Are there any simpler cars around now?

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We've sold our van so new main family car time. I like Kia Sportage, other half likes simple and easier to repair like the Dacia duster. IMHO there's no such thing as simple and easier to repair these days so you might as well get something decent over basic.

Anyone know of there is a simple and easy to repair car these days? In the small family car territory like these two options.

Also, any view on those two car options? I'm thinking 3 star EURO NCAP rating of the duster rules it out for me. Years ago I read that a 5 star hitting a 3 star head on and the 5 star could end up walking away, but the 3 star occupants get cut out. Obviously not at high speeds but say town speeds I guess. Anyway would you ever consider such a low rating when your money gets something higher treated for safety?
 

gbb

Squire
Location
Peterborough
Am I right in thinking the NCAP ratings are broken down into different areas, an NCAP 3 MAY have the same collision rating as an NCAP 5 but NCAP 5 will have other safety features such as collision avoidance etc etc.

I may be quite wrong ..just thinking out loud
 
OP
OP
T

Time Waster

Veteran
Well is it better to have a higher collision avoidance or collision rating? Imagine a 3 in avoidance hits another vehicle but a 5 avoids it, which is better? Of course what if the 5 rated avoidance cannot help you to avoid the other vehicle? Would a 3 in collision then be worse when the avoidance could mean the hit is less severe than a 3 car in avoidance? I am thinking aloud.

Personally I do wonder if there iss enough research into that such that you could separate them. It would mean so many variables and implications that they simply do not see the way to do it conclusively. I also doubt there is aa distinction. Safety features are like a whole system. Could you have a 5 star rated system with sub 5 star in any of the test categories or criteria anyway?

Come to think about it, a ford main dealer saleswoman once told me that the focus platform SUV came out with a new model and it dropped from 5 to 4 or 3. She told me that the reason was the lack of electronic drivers aids which I assume are the collision avoidance features. It was back when they were starting to come in as standard in new models and just after the EURO NCAP system changed to take into account the drivers aids. There were 5 star cars out there being driven around under the old system that would not even make 3 star in the new system this saleswoman told me. The best a car could get was 3 star without aids.

So I think it is likely that the duster is a solid car that in a collision is liekly to do ok to a point but it really does not help you to prevent a collision hence the 3 star. If you are a good driver anyway, does that mean the 3 star duster is good enough? I do not know but I must admit with safety I think that you cannot do too much to help it so a 5 star is a huge selling point to me. For example, you'll never see me in a citreon diane where the crumple zone includes the driver and all passengers!!!! :laugh:
 
OP
OP
T

Time Waster

Veteran
Am I right in thinking the NCAP ratings are broken down into different areas, an NCAP 3 MAY have the same collision rating as an NCAP 5 but NCAP 5 will have other safety features such as collision avoidance etc etc.

I may be quite wrong ..just thinking out loud

A good point to think on, it has got me thinking, hence the post above.

Ultimately car buying is about sorting out your priorities. Safety has to be right up there for most family buyers I reckon, but behind price, performance and perhaps space in the vehicle for passengers / luggage.
 

CXRAndy

Guru
Location
Lincs
Get a normally aspirated petrol car for simplicity. Get one with cam chain not wet belt system

Many modern vehicles use timing chains instead of wet timing belts (belt-in-oil systems) due to the durability and lower maintenance requirements of chains. Timing chains are made of metal, typically last the life of the engine with proper maintenance, and are lubricated by engine oil within a sealed environment. Wet belts, while also lubricated by oil, are rubber-based and have faced criticism for premature wear and complex replacement procedures in some models.Below is a list of modern vehicles (post-2010 models, focusing on 2020 and newer where possible) that are known to use timing chains instead of wet belts or traditional timing belts, based on available information. Note that engine configurations vary by market, model year, and specific engine type, so always consult the vehicle’s owner’s manual or a trusted mechanic to confirm. I’ve prioritized manufacturers and models commonly associated with timing chains and excluded those known to use wet belts (e.g., certain Ford EcoBoost, Peugeot/Citroën PureTech, or VW TSI engines).Manufacturers and Models with Timing ChainsThe following brands and models are known to use timing chains in many of their engines, particularly in petrol (gasoline) and diesel variants, as of recent model years:ToyotaToyota is renowned for using timing chains in most of its modern engines, especially in petrol models, which are designed to be maintenance-free for the engine’s life.Corolla (1.8L, 2.0L petrol, hybrid engines; e.g., 2020–2025 models)Camry (2.5L, 3.5L V6 petrol, hybrid; e.g., 2020–2025)RAV4 (2.5L petrol, hybrid; e.g., 2020–2025)Highlander (2.5L hybrid, 3.5L V6; e.g., 2020–2025)Yaris (1.0L, 1.5L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Land Cruiser (4.0L V6 petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Prius (1.8L, 2.0L hybrid; e.g., 2020–2025) Note: Some older Toyota diesel engines (e.g., 2.2L D-4D in pre-2015 models) may use belts, but newer petrol and hybrid engines are chain-driven.HondaHonda predominantly uses timing chains in its modern petrol engines for reliability.Civic (1.5L turbo, 2.0L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Accord (1.5L turbo, 2.0L hybrid; e.g., 2020–2025)CR-V (1.5L turbo, 2.0L hybrid; e.g., 2020–2025)Pilot (3.5L V6; e.g., 2020–2025)HR-V (1.5L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025) Note: Honda’s i-DTEC diesel engines (e.g., 1.6L in some markets) may use timing belts, so verify for diesel models.SubaruSubaru’s boxer engines typically use timing chains, especially in petrol models.Forester (2.5L, 2.0L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Outback (2.5L, 2.4L turbo petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Impreza (2.0L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)WRX (2.4L turbo; e.g., 2020–2025)BRZ (2.4L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025, shared with Toyota GR86) Note: Subaru’s 2.0L diesel boxer engine (2008–2018) used a timing chain, but diesel availability is limited in newer models.MazdaMazda’s Skyactiv engines generally use timing chains for petrol and diesel variants.Mazda3 (2.0L, 2.5L Skyactiv-G petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Mazda6 (2.5L Skyactiv-G petrol; e.g., 2020–2021, discontinued in some markets)CX-5 (2.0L, 2.5L Skyactiv-G petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)CX-30 (2.0L, 2.5L Skyactiv-G petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)CX-90 (3.3L inline-6 turbo petrol; e.g., 2023–2025)Skyactiv-D diesel (2.2L in some markets; e.g., CX-5, 2020–2025) Note: Mazda’s newer inline-6 engines (e.g., in CX-90) also use chains, reinforcing their preference for this setup.BMWBMW uses timing chains in most of its petrol and diesel engines, though some older models had chain issues (e.g., N47 diesel).3 Series (2.0L B48 petrol, 3.0L B58 inline-6; e.g., 2020–2025)5 Series (2.0L, 3.0L petrol, 2.0L diesel; e.g., 2020–2025)X3 (2.0L, 3.0L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)X5 (3.0L inline-6, 4.4L V8; e.g., 2020–2025)M models (e.g., M3, M4 with 3.0L S58; 2020–2025) Note: BMW’s timing chains are generally reliable in newer models (post-2015), but regular oil changes are critical to prevent wear.Mercedes-BenzMercedes-Benz typically equips its engines with timing chains, especially in larger-displacement or performance models.C-Class (1.5L, 2.0L M264 petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)E-Class (2.0L petrol, 3.0L inline-6; e.g., 2020–2025)S-Class (3.0L, 4.0L V8; e.g., 2020–2025)GLC (2.0L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)AMG models (e.g., AMG C63 with 4.0L V8; 2020–2025) Note: Some smaller Mercedes engines (e.g., 1.3L in A-Class, developed with Renault) may use belts, so confirm for entry-level models.Hyundai/KiaHyundai and Kia use timing chains in many of their petrol engines, particularly in larger or newer models.Hyundai Sonata (2.5L, 1.6L turbo petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Hyundai Tucson (2.5L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Kia Optima/K5 (1.6L turbo, 2.5L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Kia Sorento (2.5L petrol, 3.5L V6; e.g., 2020–2025)Kia Telluride (3.8L V6; e.g., 2020–2025) Note: Some smaller engines (e.g., 1.0L, 1.2L in compact models like Hyundai i10) may use belts, and certain diesels may vary by market.NissanNissan favors timing chains in most of its modern petrol engines, though some older models used belts.Altima (2.5L, 2.0L VC-Turbo; e.g., 2020–2025)Rogue (1.5L turbo, 2.5L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Sentra (2.0L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Pathfinder (3.5L V6; e.g., 2020–2025)Micra (1.0L petrol in some markets; e.g., 2020–2023) Note: Nissan’s diesel engines (e.g., in older Navara) may use belts, and some small engines in emerging markets could differ.Volkswagen/Audi (Select Models)While some VW and Audi engines (e.g., 1.0L TSI, 1.2L PureTech) use wet belts, higher-performance or larger engines often use chains.VW Golf GTI/R (2.0L EA888 TSI; e.g., 2020–2025)VW Tiguan (2.0L TSI; e.g., 2020–2025)Audi A4/A5 (2.0L TFSI, 40 TFSI; e.g., 2020–2025)Audi Q5 (2.0L TFSI; e.g., 2020–2025)Audi RS3 (2.5L inline-5; e.g., 2020–2025) Note: VW’s smaller engines (e.g., 1.0L, 1.5L TSI EA211) often use belts or wet belts, so avoid these for chain preference.Other Notable BrandsLexus: Most models (e.g., IS, RX, NX with 2.0L turbo, 3.5L V6, or hybrid engines; 2020–2025) use timing chains, aligning with Toyota’s approach.Suzuki: Small engines like 1.0L BoosterJet, 1.2L, 1.4L turbo petrol (e.g., Vitara, SX4; 2020–2025) use chains.Jaguar/Land Rover: Diesel models (e.g., 2.0L Ingenium in Range Rover Evoque, Jaguar XE; 2020–2025) often use chains, as do petrol V6/V8 engines.Chevrolet/GM: Larger engines (e.g., 3.6L V6 in Camaro, Cadillac XT5; 2.0L turbo in Equinox; 2020–2025) typically use chains, but smaller engines (e.g., 1.2L in Trax) may use wet belts.Key ConsiderationsHow to Confirm: Check the owner’s manual or look under the bonnet. A plastic cover on the engine suggests a timing belt (dry), while a sealed metal cover indicates a timing chain or wet belt. For wet belts, you’ll need to consult specific engine data, as they’re internal.Maintenance: Timing chains require regular oil changes with manufacturer-specified oil to prevent wear on chains, guides, or tensioners. Neglect can lead to rattling or failure, though this is rare in well-maintained engines.Interference Engines: Most modern engines are interference designs, meaning a chain or belt failure can cause catastrophic damage (valves hitting pistons). Chains are less likely to snap but can stretch if poorly maintained.Wet Belt Issues: Wet belts, used in engines like Ford’s 1.0L EcoBoost or VW’s 1.2L TSI, are prone to degradation if improper oil is used or maintenance is skipped, leading to oil pump blockages. Chains avoid this issue.Regional Variations: Engine setups differ by market (e.g., Europe vs. North America). For example, a VW Polo may have a chain in one region (post-2009) but a belt in another.Manufacturers Known for Wet Belts (Avoid for Chain Preference)These brands use wet belts in some modern engines, so double-check specific models:Ford: EcoBoost (1.0L, 1.5L, 2.0L) and EcoBlue diesel engines (e.g., Fiesta, Focus, Transit Connect).Peugeot/Citroën: 1.2L PureTech petrol (e.g., Peugeot 208, Citroën C3, Vauxhall Grandland X).Volkswagen/Audi: Some TSI engines (e.g., 1.0L, 1.2L, 1.5L EA211 in Polo, Golf, Audi A1).Vauxhall/Opel: 1.2L petrol engines in models like Corsa, Astra (shared with PSA Group).RecommendationsIf you prioritize timing chains for their longevity and lower maintenance, focus on:Toyota, Honda, Subaru, Mazda: Reliable, chain-driven petrol engines with strong reputations for durability.BMW, Mercedes-Benz: Higher-end models with chains, but ensure regular oil changes to avoid chain wear.Hyundai/Kia, Nissan: Good options for affordable chain-driven vehicles, especially in mid-size or larger models.Larger Engines: Engines above 1.8L (e.g., 2.0L TSI, 3.5L V6) are more likely to use chains due to higher torque demands.Final NotesThis list is not exhaustive, as manufacturers may change engine designs across model years or markets. For example, a 2020 VW Golf 1.0L TSI may have a wet belt, while the 2.0L TSI in the GTI uses a chain. Always verify the engine code (e.g., EA888 for VW/Audi chains) and consult a mechanic or the manufacturer’s service data. If you provide a specific make, model, year, and engine size, I can narrow it down further.If you’re shopping for a vehicle, consider checking sites like Honest John () or FixMyCar () for detailed lists of chain- vs. belt-driven models. Regular maintenance, especially oil changes every 6,000–10,000 miles with the correct oil spec, is critical for timing chain longevity.
 

alicat

Squire
Location
Staffs
^^^ Break down that paragraph for simplicity and legibility.
 

oxoman

Well-Known Member
If buying any car 2025 model year the driver aids cannot be switched off in order to comply with EU law. Prior to that you can turn stuff off, however some things you have to disable every time you start the car. Personally think some of the so called driver safety aids are dangerous. As to working on any car yourself, goodluck on keeping your knuckles and sanity. Dacia cars are basically old Renault platform so reasonable to work on, but iffy on the electrics.
 

icowden

Veteran
Location
Surrey
We've sold our van so new main family car time. I like Kia Sportage, other half likes simple and easier to repair like the Dacia duster. IMHO there's no such thing as simple and easier to repair these days so you might as well get something decent over basic.
Dacia Spring EV? Any EV takes repair issues out of the equation.
 

oxoman

Well-Known Member
If going EV you need to seriously evaluate your driving needs. I realise that eventually ICE will be defunct, but not yet. Hybrid may be worth a punt but with either your still needing servicing for brakes and suspension etc. Increased tyre wear as well due to heavier batteries. 2/3rds of my driving can be done using small ev however the remaining 3rd is long distances and without option to charge enroute and also these journeys come at little or no notice so ICE works for me. Good luck choosing.
 
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