Killing them softly

screenman

Legendary Member
Ha, many of those receiving the largest payouts of unjust amounts of money are (or normally would be) sitting in the House of Lords.

Interesting isn't it how they reference a Saudi Racehorse owner as the 'wrong un'

Not that I'd support that either



Yours truly been part of a group lobbying for better treatment and support for farmers better, more ecological, and socially just food and farming systems after brexit.

We even stopped the traffic on Westminster Bridge with a shiny John Deere.

At another point we set up a massive lunch outside defra offices demanding a 'place at the table' in negotiations.

We got one ..

Ironically under Gove.
And have since then been part of helping to design this Elms system.

I've even had a fact finding defra delegation come to my farm

Their take away being "We didn't know you could do it like this, and be commercially viable*"

We will see, it's complicated.

The lump sum for farmers exiting is controversial for many reasons.

Depends on what happens to that land.. Create new County farms for new entrants.?? Yes great.
Allow it to become part of enormous mega farms with a few wildflower strips and unsuitable tree planting schemes?

Not so much.

Reducing numbers of livestock isn't a panacea in itself, what kind of stock and where??

The trouble is politicians just like anyone else struggles to ggrasp the complexity of this stuff.

Farming, ecology, climate change food security, the food system itself, tackling food poverty, land access, and so forth are inextricably linked.

Thinking about all these things, all at once is so far removed from the usual departmental silo thinking, that they are struggling to grasp it all at once.

Europe are also in the process of redesigning the Cap recognising all these things.
We could have been part of that.

Anyhoo I've scribed at great length on all this on the Brexit thread and elsewhere.

I'd better get up and go practice what I preach.

View attachment 560955

Just goes to show how misleading a picture can be.

The plod was actually being very friendly, we were having a laugh, but it looks like he's ticking me off..

On the subject of farming subsidies why does Tate&Lyle sit at the top? Always wondered that one. Farming subsidies.org makes interesting reading.
 

mudsticks

Obviously an Aubergine
On the subject of farming subsidies why does Tate&Lyle sit at the top? Always wondered that one. Farming subsidies.org makes interesting reading.
They are a large land holder.
Payment is make on hectarage.

Although I suspect there are far larger recipients of EU area payments, including those large land holding families

But it will be done on a farm by farm or estate by estate basis, so it's not apparent that is all going to one recipient.
 

screenman

Legendary Member
They are a large land holder.
Payment is make on hectarage.

Although I suspect there are far larger recipients of EU area payments, including those large land holding families

But it will be done on a farm by farm or estate by estate basis, so it's not apparent that is all going to one recipient.

I did not know they were such big farmers £1,000,000,000 over the years is a good few quid. I thought they their sugar cane from came an British Sugar from beet.
 

mudsticks

Obviously an Aubergine
Yes British produced sugar comes fro. sugar beet.. Vast acreages of soil grinding beet is grown in the flat lands of the east.

Without the 'hidden subsidy' of low tax diesel on machinery, and inputs, sugar wouldn't be nearly so 'cheap' at point of sale.

Which you might consider a good thing, give the effect of excess sugar, on human health..

A similar thing happens with the ubiquitous 'corn syrup' which expanded the girth of the American population quite considerably

Not sure if the farming outfit is still bound up with the original Tates who made their money in sugar, then went into art appreciation.

Highly possible, but not sure.
 
OP
E

Eziemnaik

Über Member
I read somewhere that one of the reasons Europe can afford more bio or organic farming is that the "dirty" production (ie soy and maize for animal feed) is outsourced to other regions such as Brazil, US or Ukraine (incidentally thats mostly how it has reduced its CO2 emissions - ecported the worst industries).
 

mudsticks

Obviously an Aubergine
I read somewhere that one of the reasons Europe can afford more bio or organic farming is that the "dirty" production (ie soy and maize for animal feed) is outsourced to other regions such as Brazil, US or Ukraine (incidentally thats mostly how it has reduced its CO2 emissions - ecported the worst industries).
Yup we certainly rely on the ghost acres of less developed countries to produce cheap soy for industrialised farming.
But so does the US.

There has been very little support or R&D funding for organic and regenerative farming all in all.
Because agrochemical, and biotech corps such as Bayer (was Monsanto) really don't like it, there's nothing for them to sell to farmers like me.

We're dangerous we produce an abundance of food with contemporary sunlight, methodologies, clever kit, skill sharing with other farmers like us, soil biology, diversity of cropping, which gives ecological pest control.

None of which makes them any profit.

But their lobbyists are well funded, full time, and persistant.

So who gets the listening ear when these matters are discussed??
 
OP
E

Eziemnaik

Über Member
Yup we certainly rely on the ghost acres of less developed countries to produce cheap soy for industrialised farming.
But so does the US.

There has been very little support or R&D funding for organic and regenerative farming all in all.
Because agrochemical, and biotech corps such as Bayer (was Monsanto) really don't like it, there's nothing for them to sell to farmers like me.

We're dangerous we produce an abundance of food with contemporary sunlight, methodologies, clever kit, skill sharing with other farmers like us, soil biology, diversity of cropping, which gives ecological pest control.

None of which makes them any profit.

But their lobbyists are well funded, full time, and persistant.

So who gets the listening ear when these matters are discussed??
Money talks:laugh:
But hopefully there will be more and more people who will choose natural product, skip on the meat a couple of days in a week etc etc.
Obviously it will take time untill a mother of four won't have to choose between 2£ chicken and a 5£ one for Sunday lunch
 

mudsticks

Obviously an Aubergine
Money talks:laugh:
But hopefully there will be more and more people who will choose natural product, skip on the meat a couple of days in a week etc etc.
Obviously it will take time untill a mother of four won't have to choose between 2£ chicken and a 5£ one for Sunday lunch
The consumer / food eating citizen has their part to play for sure.

But it needs to be top down pressure too.

This kind of thing might help concentrate a few minds.

https://www.theguardian.com/law/202...aft-plan-to-criminalise-ecosystem-destruction
 

cookiemonster

Legendary Member
Location
Hong Kong
Without Bees the world's food is farked. :cursing:
Not just bees, any pollinating insect. Alarm bells have already been rung after a long term study in Southern Germany recorded a 60% drop in pollinators.

If they all go, we have 4 years before famine hits the planet as many fruit and veg cannot be pollinated artificially. Chocolate and coffee will be the first to go.
 

stowie

Legendary Member
I read somewhere this is an EU-wide thing.
I don't think so? EU ban is still in place. There have been problems with the ban though, according to some reports. The legislation allows for emergency authorisations of the banned pesticides - I assume the intention being that they can be used in a limited way to solve serious problems which cannot be remedied otherwise. Of course, it appears EU nation states have been authorising emergency use in a rather cavalier way and thus doing an end-run around the ban. One example in the link is authorisation for use with Golf clubs to protect their greens in Denmark. I mean, fark golf. The justification was genius in itself. That use of the pesticide would cause little harm because golf greens are unattractive to bees. Great, so use banned pesticide because the use of the land basically makes it the diversity equivalent of the Sahara.

Anyhow. It sounds like the EU is looking at how the emergency provisions are being used with a view to closing loopholes.

UK news is wall-to-wall COVID with a bit of Brexit and other stuff thrown in (or COVID + Meghan Markle + war-on-woke if you read certain tabloids). A perfect scenario for a government (especially this bunch of daffodils) to slide through a whole bunch of unsavoury legislation.
 
Top Bottom