Onerous ride leading listing requirements: how to overcome?

[mjr]

Issuing sun cream is absolutely not allowed (you’re not permitted to administer lotions, potions, creams, or pills).

Yes, even with my old out-of-date training, I thought that was advised against.

Mechanical checks ( M checks ) are par for the course.

Just to check I've understood: you do a full M check on every rider's bike before the ride? How long does that take? I've certainly never had my bike checked on the few BC-backed rides I've done. I would have my doubts about the ability of some leaders to do the check...

There are too many of these types of ‘organised rides’ put on by people / groups without a mandate, or official training.

British Cycling and / or Cycling UK, are really the only people who’s rides people should be bothering with.

I've noted before that I'm pretty sure some rides claiming to be under their covers aren't following their handbooks or anything like, so would be uninsured if push came to shove.

Mandate? Who has a mandate/authority to "put on" rides? Why does British Cycling have a mandate?

And who wants to ride "organised" anyway? Long live disorganisation! Hail Eris! Hail Discordia!

 

[Racing roadkill]

Just to check I've understood: you do a full M check on every rider's bike before the ride? How long does that take? I've certainly never had my bike checked on the few BC-backed rides I've done. I would have my doubts about the ability of some leaders to do the check...

1 leader stands in front of the assembled rider, and demonstrates the points to check, it’s the riders who check their own bikes, and ask for help / assistance if anything is amiss.

I've noted before that I'm pretty sure some rides claiming to be under their covers aren't following their handbooks or anything like, so would be uninsured if push came to shove.

There are 2 levels, ‘Guided Ride’ and ‘Ride Social’. Guided rides are the risk assessed rides, with qualified, trained leaders, and they have fairly strict rules and regs, but are covered by BC’s liability . ‘Ride Socials’ can be put on by anyone, and don’t have the same constraints, but don’t have the same cover.

 

[Dogtrousers]

And if you do mechanically check a bike and it goes wrong ... are you liable?

As to medical data: That's sensitive personal info and only a lunatic would hold that unless there is a pressing need. The requirements for handling it are quite onerous as is the required justification.

 

[Racing roadkill]

And if you do mechanically check a bike and it goes wrong ... are you liable?

Nope, it’s in the ‘small print’ we’re there to assist where possible, but we’re not liable for the riders bikes ( hence the reason we can only advise, we can’t touch their bikes)

As to medical data: That's sensitive personal info and only a lunatic would hold that unless there is a pressing need. The requirements for handling it are quite onerous as is the required justification.

Quite right, we can’t ask any medical questions, the rider may give us any info, if they wish, but they don’t have to. If they do, and whatever it is, causes an issue, we still have to deal with it. I was doing a pre ride of the ride London, last month, and one rider had certain requirements. The rider voluntarily provided the info, and I had to make adjustments, in order to accommodate ‘on the hoof’.

 

[tom73]

If EFAW is the only training they have to have i'd not trust them with a plaster let alone anything more complex.
Training was bad enough when the HSE ran the show but now it's a right free for all.
If FA is given this too requires correct compliant recording and handling by a trained data controller.
Not to mention safe storage for up to 25 years after the event. Oh and if any treatment given or any part of the form is filled by a HCP then the form is said HCP's property. So they'd have to allow future access to the data so a recored of them will be needed too.
Something else I bet they have not covered.

 

[classic33]

You've no legal right to discriminate on medical grounds. Disability or ability.

Nor have you the right to ask.

Brought in under the DDA 1995.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

Ill fitting clothing, what planet is the guy on? Quick call the fashion police you can't possibly ride in that clothing.

 

[Racing roadkill]

If EFAW is the only training they have to have i'd not trust them with a plaster let alone anything more complex.
Training was bad enough when the HSE ran the show but now it's a right free for all.
If FA is given this too requires correct compliant recording and handling by a trained data controller.
Not to mention safe storage for up to 25 years after the event. Oh and if any treatment given or any part of the form is filled by a HCP then the form is said HCP's property. So they'd have to allow future access to the data so a recored of them will be needed too.
Something else I bet they have not covered.

BC cover it. Digital incident / accident forms, and they take care of the legislative stuff. The EFAW is a minimum standard, BC now have a more cycling specific first aid course, which is delivered by the St.John Ambulance / Red Cross, at the time of the training course.

 

[Racing roadkill]

You've no legal right to discriminate on medical grounds. Disability or ability.

Nor have you the right to ask.

Brought in under the DDA 1995.

Quite right.

 

[classic33]

The organisation of a cycling festival is asking for the following (amongst other things) before listing some group rides which are going to happen anyway:

· "a cycle leader" (as you may recall, our rides are more critical-mass-style turning up at an agreed point and riding in a normal manner along a consensual route to another agreed point and back, not led like schoolchildren) and "Event Team";

· a register to be taken at the start of the ride and headcounts occasionally thereafter;

· rider medical details to be collected at the start of the ride;

· a qualified first aider on every ride or it's cancelled;

· all bikes to be checked mechanically by "instructors" before the start;

· all riders' cycling ability checked before the start;

· helmets for all riders. Riders with incorrectly-fitted helmets to be allowed to continue with a warning. Riders without helmets not allowed;

· route to have been ridden and assessed a week before the ride to "ensure it is interesting/appealing" and "ensure the route is free of any obstructions or other hazards/problems";

· hi-viz jackets, food, sunscreen, spare inner tubes and tools to be provided to all riders as needed;

· generally "managing the group" and "meeting the required standards of customer care";

· fill out a 9-page risk assessment for each ride and carry incident report forms (which I have not yet been sent).

In general, it looks like a list more intended for a commercial event company putting on a cycle event with paid staff at some velopark, rather than a group social ride on public roads.

Has anyone faced this sort of list before? How did you overcome it? Or did you walk away?

I'm trying the tactics of arguing that the medical/bikes/skills checks are variously inappropriate or futile because we do not have the power to stop anyone riding along public highways with us (or even without us if we were to attempt to cancel the ride due to lack of first-aider); and that because it's on public highways, the highway authority is responsible for keeping the route free of obstructions and hazards, not group volunteers.

If you want, I'll let you know how badly this year's attempt fails Unsurprisingly, I think the only cycle rides in their festival in past years have been the organisation's own, which seems a crying shame when there are so many groups scheduling rides around here.

You qualified to mechanically assess and fix/adjust this?

 

[tom73]

BC cover it. Digital incident / accident forms, and they take care of the legislative stuff. The EFAW is a minimum standard, BC now have a more cycling specific first aid course, which is delivered by the St.John Ambulance / Red Cross, at the time of the training course.

For you maybe was raising more question for OP to throw at them.

 

[Racing roadkill]

You qualified to mechanically assess and fix/adjust this?
View attachment 483898

Yep, the M check just addresses key components. The key components are pretty much universal.

 

[classic33]

Yep, the M check just addresses key components. The key components are pretty much universal.

You familiar with left-hand drive systems then?

 

[Racing roadkill]

You familiar with left-hand drive systems then?

Personally, I am, but it doesn’t matter, as we can’t get hands on. Should someone turn up on an unusual contraption, after the common bits are checked, we just ask them to ride around the bit where we assemble, and ask them if it’s working as it normally does, and if they’re happy with it. Stuff like tyre condition, brake condition, wheel / spoke condition, crank security etc, are fairly universal.

 

[classic33]

Yep, the M check just addresses key components. The key components are pretty much universal.

That'd be a No then.

You can't pick and choose which parts you want to check, if you're doing a safety check.