eco-halogen bulbs - why do they keep breaking?

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ArDee

Legendary Member
Sorry about the length of this post
Halogen lamps work by recycling the tungsten in a halogen cycle. Tungsten that evaporates off the filament due to its high temperature would be deposited on the inside of the quartz which would cause it to go black. However as the quartz is relatively cold (in comparison to the filament) at this lower temperature the tungsten combines with the halogen and is carried back to the filament by the thermal currents in the gas inside the lamp. When the Tungsten/Halogen combination gets back to the filament the high temperature causes the Tungsten/Halogen to break down redepositing the Tungsten on the filament
Hence there are a number of things that can make Halogen lamps blow;
As has been said if you touch the quartz it creates a spot on the quartz, that when it get hot, becomes porous and allows oxygen into the lamp causing premature failure of the filament through oxidation.
The lamp is designed to operate on one plane for optimum temperature control and thermal gas current movement in the lamp, installed upside down or on its side will reduce lamp life and long thin lamps, normally found in security lights, need to be install with the lamp level so that the thermal gas currents in the lamp do not preferentially deposit tungsten back at one end of the lamp starving the other end and leading to premature failure by thinning.
The lamps are susceptible to voltage variation and unlike incandescent lamps are normally more susceptible to lower voltages than burning out due to higher voltages; low voltage lamps have a maximum length of cable from the transformer to the fitting to minimise volt drop and low voltage at the lamp. If the voltage drops the temperature of the quartz drops faster than the temperature of the filament and the halogen cycle stops as the Tungsten/Halogen combination does not form at the quartz sleeve; hence, allowing the filament to evaporate tungsten without it being redeposited and the thinning of the filament.
Dimmers have the same effect and should be run at full power or at less than around 80% to reduce the filament temperature below the point at which the tungsten evaporation comes down to about the level to that of a normal incandescent lamp
Vibration has been mentioned and this does affect the filament; car halogen lamps are robustised by design to allow vibration without affecting operation while house lamps aren’t as robust. If anybody ever had an incandescent hand held lamp for when working on the car and the lamp went, you needed to buy a “Rough Handling” replacement or if you used a normal lamp, the first time you knocked the lamp against the car the bulb would fail. The principle is the same.
 

Dan Allison

Well-Known Member
Location
Suffolk
Sorry not really a surge voltage wise, I just don't think the life of the lamp appreciates the sudden start, soft starting these types of lamps has always helped prolong life where I have installed an MK dimmer.
 

Archie_tect

De Skieven Architek... aka Penfold + Horace
Location
Northumberland

subaqua

What’s the point
Location
Leytonstone
Found this... so it would appear that voltage optimisers are a waste of time...
http://www.yougen.co.uk/blog-entry/1948/Is domestic voltage optimisation all it'27s cracked up to be'3F/
in a domestic environment- yes its a modern snake oil. however on large industrial/commercial developments like office blocks then maybe.

Active harmonic filters and proper Power factor correction are the best tools for reducing energy consumption. 3rd Harmonic is a big problem http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harmonics_(electrical_power) http://www.ece.tamu.edu/~huang/ClassNotes/Mar11.pdf because of the larger neutral currents . there is a school of thought that going back to a DC system for PCs in offices would significantly help in the reduction of energy consumption. it would remove the transformer and rectifier that all PSU for PCs have. we are a long way off . maybe Edison was way ahead in his thinking :smile:
 

Yellow Fang

Legendary Member
Location
Reading
Here is a very grainy photo taken with my mobile of my candelabra thing after I just switched it on. Guess which is the LED.



canelabra.jpg
 

Archie_tect

De Skieven Architek... aka Penfold + Horace
Location
Northumberland
in a domestic environment- yes its a modern snake oil. however on large industrial/commercial developments like office blocks then maybe.

Active harmonic filters and proper Power factor correction are the best tools for reducing energy consumption. 3rd Harmonic is a big problem http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harmonics_(electrical_power) http://www.ece.tamu.edu/~huang/ClassNotes/Mar11.pdf because of the larger neutral currents . there is a school of thought that going back to a DC system for PCs in offices would significantly help in the reduction of energy consumption. it would remove the transformer and rectifier that all PSU for PCs have. we are a long way off . maybe Edison was way ahead in his thinking :smile:
Talking to an office developer who's keen to have a 9 volt ring main for all the electrical stuff everyone has that currently charge on DC transformers! Makes sense... maybe have a low voltage DC ring main for all the LED lighting too??... should be much more efficient!
 

Rohloff_Brompton_Rider

Formerly just_fixed
As I understand it, when a Halogen lamp blows it causes a surge due to the sudden collapse of the circuit. This in turn damages the remaining lamps on the same circuit (same fitting). If you replace all the lamps in the fitting at the same time, they last longer overall, if not your chasing your tail.

How many times have you replaced a single lamp in a fitting, switched it on and then another one blows either immediately or soon after?

When I was still sparking, I always replaced all the lamps in a fitting. This is what I used to do when called out to nuisance light fittings which keep tripping the MCB.

It usually sorted out the ever decreasing circle of constantly replacing halogen lamps.
 

subaqua

What’s the point
Location
Leytonstone
As I understand it, when a Halogen lamp blows it causes a surge due to the sudden collapse of the circuit. This in turn damages the remaining lamps on the same circuit (same fitting). If you replace all the lamps in the fitting at the same time, they last longer overall, if not your chasing your tail.

How many times have you replaced a single lamp in a fitting, switched it on and then another one blows either immediately or soon after?

When I was still sparking, I always replaced all the lamps in a fitting. This is what I used to do when called out to nuisance light fittings which keep tripping the MCB.

It usually sorted out the ever decreasing circle of constantly replacing halogen lamps.
you sort of answer your own question really . in a single fitting with multiple lamps its likely that when one goes all the others will go as they would have all been installed at the same time and are of an age where failure can be reasonably expected. otherwise all lamps in the whole installation would need to be changed at the same time. same could be said for when you switch off an inductive fiting ( fluorescent) as the collapsing magnetic field in the choke ( ballast for you young uns) will generate a reverse EMF.

the one we used to get fairly often was call backs to rewires or new Consumer units where a BS3036 rewireable had been replaced with a type B MCB . when a lamp fails there is a momentary high current , some MCBs detected this as a fault and opened. resolved by a change to Type C as the energy let through was less than the energy withstand of the cable.
 
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