Contador fails drug test

[yello]

It crossed my mind that trying to find the supplier shouldn't prove too difficult. Whether they'd want to own up to 'cattle doping' is another matter!

 

[rich p]

He has to prove his innocence because the athlete is responsible however the substances got ther. Them's the rules, like it or not.

The meat story is quite frankle utterly laughable and stinks of desperation. I'd be more inclined to believe in his innocence if most of us hadn't had our suspicions over the years and the fact that Sylvain Chavanel is speaking out is indicative of what the peloton think.

 

[philipbh]

If the rumour about the plastics in his blood is true, then that seals the deal for me.
Gutted I spent all that time watch the tour de france - what a waste of time.

Is there the slightest possibility that these plasticisers are also in the bag of a saline drip - assumimg dehyrdration after a stage, would it be normal for a cyclist to be put on a saline drip by a team doctor to aid recovery etc...?

 

[Smokin Joe]

Is there the slightest possibility that these plasticisers are also in the bag of a saline drip - assumimg dehyrdration after a stage, would it be normal for a cyclist to be put on a saline drip by a team doctor to aid recovery etc...?

There is the slightest possibility of any excuse being true. But they've all got an excuse when they're caught, and if the doper's words were taken as gospel you would conclude that doping had died out when they made it illegal in the mid sixties.

 

[philipbh]

There is the slightest possibility of any excuse being true. But they've all got an excuse when they're caught, and if the doper's words were taken as gospel you would conclude that doping had died out when they made it illegal in the mid sixties.

Then AC is off the hook with the plasticiser accusation - but not the clentbuterol

 

[yello]

He has to prove his innocence because the athlete is responsible however the substances got ther. Them's the rules, like it or not.

I appreciate that but it wasn't really the point I was trying to make. Presuppose he IS innocent. Just how is he supposed to prove that? What would be acceptable?

Btw, I'm not offering a defence of Contador but asking a hypothetical question.

 

[snailracer]

=

 

[rich p]

I appreciate that but it wasn't really the point I was trying to make. Presuppose he IS innocent. Just how is he supposed to prove that? What would be acceptable?

Btw, I'm not offering a defence of Contador but asking a hypothetical question.

He can't because he has clenbuterol in his system. He is responsible even if it was accidentally ingested.

 

[oldroadman]

He can't because he has clenbuterol in his system. He is responsible even if it was accidentally ingested.

I've got a longer memory than some - one Malcolm Elliott had an "adverse finding" many years ago for nandrolone. His assertiin that the tiny amount detected was because of using eye drops (in common use in Spain) sold as "Nandrolona" was accepted. The name might have provided a clue....
Move on to today, labs can detect really tiny amounts of almost any metabolite you want to trace if you know the profile to look for. AC is in a spot, but why would he use the stuff (which has zero benefit at the concentrations found) in the middle of the TdF KNOWING he would get tested, as the race leader, every day? It make no sense. The question remains, where did it come from, was there some sample contamination, and why does a lab report a concentration 40 times less than WADA actually think is detectable. Smacks of desparation to find something, anything, by someone?
I don't condone the possible "offence", but it all sounds very strange.

 

[yello]

I know the rules say that if it's there then it's his responsibility, I'm not questioning the rules. My questions are more this;

People are asking him to prove his innocence. Realistically, how does he do that when the rule says he's guilty? Does he have to show that the rule is wrong too? How does he do that? Set up his own lab and get it accredited? Show the clenbuterol DID come from a doped cow? Or somewhere else? What's he got to do? I'm not saying the science is wrong, just the interpretation of it could be questioned.

The zero tolerance nature of the rule assumes that the only reason for the presence of clenbuterol is performance enhancing. That assumption might be wrong.

Assume he did not dope, intentionally or otherwise. Assume he has genuinely no idea what-so-ever where the clenbuterol came from, has always trained and prepared 'clean', not taken any pharmaceuticals (permitted or otherwise) that might give cause for concern. He's done everything by the book in the right and proper manner. Then comes this positive; bang, out of the blue. He KNOWS he's innocent. He knows that this 'zero tolerance' rule will wrongly end his career. HOW does he prove that?

It just seems stacked against someone who is genuinely innocent to prove their innocence.

 

[philipbh]

He can't because he has clenbuterol in his system. He is responsible even if it was accidentally ingested.

Reasonable doubt though...

1. History of clenbuterol in spanish meat
2. -ve tests either side of the "meat gate"
3. testimony from Jose Luis Lopez Cerron that he bought the meat for the team
4. testimony from the buccher that sold it

As mentioned before - its going to be hard to get testimony from the cattle farmer that he is using a banned substance in the rearing of his animals

5. Precedent from other athletes that have tested positive, but had their sanctions reduced due to mitigating circumstances

Hard to see how AC will escape a any sort of ban and just get a reprimand (though that is a possibility under the WADA rules)

 

[dellzeqq]

http://uk.eurosport....s/article/1186/

Look at this from a different angle. Thirty years ago there was a 'farm gate' trade in 'growth promoters' in the UK. 20kg bags of the stuff.....I'm told that this is now a thing of the past.

It may be that there is still a farm gate trade in Spain.

Now I've never been a fan of Contador. If he were to be found guilty of the cleverest doping scam that there has ever been I'd get over the shock in less than a second. But in this case the amount is so tiny that it puts me in mind of the cocaine which is apparently on every dollar bill in the US

 

[philipbh]

http://uk.eurosport....s/article/1186/

Look at this from a different angle. Thirty years ago there was a 'farm gate' trade in 'growth promoters' in the UK. 20kg bags of the stuff.....I'm told that this is now a thing of the past.

It may be that there is still a farm gate trade in Spain.

Now I've never been a fan of Contador. If he were to be found guilty of the cleverest doping scam that there has ever been I'd get over the shock in less than a second. But in this case the amount is so tiny that it puts me in mind of the cocaine which is apparently on every dollar bill in the US

In the eyes of WADA - Clenbuterol is, as Clentbuterol does - so he has a case to answer whatever the level

Looks like his goose is cooked !

(Cocaine: also every £10 note in circulation in the UK - so much so that the Forensic Science Service have stopped testing for it)

 

[andrew_s]

I can see him getting off with the clenbuterol (CB) if the blood bag plasticisers amount to nothing.

On the face of it, the contaminated meat story is plausible.
People have taken in far higher levels of CB from contaminated meat in the past, sufficient to send them to hospital with overdose symptoms. The use of CB is illegal, but it's known to continue.
Meat is "normal food". It doesn't have a list of ingredients that can be checked against the banned list, and if Contador went to the civil courts they would be very likely to find that it would be unreasonable to expect him to be able to detect and avoid any contaminated products. Losing the case could put the UCI (or WADA) into severe financial difficulties, and unlike Li Fuyu (Radioshack), Contador could afford to fight.

If the DEHP plasticiser levels mirror the clenbuterol levels (low for 2 days, high on the rest day, declining the next 3 days), then he could probably be successfully banned for transfusion. If they don't, they will either negotiate a short winter ban or accept the excuse.

 

[Bill Gates]

Assume he did not dope, intentionally or otherwise. Assume he has genuinely no idea what-so-ever where the clenbuterol came from, has always trained and prepared 'clean', not taken any pharmaceuticals (permitted or otherwise) that might give cause for concern. He's done everything by the book in the right and proper manner. Then comes this positive; bang, out of the blue. He KNOWS he's innocent. He knows that this 'zero tolerance' rule will wrongly end his career. HOW does he prove that?

If I was really innocent I would fund my own lie detector test. OK it doesn't hold up in a court of law but in the court of public opinion it would be extremely credible.