LBS been greedy

[roubaixtuesday]

My LBS used to Price match Sigma, wiggle or who ever really. They’re charging £50 more for an 840 than Sigma. Now I’m all pro support your LBS but £50 is £50 which is a lot in these tough times. Screw those guys I’ve spent thousands over the last 5 years with them. I don’t blame people for shopping around on the internet. The LBS is making loads of money with the workshop always fully booked out at £30 p/h. They sell a lot of E-bikes at 5 to 8 grand a pop. Have their own warehouse. For what they’re charging you could get the higher model for almost the same price online.

Bye.

You want personal service with Internet prices.

You can't have it.

Bye.

 

[bikingdad90]

My LBS Paul Curran Cycle Sports is fab. The guy has a passion for bikes and I believe even builds wheels for Planet X, or used to atleast! He doesn’t sell bikes or frames just parts, some clothing and trades mainly off service work.

Top notch guy and my go to place.

 

[presta]

When I converted from 8 to 9 speed I needed a complete new transmission, and it was about 30% cheaper to buy it from Roseversand in Germany than online in the UK. I'm wondering whether bikes in the UK are a bit like cars used to be: a lot more expensive here than on the continent.

BIL involved in an LBS in Newark. Tells the same Thinks it’s come about because they ramped up manufacturing during the COVID cycling boom and then had massive overstock when it all collapsed afterwards

During the pandemic my local branch of Cycles UK put a sign on the door saying that they were closing until further notice whilst they process all their online orders. The shop was stacked from floor to ceiling with bikes crates, with no room to get a customer in, let alone display a bike.

an independent can buy all the bits they need to make a bike at the same level as say a Trek or Specialized

They can, but they don't have the economies of scale, so they won't be competitive. They'll be reducing their market to customers who are willing to pay extra for a custom built bike, which are few and far between.

 

[bonzobanana]

I don't use a LBS for servicing and repairs as do my own repairs etc and I'm not surprised by the high prices of my local independent bike shops. I buy my parts from the cheapest suppliers. I don't owe a LBS a living and he doesn't have to supply me with competitively priced bike parts. I went into a bike shop in Weymouth a few years ago for a very minor part that was about £1 including delivery on ebay, as it would fit in a small envelope but the local bike shop wanted something like £3-5 which I refused and felt a bit awkward about. I don't even ask nowadays sadly. I browse bike shops just to see the latest bikes but never consider buying anything there.

Ultimately those who need local repair and servicing obviously need to keep these businesses going but those who do their own maintenance don't. I always try to avoid any bikes or ebikes with proprietary tech which makes you reliant on your local bike shop. I would never even consider a Bosch based ebike or a frame reliant on consumable bushings or a Trek with some sort of crappy headtube suspension. I'm just not interested in that short life landfill type products where either there is no support in a few years or its just becomes not economically viable to spend huge money on a heavily worn bike.

 

[Aescott]

Posted on another thread about getting a new carbon frame MTB from a local shop. Shop contacted me this week to say that the bike was in but the top tube was scratched. Said that they could get it repaired and give me money off, but that the6 would get a new bike in quicker. Saw the bike today. Scratch not bad, but obvious. Both members of staff in the shop advised that, if it was yhier bike, they’d ask for a new one.

No idea if the big shops do that, but happy to support the small guys.

 

[Milzy]

You want personal service with Internet prices.

You can't have it.

Bye.

They used to give it. They expanded and have since changed

 

[FishFright]

Good morning,

I suspect that the reason they are fully booked is that at £30/hour it is a bargain ...... if you want or need to have someone to do the work. :-)

For a retired person with a pension running a "hobby business" that is a decent income but for an LBS that is a Service To The Customer rate, they are to be applauded for it, provided that they are not doing it to drive the competition out of business.


I get the fact that a McDonalds burger outlet is pretty much guaranteed to succeed whereas being an independent burger outlet is much harder, so selling a brand is at first glance a safe bet, but why are they selling such bikes rather than assembling their own?

At every level except the very, very top an independent can buy all the bits they need to make a bike at the same level as say a Trek or Specialized. Yes, this does require commitment of both capital and time but if the retalier is not making this commitment what does he have to offer other than a lower price? It could be customer service, but is that likely if they have already shown a lack of interest in assembling thier own bikes?

Ribble for example did it for years before deciding to sell up to new owners who are trying to make it a brand, Dolan do fine, as do SPA and SJS so there are bound to be plenty of others.

Once you get into assembling your own bikes not only can you sell the customer exactly what they want, you start to hold in stock items that a customer who already has a bike wants and it becomes harder to compare prices as the specs are not the same.

I like 8 speed yet nowadays pretty much the only way to get a new fully assembled bike would be to buy a bottom of the range machine, yet for many people 8 speed is the tipping point between cost, reliabilty and usefulness.

I'm commuting on a 10 speed and resent the fact that I need a new chain every 8 weeks, given the cost of 10 speed chains and cassettes going mail order is very enticing. Had a local shop offered me what I wanted bikewise then I would have bought the bike and the consumables from them, but as I didn't get what I wanted locally bikewise I see now reason to pay full RRP for consumables from a shop that does stock the bike that I wanted.

Bye

Ian

8 weeks per chain ? Is it bad for sand around your way ? I commuted for a year on a 1x 10 speed set up and replaced the chain once

 

[Dogtrousers]

They’re charging £50 more for an 840 than Sigma.

What do you mean by an "840"? A Garmin Edge 840? Or is there something else called 840?

An Edge 840 is about £450 btw.

 

[Beebo]

Price matching Wiggle is never going to be a good business model, as can be seen from looking at Wiggle. Who couldn’t make it work even with huge economies of scale.
So an LBS has two choices, price match a doomed Wiggle business model and go bust or charge a bit more, annoy the customer who shops elsewhere, then go bust.
Hobson’s choice really.

 

[Punkawallah]

That pink hairy dangly thing between my legs? It's my sporran.

That’s not what it said on the Restraining Order . . .

 

[Slick]

8 weeks per chain ? Is it bad for sand around your way ? I commuted for a year on a 1x 10 speed set up and replaced the chain once

That's what I thought, but reading other threads I think its an ebike which is also assumed would last longer.

 

[Illaveago]

It is interesting reading. We have a friend who used to own a cycle shop in the 60's to late 70's. I asked her about the bikes they sold and how they paid for them . A lot of them were on a sale or return basis from the manufacturers. They sold Raleigh , Falcon and Dawes. They also sold toys as well. I suppose as well as an income it might help promote sales in that someone might see a nice bike which interests them whilst buying something else.

 

[IanSmithCSE]

Good morning,

8 weeks per chain ? Is it bad for sand around your way ? I commuted for a year on a 1x 10 speed set up and replaced the chain once

That's what I thought, but reading other threads I think its an ebike which is also assumed would last longer.

8 weeks was normal for my Jamis which was human powered only and Ultegra Di2. I mention the Di2 bit because I found that I changed front ring much more often than I do with a mechanical front shifter and the chain bending that front ring shifts inflict aren't that friendly to the chain.

I have only had the ebike for 9 weeks so am only on my second chain.

I am not aware that the roads I ride are especially salty/sandy etc but I ride in all weathers and am quite happy to cross chain big ring and second largest sprocket which is also chain unfriendly.

When I first started out with 10 speed I was surprised by chain life but the web seems to be full of people saying that get a similar 1,500 miles out a chain, along with plenty of others who get much longer.

I see that @FishFright has a 1x10 and this goes to the point about selling what a customer wants/needs, I could easily ride with a 1x10 but I would find it much harder to buy one especially in eBike format. When I bought the Jamis 1x was still mostly a mountain bike format and I wanted to try Di2 and carbon fibre frames so 2x10 was the only choice, possibly 2x11 had just come out.

......they can, but they don't have the economies of scale.......

True but they also don't have the diseconomies of scale either, no Vice President Global Sales, Deputy Vice President Global UK Sales, Senior Sales - UK, etc.

After all it's not as if the big brands actually make anything.

An independent couldn't compete against something like a Halford Apollo Paradox road bike, it is staggeringly good value for money at £230 for a 2x7 drop bars road bike, but a competing against a Boradman SLR 8.8 at £875 (£700 on "sale") is pefectly achieveable.

An independent may have to be a few squid more than this, but he can also say wouldn't you rather have a Tiagra chainset to match the gears rather than a FSA one?

Actually making things is hard, Bob Jackson closed down but they had bearded guys welding tubes together and that is indeed a niche market, but £750-£1,500 bikes are now mainstream and who wants to be selling £250 bikes? The margins are always going to be terrible, the customers will want more than they paid for and it takes a lot of space to keep the quantity that you would need to shift.

In Worcester we used to have a bike shop that sold all sorts of bikes and over the years it kept going down market and ended up with nothing over £150 by the time it closed down. But they were not into customer service and not surprisingly it couldn't generate the volumes to survive on such low value sales and lack of repeat consumable purchases.

If you want to sell tyres at £30 when Halfords are selling that at £25 and the internet £20 then you need the loyalty that comes from having sold the bike the customer wanted. I looked at the Specialized Diverge when it first came out (2014?) and the young Saturday sales assistent really didn't get why I thought £999 for the Sora version was a really silly price.

Bye

Ian

 

[bonzobanana]

That's what I thought, but reading other threads I think its an ebike which is also assumed would last longer.

Hub motor ebikes massively extend the life of the drivetrain including chain because they work independently of the drivetrain so hill climbing is far easier on the drivetrain but mid-drive motors massively shorten the life of the drivetrain because both the motor's power and cyclists power go through the chain. Of course there are many variables regarding the weight of rider, how powerful the mid-drive motor is, where you ride and how you use your gears etc. Chain snaps for example are a common issue on mid-drive ebikes but rarer than standard bikes on a hub motor ebike. It's one of the key differences between mid-drive and hub motor ebikes and makes hub motors typically the better choice for people doing high miles, commuting etc especially as hub motors are typically more reliable than mid-drive motors too due to their simpler engineering and repairs are easier and cheaper too.

 

[Dogtrousers]

A while back I replaced my entire drive train and some other bits like brake cables. I say "I" replaced, but of course I got the LBS to do the grunt work. In that case they were happy to price match the internet for the components as they were fitting them.

I thought that was very reasonable, but I'd never expect them to price match things if they weren't getting something else out of it.