Finally teaching real programming

[martint235]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-10951040

But at least it teaches more efficient coding. When you've got 4Gb of RAM to play with, judging by modern programs, there is a tendency to get sloppy with the coding. The National Museum are showing A level students what it used to be like before object orientated programming and cut and paste.

Eeee, when I did A level we had to send out programs on coding sheets to Blackburn College to be punched on to card before being fed in to the mainframe. They then invariably came back with one card at right angles to the rest to signify where the error in your code was. Happy times.

 

[martint235]

I used to write device drivers in assembly language.

I wouldn't fancy doing it again now!

I quite like assembly language. Similar to what is said in the BBC article, it allowed you to actually understand what was going on in the box. Wouldn't fancy writing Office 2010 in it though.......

 

[ian turner]

So what was it like in the war ?
Visual basic won't get you very far in the engineering industry.
Mind you being in the engineering industry won't get you very far in wages

 

[martint235]

So what was it like in the war ?
Visual basic won't get you very far in the engineering industry.
Mind you being in the engineering industry won't get you very far in wages

I went through years (school, uni etc) of having it rammed down my throat that "we teach you how to program in BASIC as a stepping stone, you will never, ever, ever, ever see this outside the educational setup". The first job I got was for a carpet company where all their invoicing and distribution programs were in BASIC!!! And that's before Visual Basic. God I feel old!!!!

 

[TrevorM]

I had to write COBOL in my first programming job. Yeeuch. But I made quite a bit from COBOL during the "millenium bug" scare a few years later.

My first job was also COBOL programming. Then moved into management so missed the chance to make money during the "millenium bug". I am now COBOL programming again. Oops

 

[TrevorM]

Eeee, when I did A level we had to send out programs on coding sheets to Blackburn College to be punched on to card before being fed in to the mainframe.

IMO that's was one of the the best ways to teach programming because it put the emphasis on programme design rather than coding.

 

[beanzontoast]

My first programs in the 1970's were entered on a teletype machine that created punched tape which we carried round in metal sellotape tins for protection inbetween lessons. The tape was sent off from school to the local Poly to run on their mainframe. Anything that needed longer than 20 seconds runtime got cut off.

We had a modem too and very infrequently got a live linkup at what was rumoured to be £1 a minute (though that may have been put about just to stop us dithering at the keyboard!).

 

[martint235]

IMO that's was one of the the best ways to teach programming because it put the emphasis on programme design rather than coding.

Having to wait a week to receive the result of your program meant you were 99% sure that the design was sound. The mainframe was in a sense just confirming what you already knew. However the 90 degree cards signified that spelling mistakes can get everywhere!!!

 

[amnesia]

I am in charge of a 15 strong PL/1 & CICS development team.

Our skills are becoming scarce... kids these days haven't a clue what a mainframe is

In my time I have used ADA, 68000 assembler, BASIC, PROLOG, COBOL and PL/1.
I've only dabbled with C# and VB - I prefer the old skool approach.

 

[gaz]

You don't get taught any of that now until you get to uni.
And when i started computer at uni it was a massive leap to start learning all of that. So much so that i ended up quitting

Now i just make things look pretty

 

[martint235]

You don't get taught any of that now until you get to uni.
And when i started computer at uni it was a massive leap to start learning all of that. So much so that i ended up quitting

Now i just make things look pretty

Oh god now I really do feel old. When I went to uni, we actually had a whole module on PCs cos they were that new. The rest of the course was spent on a Vax and two DECs. I can still remember the day the uni got their first Mac and it didn't go into the computing faculty, toy computers didn't belong there. It went into the design bit.

 

[2Loose]

It is a great way for 'youngsters' to be aware of what the computer actually does, rather than what some huge framework of pre-written libraries (.Net, Java etc.) can do for them.

No mouse, copy & paste etc. must have really thrown those kids!

 

[ian turner]

I used the UCSD PAscal development system at university on a PDP 11 which had a screen editor and the ability to highlight errors and that was back in 81!!!! Line editors don't bring you closer to the way the computer works. Languages at that time weren't completely bare bones. Fortran after all continues to exist due to an excessive dependence on a huge library of mathematical/engineering routines and the intractability of that area of the market. Designing a GUI based system using assembler would be insane.
This is turning into Last of the Summer Whine
The trouble with cyclists to day is they have too many gears and all this carbon malarky distances them from the real effort involved in going up hills. Bring back cast iron bicycles dammit

 

[Jezston]

I wanted to be a computer programmer when I was a kid, I wanted to be like Jeff Minter - even if it meant having to have sex with dromedarys like he does.

Sadly my programming skills barely progressed beyond 10 Print "You are gay"; 20 Goto 10 type malarkey. I tried learning STOS Basic on my Atari ST but didn't really get anywhere. Was OK with script-based stuff like in those early 'make your own game' type apps like 3D Construction Kit, but I soon realised programming was not for me.

Now I make sound effects and music for games, which is much more fun, involves a lot less overtime and bypasses the pesky hassle of a decent salary!

 

[Proto]

My first programs in the 1970's were entered on a teletype machine that created punched tape which we carried round in metal sellotape tins for protection inbetween lessons. The tape was sent off from school to the local Poly to run on their mainframe. Anything that needed longer than 20 seconds runtime got cut off.

We had a modem too and very infrequently got a live linkup at what was rumoured to be £1 a minute (though that may have been put about just to stop us dithering at the keyboard!).

I seem to recall using a Flexowriter in the mid 70s. Didn't have clue about programming. I think it was ALGOL? COBOL? Dunno.