Probably been asked a thousand times but....

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StuartG

slower but no further
Location
SE London
[QUOTE 2683505, member: 45"]No-one has suggested that mirrors improve hearing. That's silly.[/quote]
Sorry to jump in but I find the need for this discussion quite sick. However I would be very willing to discuss it further in an alley somewhere at night. Only the deaf will be spared the screams.

The lack of a sense is a serious impairment. It increases risks to individuals. That's why we give blind people dogs and white sticks so they can use the streets freely. We don't allow them to become airline pilots 'cos not seeing the runway might be fatal to the two hundred folks behind. Its when we stop them being in the two hundred behind that trouble starts. That actually happens with deaf people. A certain airline refuses to fly a group because "they won't hear the emergency announcements". Yep, right but if they are prepared to take the risk should they be deprived of going on holiday together?

And so returning reluctantly to this debate. Not hearing is a serious issue for deaf cyclists. It is compensated to some extent by enhanced visual awareness which we hearing people do not develop. The threat is one they can choose themselves and it applies almost exclusively to themselves. A cyclist's threat of causing a KSI to other road users through not hearing is vanishingly small. The car is a more visual environment (mirrors) and the balance of benefit/disbenefit probably tilts the other way. You may have less to fear from deaf driver than a hearing one.

Of course we could just lock the blind, deaf and immobile in institutions and throw away the key. It would prevent the continual need to repeat the arguments above.
 

tmesis

Active Member
Location
Derbyshire
I've always worn earphones when out on my own (just cheap, tiny in-ear ones) and have never been surprised by a vehicle coming from behind that I hadn't heard due to them. The wind whistling in my ears is far louder and distracting, with or without the earphones.
 
Simply put....

One group (cyclists) decide to impair their hearing by using headphones

One group (motorists) decide to impair their hearing to a similar extent by closing their windows.

It is either safe to impair hearing in which case both are acceptable, or unsafe and both are unacceptable.

The number of mirrors is a flourrescently red herring......
 
Disability is a totally different aspect, and individually asessed

Can a blind person drive?

The answer is yes they can

It is entirely possible to be regstered as blind yet drive a vehicle legally

The field of vision and which parts of that field are impaired will lead to a decision as to whether driving is allowed.

Equally a hearing impaired person can be a cyclist with little or no issue.

Richard Ballantine (Author, activist, advocate for cycling and someone who pioneered many of today's accepted practices) was profoundly deaf from birth
 

sazzaa

Guest
Simply put....

One group (cyclists) decide to impair their hearing by using headphones

One group (motorists) decide to impair their hearing to a similar extent by closing their windows.

It is either safe to impair hearing in which case both are acceptable, or unsafe and both are unacceptable.

The number of mirrors is a flourrescently red herring......

So the vulnerability of the road user doesn't come into this at all? You really believe it's a fair comparison with regards to safety?
 
So the vulnerability of the road user doesn't come into this at all? You really believe it's a fair comparison with regards to safety?

Taking the vulnerability into account would surely mean that the driver compromising their hearing is the greater threat and therefore more unacceptable?
 

booze and cake

probably out cycling
To say riding with headphones automatically makes you dangerous is bull and I find it as annoying as the 'you should be wearing a helmet' argument. Unfortunately if you are involved in any incident you can bet the first thing that will be mentioned will be the fact you had headphones in, as often is the fact you were'nt wearing a helmet, even if these have no bearing and the incident was entirely the fault of the driver. Drivers far too often use it as a deflection tactic to steer attention away from their god awful driving.

I always ride with music and its second nature now and I feel lost without it. Some people like it, some don't, end of. I do most of my riding solo, including centuaries and its a great accompanyment to the journey, some thumping dance music goes really well if I'm feeling like a fast ride.

I've cycled in London for over 15 years without any music playing related incident (its not so loud I can't hear sirens) but when I'm out in the single lane county roads with blind corners I pause it or stop it so I can hear advancing traffic before I can see it. Otherwise, play that funky music white boy......and sheesh anything to blot out the din of the great british public, most of which I have no interest in hearing anyway.
 
[QUOTE 2684906, member: 45"]That's more like it, you're considering more elements of the assessment.

Risk to? Risk from? What risk? When and where? Physical factors?[/quote]

The part that mirrors play in the hearing of the motorist.....
 
Lets play the games...

Common everyday occurrence..

A cyclist is proceeding toward a junction, they are on a main road, and there is a side road joining with a "Stop" line.

A vehicle is approaching the stop line, and should stop. The motorist takes a cursory glance and fails to register the cyclist, and a few feet in front of them starts to pull out.

The cyclist uses the bell to warn the motorist of their presence........

Which motorist will hear the bell better and register the cyclist approaching from their left and stop in time to allow the cyclist to pass the junction without taking evasive action?

a. the one with compromised hearing because the windows are shut ?
b. the one with the greater hearing because the windows are down?
c. The one looking in the three rear view mirrors?
 

Roadrider48

Voice of the people
Location
Londonistan
[QUOTE 2680047, member: 45"]It's not really an equal comparison, is it?[/quote]
I agree with you mister p. IMO totally irrelevant to the topic in hand.
 

Roadrider48

Voice of the people
Location
Londonistan
Disability is a totally different aspect, and individually asessed

Can a blind person drive?

The answer is yes they can

It is entirely possible to be regstered as blind yet drive a vehicle legally

The field of vision and which parts of that field are impaired will lead to a decision as to whether driving is allowed.

Equally a hearing impaired person can be a cyclist with little or no issue.

Richard Ballantine (Author, activist, advocate for cycling and someone who pioneered many of today's accepted practices) was profoundly deaf from birth
Are you seriously comparing deaf people to blind people? Wow!
 
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