick' !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"All us haterx r jus jelos"....:thumbsdown:
 

yello

Guest
It's odd isn't it? Criticism is so often interpreted as motivated by jealousy. Sometimes maybe it is but not always. I think it's just a lazy way of ducking the point.

Remember John Major's Tory government and their short lived 'politics of envy' tag they tried to pin on every Labour criticism of them? No doubt some back room bod came up with that one.

No, it's possible to be critical and not in the least envious.
 

mondobongo

Über Member
Keith Oates said:
LeMond has had his day, he should now shut up and let the present riders do the talking!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am sure a certain person would love him to shut up and go away.

Green eyes I seriously doubt it Lemond had one of the most exiting wins and IMO none of armstrongs seven come close for drama and exitement. Turning up at the comeback announcement can hardly be described as sick!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Its a free world and of public interest. Just look at armstrongs reaction in the press report if he could have had Greg removed he would of but the media backlash wouldd have shown him as a paranoid bully he does not want that made common knowledge.


Its still classed as spitting in the soup to speak out very few will do it even when they hang up their wheels you hear little.

Chris Boardman is acknowleged as a Mr Clean has probably got one hell of a book in his head but will we ever get to read his Peloton stories I doubt it.
 
Keith Oates said:
Some people are against Armstrong because he is outspoken and doesn't come over as a friendly person, I can accept that. For me whenever I see or hear about LeMond I see red, don't ask me to explain it in detail, it just happens. I think he's just jealous of Armstrong as he has overtaken him as the most successful American stage racer and I thought that going to Armstrongs come back announcement to stir up trouble was 'sick' !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I recall well that Lemond was never popular in his day and I know a lot of people didn't like him. He has this need to be heard and get involved. Nevertherless, there's no questioning his sports physiology knowledge and if you can put your dislike to one side and listen to his words cold, you'd see he speaks sense.
 
mondobongo said:
Its still classed as spitting in the soup to speak out very few will do it even when they hang up their wheels you hear little.

Chris Boardman is acknowleged as a Mr Clean has probably got one hell of a book in his head but will we ever get to read his Peloton stories I doubt it.
Exactly. Which is why, I suspect, that Lemond has been cast as the crazy old uncle of pro-cycling. Any of the other multiple Tour winners talking about doping, other than in the vaguest 'we really must stop this naughty practice' terms? Er, no. A resounding 'no' in fact. Perhaps Lemond is the only one with a clear conscience...
 
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