Impacts of motorcycles in Westminster bus lanes

[Origamist]

Recently released study: Aug 2008

Impacts of motorcycles in Westminster bus lanes:

http://www.trl.co.uk/press/press_detail.asp?pid=95&aid=172

 

[LLB]

Well it is a bit of a mixed bag and sounds like a reasonable conclusion to this point given the circumstances. they didn't state the speed of the surrounding traffic in the report as I could see it though, and only stated that of the m/cyclists (were all the vehicles doing the same speed at the monitored points ? )

 

[zimzum42]

One of the interesting things about the report is that it seems to be written from a fairly objective standpoint, whereas most of the opinion expressed on here is entirely cycle-centric.

That is to be expected on a cycle forum, but overall I think allowing bikers into bus lanes will benefit a great number of people for a number of reasons, not least that it may encourage people out of cars in the city....

 

[domtyler]

That report seems to fairly conclusively point to the fact that allowing them to use the lanes is a recipe for disaster. Firstly average speeds will increase. Secondly accidents will increase and it will be bikers themselves as well as cyclists and pedestrians who pay the price, with their lives, for this misguided venture.

 

[4F]

1. On Bayswater Road the average speed of motorcyclists increased by 2 mph, with the 85th percentile of speed being 43.1 mph in the after survey. Such behaviour is of concern, particularly in relation to the effect on cyclist and pedestrian safety, as there is a correlation between increased speed and severity of collisions for pedestrians and cyclists.

Hmmmmm

 

[zimzum42]

that's a 30mph road, so they should be being dealt with on that basis, regardless of what lane they're in.

If the police would bother stopping people for that kind of thing, rather than relying on a camera just before Lancaster Gate, then maybe we'd get somewhere

 

[LLB]

that's a 30mph road, so they should be being dealt with on that basis, regardless of what lane they're in.

If the police would bother stopping people for that kind of thing, rather than relying on a camera just before Lancaster Gate, then maybe we'd get somewhere

Agree with this 100%. If 85% of the bikes are doing that speed, that indicates that the enforcement on that road is not effective. How quickly does the traffic flow as a whole or is it just the bikes overtaking everything else to arrive at this given speed ??

 

[zimzum42]

it can be quite a quick stretch of road - this might not be the place ot admit it, but i normally have to brake before the camera, and i'm certainly not going faster than the rest of the traffic.....

 

[cheadle hulme]

The 85th percentile being at 43mph means 15% of bikes were doing over 43mph.

 

[GrahamG]

I hate to sound like I'm getting commuting mixed up with Politics, but do you think that this really is a sign of things to come (from the Tory's) given their historic car-loving?

 

[Origamist]

Brakes put on powered bike bus lane use (Edinburgh):

http://news.scotsman.com/topstories/Brakes-put-on-powered-bike.4584712.jp

 

[LLB]

Brakes put on powered bike bus lane use (Edinburgh):

http://news.scotsman.com/topstories/Brakes-put-on-powered-bike.4584712.jp

They also said that if the lanes were opened up to motorcycles, other vehicles like private hires and freight could also have a claim to use them, and since the lanes only function if they are kept congestion free, it was recommended that the situation in Edinburgh remain the same.

To be fair, The two arguments allowing motorcycles into bus lanes are things which don't apply to 'private hires' and 'freight vehicles' - To 'reduce congestion', and to also improve the safety of the riders who are vulnerable to bigger vehicles (private hires and freight vehicles aren't vulnerable in the same way as a cycle or m/cycle, and it is well established that m/cycles are part of the solution, not the problem where congestion is concerned)

This is exactly the argument which was put forward successfully by cyclists to use bus lanes, so this argument against m/cycles using bus lanes in this instance is a red herring and badly thought out

 

[Cab]

and it is well established that m/cycles are part of the solution, not the problem where congestion is concerned

Is it really? I'm not convinced. They're kind of a bit nippy in traffic and take up marginally less road space than a car... But part of the solution? In that they're not as big a part of the problem?

If that 'part of the solution' is so disheartening to a better 'part of the solution', the analysis falls down. Motorbikes in bus-lanes scare the willies out of me (they're only in those lanes here illegally, but far too often and far too close), if this reduces cycling take up then it fails.

 

[LLB]

Is it really? I'm not convinced. They're kind of a bit nippy in traffic and take up marginally less road space than a car... But part of the solution? In that they're not as big a part of the problem?

If that 'part of the solution' is so disheartening to a better 'part of the solution', the analysis falls down. Motorbikes in bus-lanes scare the willies out of me (they're only in those lanes here illegally, but far too often and far too close), if this reduces cycling take up then it fails.

Sorry Cab, I disagree. There are many people out there who live too far out for a commute in by cycle, and don't want to use public transport. M/cycles have their place if the traffic and if 20% of the cars were replaced by them the city wouldn't have needed the CC in the first place - however people are discouraged from getting on 2 wheels, not by the m/cycles, but from the risk from buses, HGVs and errant drivers.

 

[Cab]

Sorry Cab, I disagree. There are many people out there who live too far out for a commute in by cycle, and don't want to use public transport.

Then, frankly, thats their problem. If they choose to live a long way from work, or work a long way from home, then they must factor in a responsible way of getting to and from work; being part of serious traffic congestion that chokes our towns and cities is not responsible.

M/cycles have their place if the traffic and if 20% of the cars were replaced by them the city wouldn't have needed the CC in the first place - however people are discouraged from getting on 2 wheels, not by the m/cycles, but from the risk from buses, HGVs and errant drivers.

And allowing motorbikes in bus lanes will put people off cycling. You don't solve the problem that way.