Cycle lanes and paths - the downsides?

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jonesy said:
Bit of an understatement that! How are you going to widen city centre roads without loosing (often inadequate) pavement width or knocking down entire streets? Sometimes, usually in-fact, we have to find a way to deal as best we can with the street layout we have, and that often involves recognising that streets, especially historic ones, are often narrower than we'd build if we were starting from scratch.

This came up in Oxford a few years ago, where there was a major reconstruction of Cowley Road. For those who don't know it, this is one of the major corridors into central Oxford from the east, and carries very high flows of cars, buses and cyclists. It is also an important centre, with shops, cafes, restaurants etc and lots of people and deliveries to make. As there aren't many bridges, or places you could usefully build new ones, it isn't realistic to try to find alternative corridors, so everyone has to share the same road. There was quite a lot of pressure to provide segregated cycle paths, but no-where they could realistically go, given the space constraints and heavy pedestrian flows. And the narrow road meant that on-road cycle lanes couldn't be provided to an acceptable width, so in the end the decision was made to encourage better sharing of the road. The speed limit was reduced to 20mph in the busiest section and publicity to road users said that you have to get used to following cyclists if there isn't room to overtake safely. Not everyone is happy, they never are, and no-doubt there is room for improvement (extending the 20mph limit in particular), but the key point is that a pragmatic approach based on recognising the constraints and getting everyone to share the road better was better than bodging in sub-standard cycling infrastructure on the dubious grounds that tokenistic measures are preferable to none.

Exactly, it would be cheaper to make cycle paths more attractive to use for all cyclists(where the area allows) or drop the road speed so much it matches the average cyclist.....so everyone may as well be cycling for local trips. Planet saved and maybe a few cyclist lives and fat bastard car drivers learn what their legs are for. NHS saves some money short term and long term.

My work here is done. :biggrin:

''Simples'' Meerkat.com
 

HJ

Cycling in Scotland
Location
Auld Reekie
As no one else seem to have suggested it could get some inspiration from Cycle Facility of the Month...
 
Hairy Jock said:
As no one else seem to have suggested it could get some inspiration from Cycle Facility of the Month...


A safe minimum cycle lane/shared path standard would be a start, according to Sustrans there is no minimum standard, no guidelines. At the moment it seems it is about meeting quotas for the lengths of lanes by local councils and not if it is actually usable or safe to use.

Width, obstacles, surface condition, area, accessibility all ought to be in some standard gov. guideline.

The cycle path I'd like to use along a 60mph country road is shared use, rough and potholed and as wide as my handle bars with a ditch and thorny hedge on one side. ;) Complaining for 5 years does nothing.
 

marinyork

Resting in suspended Animation
Location
Logopolis
Although minimum standards would be good what would be much better would be a grading system that told you the quality and type of the surface and other things like how long you had to go along it before you could join/leave. There are some sections that go on for miles without entry/exit and very variable quality.
 

Bman

Guru
Location
Herts.
Roadworks. Thats another thing.

Occasionally the council close parts of the cycle-track system here. They do this for Re-surfacing (rarely), updating underpasses, and most commonly, utilities works (cable, gas, water etc).

Almost always, there is no warning of a road closed ahead, until you see the utilities vans parked on the cycle-track or the road closed sign itself. This usually means "dismounting" and walking 100 meters around the roadworks, or sometimes back-tracking to follow a different route.

The most annoying one was, when an underpass was being repaired/updated. The underpass carried a pavement and a cycletrack, under a fenced dual carrageway. I was travelling for about 2 miles, parrallel to this dual carrageway and noticed a "road ahead closed" sign on the dual carrageway, nothing on the cycle-track. It wasnt until I got to the underpass that I found it was that, which was closed. It meant back tracking about half a mile and taking a different route.

Would have been more annoying for pedestrians. (But then, most of them would have just jumped the fences)
 
OP
OP
downfader

downfader

extimus uero philosophus
Location
'ampsheeeer
Bongman said:
Roadworks. Thats another thing.

Occasionally the council close parts of the cycle-track system here. They do this for Re-surfacing (rarely), updating underpasses, and most commonly, utilities works (cable, gas, water etc).

Almost always, there is no warning of a road closed ahead, until you see the utilities vans parked on the cycle-track or the road closed sign itself. This usually means "dismounting" and walking 100 meters around the roadworks, or sometimes back-tracking to follow a different route.

The most annoying one was, when an underpass was being repaired/updated. The underpass carried a pavement and a cycletrack, under a fenced dual carrageway. I was travelling for about 2 miles, parrallel to this dual carrageway and noticed a "road ahead closed" sign on the dual carrageway, nothing on the cycle-track. It wasnt until I got to the underpass that I found it was that, which was closed. It meant back tracking about half a mile and taking a different route.

Would have been more annoying for pedestrians. (But then, most of them would have just jumped the fences)
I think thats a good point. Drivers get all kinds of warnings to change their route early such as satnav, web and radio information as well as various levels of signage.

We get nothing in that respect
 

marinyork

Resting in suspended Animation
Location
Logopolis
Motoring doesn't get it any better. Diversion signs are often hastily slapped out, wrong or incomplete. Bus services suffer from the same.

I have seen plenty of signs warning of cycle path closures, it's one of the reasons I dislike them. I've known of 3 stretches of NCN that have been closed for 6 months to a year. The problem is not really the closure itself, it's a lack of options and sustrans sense of humour at taking people on daft routes.
 

jonesy

Guru
semislickstick said:
A safe minimum cycle lane/shared path standard would be a start, according to Sustrans there is no minimum standard, no guidelines. At the moment it seems it is about meeting quotas for the lengths of lanes by local councils and not if it is actually usable or safe to use.

Width, obstacles, surface condition, area, accessibility all ought to be in some standard gov. guideline.

....

There most certainly is plenty of guidance on standards:
http://www.cyclingengland.co.uk/site/engineering-planning/

Unfortunately these are rarely followed.
 

Array

New Member
Location
Bristol
semislickstick said:
A safe minimum cycle lane/shared path
The cycle path I'd like to use along a 60mph country road is shared use, rough and potholed and as wide as my handle bars with a ditch and thorny hedge on one side. :laugh: Complaining for 5 years does nothing.

We've got quite a useful but dangerous path in Bristol that sounds similar. Lots of bumps, lumps and ridges in the path to bounce you around, maybe down the steep incline into the river that runs next to it if you're unlucky. There's no fence and the path is quite narrow in areas.

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps/ms?hl...d=116200465615686758899.000468b8033dac4af5145
 
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