Public liability insurance for beginners rides

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sheddy

Legendary Member
Location
Suffolk
Can anyone recommend an inexpensive policy for the above?
Our group want to run a beginners ride every month, all year round.

I believe that the CTC policy only covers 5 non members on a ride (in which case we need to look elsewhere). Can anyone confirm if this is correct, or have I misunderstood the (incomprehensible) T&Cs?
British Cycling offers cover at £60 per ride, which we can't afford.

What does your club use for Public Events ?
 

ASC1951

Guru
Location
Yorkshire
Unless you are instructing the beginners, why do you need insurance? They are riding on public roads at their own risk. All you are doing is co-ordinating the departure.
 

fossyant

Ride It Like You Stole It!
Location
South Manchester
You don't need it for what is informal rides. The reason it is for beginners is that the pace is slower. Everyone should accept that.
 

dellzeqq

pre-talced and mighty
Location
SW2
Can anyone recommend an inexpensive policy for the above?
Our group want to run a beginners ride every month, all year round.

I believe that the CTC policy only covers 5 non members on a ride (in which case we need to look elsewhere). Can anyone confirm if this is correct, or have I misunderstood the (incomprehensible) T&Cs?
British Cycling offers cover at £60 per ride, which we can't afford.

What does your club use for Public Events ?
here's the benefit of my two weeks or calling around, writing to insurers, talking to BC, CTC, LCC, Sutrans, The Tandem Club......

You're almost right about the five rule. Except that it's five times five and it's not strictly speaking a rule. But, essentially, member groups can't run rides for non-members unless they list them as events. Now......I considered running all the FNRttCs as events, but another consideration comes in to play, and that's this. If you do your job properly, but some numpty causes an injury, then you would want the injured person to have some recourse. And, for that reason, I decided that I wanted everybody on the ride to have 3rd party.

So we went 'affiliated'. The club affiliates to the CTC for a £25 set up fee and an annual fee of (iirc) £60 (although this year there's a bit of a special offer and I don't think we'll pay anything). Individuals join for £16. If you start signing up people regularly you may get the membership bods to set you up something like this... http://regonline.activeeurope.com/builder/site/Default.aspx?EventID=1088046 saving you the trouble of filling out forms and seeing cheques go astray in the post. Affiliate members get a card, discounts at shops, legal advice and so on....

So...if you're not bothered about people having 3rd party, register the rides as events. If you are, and I think you should be, go affiliated.
 

ASC1951

Guru
Location
Yorkshire
Now......I considered running all the FNRttCs as events, but another consideration comes in to play, and that's this. If you do your job properly, but some numpty causes an injury, then you would want the injured person to have some recourse. And, for that reason, I decided that I wanted everybody on the ride to have 3rd party..
That's a very sensible argument.

My point was that I wouldn't want to see people deterred from organising informal rides by a needless fear of litigation. The insurance industry would have us believe that every activity can land us in court, but it isn't true.
 
OP
OP
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sheddy

Legendary Member
Location
Suffolk
Thanks Dell, we are really only looking for Liability cover for the leaders/organisers, if a beginner has a crash and tries to blame us.

Just to clarify, I assume that the up to 5 'non member' means 'non CTC member'
If not, we could just give people membership to OUR club on the day for £1

The CTC talk of 'a one off event'. WTF does that mean?
If we ride to a different destination each month, would that be considered to be a one off event?
 

dellzeqq

pre-talced and mighty
Location
SW2
Thanks Dell, we are really only looking for Liability cover for the leaders/organisers, if a beginner has a crash and tries to blame us.

Just to clarify, I assume that the up to 5 'non member' means 'non CTC member'
If not, we could just give people membership to OUR club on the day for £1

The CTC talk of 'a one off event'. WTF does that mean?
If we ride to a different destination each month, would that be considered to be a one off event?
sorry, Sheddy, I skipped the detail.

yes - it means 5 non-CTC members. The rule (which is actually a guideline) is that you can have five non-members on any one ride, and that any non-member can come five times. Hence '5x5'.

as to the definition of one-off events - I think you have to set out your programme to the CTC and see if they buy it as a series of one-off events. I know of one CTC group that does pretty much what you're planning and they are covered. The best thing to do is to send an e-mail to Rob Fuller - but bear in mind he's super-busy, so give him some time.

ASC is right. The chances of a claim are small, but we did have one crash in which a member ploughed in to another member, and, while there was no thought of litigation in the mind of the victim, from my point of view, (if nobody else's), the 3rd party was a comfort. And........the 3rd party is for the year, not just for CTC rides, so if the cyclist is whacked, claims, and then faces a counterclaim he or she can still proceed with the claim. Many of our members recoup some of their money through shop discounts (although the mere mention of The Fridays at one shop takes you to discount heaven)
 

ASC1951

Guru
Location
Yorkshire
That's the lawyers, ASC...
Not me, m'Lud - I never touched PI work.

But don't just blame the lawyers. HMG withdrew legal aid for personal injury claims and replaced it with no-win-no-fee arrangements so - gosh, what a surprise! - the system is flooded with undeserving cases which rely on blackmail and extortion.
 

dellzeqq

pre-talced and mighty
Location
SW2
Not me, m'Lud - I never touched PI work.

But don't just blame the lawyers. HMG withdrew legal aid for personal injury claims and replaced it with no-win-no-fee arrangements so - gosh, what a surprise! - the system is flooded with undeserving cases which rely on blackmail and extortion.
could you expand on that a bit......
 
OP
OP
S

sheddy

Legendary Member
Location
Suffolk
I think I've misunderstood the Affiliated groups and Member groups rules and just assumed they were the same..
see http://www.ctc.org.uk/node/5624

If one studies the documents for AG and MG back to back then -

Affiliated Groups - not more than 5 (my club) members
Member Groups - not more than 5 (CTC) members

So we could just give beginners annual membership of our club on the day for say £1 or summat.
This should cover us organisers against any claims.
 
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