Cyclists Beware: The cancer is spreading

[Spiderweb]

Wow, where? I've almost never seen it except where there's a marked lane.

The problem is that lorry operators should be replacing the low-visibility cabs with direct-vision ones ASAP, not wasting money putting lipstick on a pig like this and effectively telling their drivers to ignore Highway Code Rules 151, 167, 182, 183 and probably more.

I think I've only once seen it once in North Yorkshire but I've have seen it many times whilst driving elsewhere. The last time was in Kent when a peloton of cyclists obviously riding together both undertook and overtook a HGV at the same time.
This mindless behaviour gives cyclists a bad name.

 

[Drago]

I've no objection to "only a chump undertakes a large vehicle stickers", but do feel there should be corresponding decals in the cabs about cutting up cyclists.

 

[mjr]

[QUOTE 4495368, member: 259"]Honestly, I think you're being a bit paranoid.[/QUOTE]
Be that as it may, VVN is not a cycling organisation as claimed earlier.

 

[keithmac]

Even if it makes a few more people think then the stickers are a good thing!.

I can see that Lorry Drivers genuinely have a restricted vision especially for cyclists on their inside. It is poor truck cab design.

For me if the lorry is not stationary I will hang back, and I make sure the driver has seen me when filtering past even when it's stopped.

I see people pass on the inside of lorries and big skip wagons without a care in the world, shudder to think what would happen if they tapped the kerb with a wheel and fell under the wheels (even 10mph would be bad enough).

Same again, if the lorry is at the front of a line of traffic stopped at the lights, I would wait behind as the driver would just have to overtake me again putting both of us both in an avoidable situation..

 

[mjr]

[QUOTE 4495415, member: 259"]No, it's a organisation that promotes safety for all road users including cyclists and pedestrians and has been siince it was founded.[/QUOTE]
Yes, but it's the same failed concept of "safety for all" as over here. VVN are one of the few organisations to support attempts to promote cycle helmets in the Netherlands. They do not understand cycling safety and I suggest they and the speeding motorists they've historically employed do not have cycling's best interests at heart.

[QUOTE 4495433, member: 259"]The Fietsersbond, of which I've been a member for years, has never opposed these stickers as far as I know,a lthough they're as keen as mustard on stuff like driver education and removing vehicle blind spots.[/QUOTE]
Equally, have they ever supported them? It's not a surprise if London led the way in these disgraceful victim-blaming stickers.

 

[Markymark]

Even if it makes a few more people think then the stickers are a good thing!.

I can see that Lorry Drivers genuinely have a restricted vision especially for cyclists on their inside. It is poor truck cab design.

For me if the lorry is not stationary I will hang back, and I make sure the driver has seen me when filtering past even when it's stopped.

I see people pass on the inside of lorries and big skip wagons without a care in the world, shudder to think what would happen if they tapped the kerb with a wheel and fell under the wheels (even 10mph would be bad enough).

Same again, if the lorry is at the front of a line of traffic stopped at the lights, I would wait behind as the driver would just have to overtake me again putting both of us both in an avoidable situation..

All sensible stuff. However it has happened before that a lorry overtakes a cyclist and turns left in front of them poiting to the sticker which they think allows them to do this.

 

[keithmac]

All sensible stuff. However it has happened before that a lorry overtakes a cyclist and turns left in front of them poiting to the sticker which they think allows them to do this.

That's a different kettle of fish altogether and just bad driving!..

 

[mjr]

[QUOTE 4495472, member: 259"]Nope, they are completely opposed to compulsory helmets. [/quote]
I said they endorse helmet promotion and that says " Veilig Verkeer Nederland is voorstander van het vrijwillige gebruik van fietshelmen"! (VVN is in favour of free-willed use of cycle helmets) - which is absurd when the same page also says "Ervaringen in het buitenland (Australië) tonen aan, dat een helmdraagplicht tot gevolg heeft dat het fietsgebruik afneemt."

I suspect they're only against compulsion until they get enough mugs to free-willingly (voluntarily, perhaps?) use them.

[QUOTE 4495472, member: 259"]What do you mean by "They do not understand cycling safety"?[/QUOTE]
Exactly what I wrote. https://vvn.nl/standpunten/fietsen seems to omit conspicuously most ideas of doing anything to tackle bad motoring directly. It even opens with the old chestnut that people cycle because they can't drive and some of the infrastructure ideas seem surprising until you realise that things like multi-stage crossings and roundabouts instead of lights benefit motorists more than cyclists.

 

[Markymark]

That's a different kettle of fish altogether and just bad driving!..

Reinforced by stupid stickers.

 

[keithmac]

Sticker's null and void at that point though..

 

[EnPassant]

I've no objection to "only a chump undertakes a large vehicle stickers", but do feel there should be corresponding decals in the cabs about cutting up cyclists.

Yebbut, that could be interpreted as accepting that some of the responsibility rests with their driver. (and would cost 4 quid not 2 ), I'm not holding my breath.
I know I've already said it's victim blaming, but that's the reason for these things, not some altruistic wish to educate cyclists, they couldn't give a stuff until they wind up in court or lose money with a driver not working.

 

[mjr]

[QUOTE 4495536, member: 259"]The VVN is not a 'get of my way' road safety organisation. It's a road safety organisation for all users of the road, including pedestrians and cyclists. If you have any evidence proving otherwise (other than people having stand down because of speeding tickets) then I would be interested to hear it.[/QUOTE]
Anyone interested can browse their website, especially the links above about cycling and being in favour of use of cycle helmets. Likewise, I'd be happy to see any evidence that VVN actually understand cycling safety and aren't preoccupied with getting other road users out of the way of incompetent motorists, or that any cycling safety organisation is involved with those dodgy stickers.

 

[steveindenmark]

I see it a heck of a lot in London. If you think that cyclists do not undertake lorries (and other vehicles) then you are leading a very sheltered cycling life.

I myself have lost count at the number of times that I have had to yell at other cyclists not to undertake left turning vehicles on my commute over the years.

This guy was so clever he had to have 2 bites of the cherry.

Undertaking lorries the same as viz vests or helmets. Its personal choice. You cant tell people that they are good or bad. They have to make their own decisions. Im happy to let them. I wouldnt be going down that gap. Im never in that much of a rush to kill myself

 

[srw]

Mmm.......on the one hand big lorries shouldn't go cutting across and driving into cyclists which is the key problem, but yes, there are some daft cyclists who undertake lorries.

Provide that lorry drivers still get proper instruction about their driving standards to deal with being around cyclists, and more importantly, there's still pressure brought on them to have better designed cabs, so they can see out better, then the stickers on the back don't really matter. Hopefully the majority of cyclists don't undertake, but if it stops even just one person doing it, because they'd not thought about the issues before, then that's good. But in the same way a car driver decides to jump a red light, so certain people will ignore a sticker.

Quite. It's basic psychology - "We've done our little bit to help educate cyclists in roadcraft. Now what are you, the owners, drivers and designers of these killing machines going to do in return that's meaningful?"

 

[GrumpyGregry]

I see a lot of people in Hull going on the insides of lorries, buses, dustcarts etc. Some get very annoyed when I am stopped being such a vehicle and they're intent on getting by it (on the inside) to go into the ASZ (or worse, through the red light).

Many Hull cyclists are commuters, who do few miles a week and are not as competent as some here. If the stickers make them think and stop them putting themselves in danger, they're doing a job regardless of who they're really trying to save.

When I stop behind ANY vehicle I do it in primary, or secondary, and leave loads of room for lemmings to go up the inside. It isn't my role to be a road safety road block to other people on bikes. As a result no other people on bikes get annoyed with me when I stop on the road behind a motor vehicle.