Not a Morning Person! or Overtrained?

[Rob3rt]

Being a newby and not having a (ridable) bike until later this week Ive been hitting the gym in preperation. Ive been doing a combination of running and cycling. Mainly I wish to persue cycling but want to do the Bupa 10km run and the local weekly 5km Park Run so have been doing running as well. My training is somewhat like this.

Mon - 60 Mins Cycling (Biggest number on distance as possible in 1 hour while maintaining a relatively difficult resistance but such that I can make it through the hour with very little to spare)
Tuesday - 5km Run on treadmill (medium pace, 10% increase in distance each week)
Wednesday - Rest (Some Ab training)
Thursday - Brick (Either 10 mins cycling 5 mins run, 4 sets of this, or 40 mins cycling into 20 min run)
Friday - Rest
Saturday - Cycle 60 mins
Sunday - Cycle 60 mins

Well last week when it came to my brick session, I could only run for about 12 mins then a dull ache in my knee every step promted the decision to abandon and rest up for a few days, it wasnt a tired leg pain, it was a something is wrong pain.


I rested up friday, saturday, sunday.

Then decided to hit the gym this morning before work, got there, 20 mins into my 60 mins cycle, I felt exhausted and near ready to vomit. Again had to abandon (couldnt vomit and continue being in a public gym etc).

This was quite a surprise since the previous week id actualy managed to do 60 mins (near 35km) according to the stationary bike computer and then a 2.5km run with reserve energy left over.

So this leads to my question, Could I possibly be training to much for a newby and am really tired out or is it common to just not be able to function on the morning. I was always under the impression mornings were good because you are tanked with testosterone from your sleep.

 

[mr Mag00]

how long you been doing this, have you been active before? for a newb, does sound like quite a lot, get good rest sleep and hydration , back off but keep easy walking/running but stop the building cannot build week on week.

imo

 

[Rob3rt]

how long you been doing this, have you been active before? for a newb, does sound like quite a lot, get good rest sleep and hydration , back off but keep easy walking/running but stop the building cannot build week on week.

imo

About 3 weeks to a month. Also I have not been "active" before per se, but I am the sort of person who will walk anywhere and everywhere, so Im not sedentiary.

Todays lack of form was a surprise considering as my edit in my 1st post says(I realise you must have posted while I was editing, sorry that I missed this detail in 1st post) "the previous week id actualy managed to do 60 mins (near 35km) according to the stationary bike computer and then a 2.5km run with reserve energy left over."

 

[darkstar]

Hmm it could be a range of issues, overtraining is certainly a possibility. Have you had any troubles sleeping? What have you been eating? Could simply be a lack of energy, presume you were drinking enough water?

 

[Rob3rt]

Hmm it could be a range of issues, overtraining is certainly a possibility. Have you had any troubles sleeping? What have you been eating? Could simply be a lack of energy, presume you were drinking enough water?

Ive been sleeping a lot better since I started training, I typically have sleep issues in the past, because I work as a PhD student (long days at a desk hence not being physically tired yet being mentally tired, in-ability to switch off when getting home etc etc) but since taking up exercise I work 9/10am-6/7pm, gym, then ill be asleep before, 11:30pm.

My diet is not the best but it is better than it was,

Breakfast - 2 slices nutella on toast, coffee
Mid morning snack - apple, some nuts
Lunch - Cereal
Mid afternoon - an orange, maybe some more nuts
An hour before leaving work - bowl of porrige oats with a chopped up banana
After gym - Pint milk and a pasta based meal, witha sauce typically containing tuna or rindless bacon (or a combo).

I drink about 2.5-3 litres water a day.




I mainly asked being that this time was my 1st morning training session, I usually start to train about 7-7:30pm. But following the knee last week I was slightly concerned maybe it was overtraining as Ive heard of aches etc being a symptom back when I used to weight train and play rugby in 6th form college.

 

[Dan B]

Another possibility is that it's the first warning you have a cold (the sore throat will be with you by end of day or tomorrow latest). Do you take your resting pulse rate before getting up and did it change? That's often a good sign that you're under the weather

 

[darkstar]

Did you eat before your training session or after? That may account for the sickness.

 

[Rob3rt]

I havent checked my resting pulse rate for about a week, its typically about 54-57. Ill have to test this tomorrow. Thanks for that suggestion! i dont think this has become habit quite yet, sure enough that within a few months it will be second nature to check upon waking.

I did eat before my training, but a bit less than usual............ I normally have a bowl of oats and a banana about 60-90 mins before training, since Iwas only up 30 mins before training i had a smaller portion to avoid feeling ill with full stomach, usually 60 mins bike is tiring but not to my limit so 20 mins is like abysmal, even at my fitness level. The food was my 1st thought, but I dont think food was the case, it was more like, "im so f*cked im going to throw up if I dont stop" not the effect of a full stomach. But I could be wrongly judging it, but my instinct says wasnt the food on my stomach, if it is food related its more likely due to less food than normal I think.


(BTW I take my pulse rate manually using fingers on wrist not using a HRM as I dont have one - the gym equipement I use has build in polar HRM so im waiting till I get my bike to buy a good computer with HRM built in - although probly should buy one for running too, so im not sure how accurate I'm measuring it)

 

[Fiona N]

It does look like all your training is pretty high end - up at 80-90% max heart rate, well over anaerobic threshold (this is basically when you go from regular steady breathing to 'panting' - i.e. open mouth, hauling the air in and out). It could be just too much for your base fitness. I'd defintely consider replacing 1 or 2 sessions with low end aerobic exercise - fast walking or much steadier cycling - check this by making sure you can maintain breathing through your nose (or at least in through the nose, out through the mouth).

Even in a well conditioned athlete, a training plan would usually have 1 or 2 anaerobic sessions a week (e.g. a brick session and/or a shorter, harder interval session) with the other 4 or 5 days with fully aerobic and recovery sessions.

 

[Rob3rt]

Thanks Fiona, I shall rectify this in my plan and tone down some of my days. I'd prefer this than reduce the days training if its a viable solution tbh, I find training helps my daily function dramatically, hehe!

Maybe I should clarify my level of effort at present (to help any future response or elaboration)

Monday, this typically has me at about 100-110 rpm at a cardio heart rate, I think I normally set to keep in zone of around 158bpm(75-80% MHR) for 60 mins.

Tuesday, My running pace gets me 5km in about 30 mins (27 mins fastest) so pretty slow (immediate post run HR ~ 160-165 - so yes quite high here again - should buy a HRM to keep track in real time but atm take HR at intervals because it involves holding the rails to check).

Thursday, By brick training is a combo of about 80% HR (bike) same pace as my tuesday 5km pace run.

Other rides(sessions on stationary bike) are about 80-90rpm for 60 mins, similar resistance, but lower exertion. So lower HR.

I never get to the point im panting. I generally feel fine with this level (and on several occasions felt I could do considerable more yet stopped to save myself for the next day) hence why I've not considered that I may be over doing it until today but now you mention it, yeah maybe I am pushing a bit hard. I was just basically trying to maintain my aerobic heart rate according to Ric Sterns perscribed endurance and tempo training zones as defined in a HR spreadsheet a member of another forum compiled.


All exercises are performed following stretching routine (as learned through playing rugby years ago) and 5 mins warm up on exercise, at low exertion level slowly ramping up till the 60 mins begins.

 

[Kirstie]

By the way if you are experiencing knee pain and you are combining running with cycling you may have a tight ITB (ilio-tibial band). This can be cured with stretching - but its notoriously difficult to stretch. I beleive FionaN may know something about this too.

 

[Rob3rt]

Oh I only just noticed your reply Kirstie, I'll look that up and see if there are any stretches I can try out. Ive always had trouble running on pavement, pains in shins just above my ankles so I kind of assumed that the knee pain was either caused by training to much or by the impact of runing jarring at my knee's being that I'm not running a lot more than I used to.

Since the morning of failure, I had one more failed evening training session (ran too fast and burnt out too early) but generally I can train 80-90 mins without any ill feeling, so maybe im just not good to go early morning Thinking of gradually introducing morning training sessions, as I'd prefer to train on mornings if I could. My knees and occasionally my hips still hurt when I run though, Ideally I need to go get my gait assessed and buy some runing shoes.