Recommendations on a bike
- Thread starter zand3r
- Start date
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sgw
New Member
Hello and welcome Zand3r
I am a firm believer that almost any bike can make a tourer. Obviously some more than others and a dedicated design likely to be better than an all purpose. Unfortunately I am not over familiar with recent models and prices.
However at that price (£200 ish?) I feel that compromises will have had to be made. It is likely that these compromises will be in the components fitted. I note for example that it is fitted with Tourney dérailleurs. I am sure these are serviceable and reliable for casual recreational use but not so sure they would be up to the demands of regular touring. They would do it, but for how long? The choice of low end dérailleurs would lead me to the suspicion that costs have been trimmed elsewhere, hubs being a prime consideration especially as you are likely to be carrying gear. It is also on the heavy side. Personally I don't like sus forks on anything but a dedicated off roader and even then only for serious off road fun and not for touring.
Imagine a £200 roadster in comparison with your TCR! Just because some of us plod along like geriatric snails, don't think that touring doesn't make high demands on components.
I would hate to come across as a someone who thinks only the best will do and it can't be done with anything else (I am far from it) but I think you might find better options. End of season clearances of last years model often getting you a bike one grade up from the usual at that price. Another £100 or so will give you a lot more chance but doesn't it always. The second hand market could provide an excellent bike at that sort of price but it would also be easy to end up with a worn out excellent bike which could cost as much to refurb. Being already familiar with bikes you should be able to avoid that.
I am sure someone will be along soon with a lot more knowledge than me of current model ranges and might well have some good recommendations.
I am a firm believer that almost any bike can make a tourer. Obviously some more than others and a dedicated design likely to be better than an all purpose. Unfortunately I am not over familiar with recent models and prices.
However at that price (£200 ish?) I feel that compromises will have had to be made. It is likely that these compromises will be in the components fitted. I note for example that it is fitted with Tourney dérailleurs. I am sure these are serviceable and reliable for casual recreational use but not so sure they would be up to the demands of regular touring. They would do it, but for how long? The choice of low end dérailleurs would lead me to the suspicion that costs have been trimmed elsewhere, hubs being a prime consideration especially as you are likely to be carrying gear. It is also on the heavy side. Personally I don't like sus forks on anything but a dedicated off roader and even then only for serious off road fun and not for touring.
Imagine a £200 roadster in comparison with your TCR! Just because some of us plod along like geriatric snails, don't think that touring doesn't make high demands on components.
I would hate to come across as a someone who thinks only the best will do and it can't be done with anything else (I am far from it) but I think you might find better options. End of season clearances of last years model often getting you a bike one grade up from the usual at that price. Another £100 or so will give you a lot more chance but doesn't it always.
The second hand market could provide an excellent bike at that sort of price but it would also be easy to end up with a worn out excellent bike which could cost as much to refurb. Being already familiar with bikes you should be able to avoid that. I am sure someone will be along soon with a lot more knowledge than me of current model ranges and might well have some good recommendations.
MacB
Lover of things that come in 3's
- Location
- Farnborough, Hampshire
You need to start out by doing yourself a checklist, have a good think about how, where and how far you plan to ride. Then make a list of what's needed and compare that to available bike specs. Concentrate initially on deal breakers:-
price - what you can afford, how much you can spend on ongoing maintenance and if you know enough about bikes to buy secondhand without being sold a pup
suspension - it's designed for serious MTBing and what you get at the cheap end of the market isn't fit for that purpose. For general riding it just saps energy and adds weight, I would avoid any form of suspension unless you're spending a fair bit more. Personally I'd avoid it altogether but I wouldn't be doing any serious off roading. no suspension is fine for most, non-technical, off road riding.
frame material, wheel/tyre size and frame fittings - do you need mudguards, pannier rack/s, clearance for chunkier tyres, ability to run hub gears etc - these options will significantly reduce the amount of bikes you need to wade through
handlebars - frame geometry is often tied to the use of a certain type of handlebar, longer top tube for flat bars and shorter for drop bars. If you're cycling any distance then the ability to vary your hand position is very useful. Flat and trekking bars have a tubing diameter of 22.2mm and road bars 23.8mm. Bits aren't interchangeable between the two and conversions tend to work out quite costly.
For touring my starting point would always be a drop bar touring bike, have a look at the ranges at EBC:-
http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebw...&f_SupersetQRY=&f_SortOrderID=1&f_bct=c003155
They offer some very good prices on bikes of all types and they have a good reputation, as do Decathlon if you have one near you. Personally I think you'd need to be nearer the £500 mark to get something for touring that can handle what you throw at it and give a turn of speed.
price - what you can afford, how much you can spend on ongoing maintenance and if you know enough about bikes to buy secondhand without being sold a pup
suspension - it's designed for serious MTBing and what you get at the cheap end of the market isn't fit for that purpose. For general riding it just saps energy and adds weight, I would avoid any form of suspension unless you're spending a fair bit more. Personally I'd avoid it altogether but I wouldn't be doing any serious off roading. no suspension is fine for most, non-technical, off road riding.
frame material, wheel/tyre size and frame fittings - do you need mudguards, pannier rack/s, clearance for chunkier tyres, ability to run hub gears etc - these options will significantly reduce the amount of bikes you need to wade through
handlebars - frame geometry is often tied to the use of a certain type of handlebar, longer top tube for flat bars and shorter for drop bars. If you're cycling any distance then the ability to vary your hand position is very useful. Flat and trekking bars have a tubing diameter of 22.2mm and road bars 23.8mm. Bits aren't interchangeable between the two and conversions tend to work out quite costly.
For touring my starting point would always be a drop bar touring bike, have a look at the ranges at EBC:-
http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebw...&f_SupersetQRY=&f_SortOrderID=1&f_bct=c003155
They offer some very good prices on bikes of all types and they have a good reputation, as do Decathlon if you have one near you. Personally I think you'd need to be nearer the £500 mark to get something for touring that can handle what you throw at it and give a turn of speed.
Hi Guys,
To start off with, I'm in a 3rd world country (Zimbabwe) so most bikes are hard to come by or expensive to import.
I'm not so keen on the front suspension, having been on 'solid' frames my entire life.
My budget for a tourer is around 1700-1800USD. (My TCR cost 1800)
Panniers, bikes and other cycling kit is regarded as "luxury" items by our govt, so duty is heavy upon import (40-70% of the value, with another 15% for vat)
Most people think i'm nuts spending so much on a bike (You can buy a small car for that price locally).
I've cycled 372km from Harare to kariba when i was 17, on an old Haro MTB. Managed an avg speed of about 22kph. Made a mistake when i packed, forgot sunscreen, got there and was very badly burnt. Couln't cycle for about 3 weeks afterwards!
Cycled to Chinoyi a while after. (+-120km)
Planning on doing Harare-Bulawayo soon, (440km) and then Harare-beitbridge. (600km) after.
Slowly working my way up to the larger trips. I cycle 40-50km a day, sometimes more depending on which route i take to work.
With regards to panniers and carrying equipment, how much weight do you guys normally carry?
To start off with, I'm in a 3rd world country (Zimbabwe) so most bikes are hard to come by or expensive to import.
I'm not so keen on the front suspension, having been on 'solid' frames my entire life.
My budget for a tourer is around 1700-1800USD. (My TCR cost 1800)
Panniers, bikes and other cycling kit is regarded as "luxury" items by our govt, so duty is heavy upon import (40-70% of the value, with another 15% for vat)
Most people think i'm nuts spending so much on a bike (You can buy a small car for that price locally).
I've cycled 372km from Harare to kariba when i was 17, on an old Haro MTB. Managed an avg speed of about 22kph. Made a mistake when i packed, forgot sunscreen, got there and was very badly burnt. Couln't cycle for about 3 weeks afterwards!
Cycled to Chinoyi a while after. (+-120km)
Planning on doing Harare-Bulawayo soon, (440km) and then Harare-beitbridge. (600km) after.
Slowly working my way up to the larger trips. I cycle 40-50km a day, sometimes more depending on which route i take to work.
With regards to panniers and carrying equipment, how much weight do you guys normally carry?
vernon
Harder than Ronnie Pickering
- Location
- Meanwood, Leeds
Tourers use the same group sets as road bikes correct?
If so, i can move my dura ace kit from my TCR to the new tourer. (If they're compatible) Will get new dura kit for the TCR later on
As for brakes, are 105's good enough for long distance trips? I've done about 3500-4000km on my current 105's without having to replace the pads. Original chain as well. My Dura kit gives me hassles occasionally, seems to be very sensitive to dust/dirt being on the chain/cassette. I've heard Tiagra is slightly more reliable than the Dura, but cannot give a personal opinion. The only difference i felt when changing from Tiagra to Dura was that the gear changing felt alot more smooth and quicker.
If so, i can move my dura ace kit from my TCR to the new tourer. (If they're compatible) Will get new dura kit for the TCR later on
As for brakes, are 105's good enough for long distance trips? I've done about 3500-4000km on my current 105's without having to replace the pads. Original chain as well. My Dura kit gives me hassles occasionally, seems to be very sensitive to dust/dirt being on the chain/cassette. I've heard Tiagra is slightly more reliable than the Dura, but cannot give a personal opinion. The only difference i felt when changing from Tiagra to Dura was that the gear changing felt alot more smooth and quicker.
I am afraid you are wrong. Tourers need much lower gears than you can achieve with road components (unless you travel ultralight). They need rear mechs that can take a 34t cassette. They also either need triples or ultra compact doubles (46-30 or even 42-26). Also, they need wider tyres than the 25-8 mm you can fit under road brakes. Again, unles you are talking credit card touring they need 135mm rear hubs. So forget about using an existing DA group. You are much better off with something new and dedicated, i.e. a judicious mix of road and mtb parts, mixed to suit precisely your style of touring.
Willem
Willem
My quick checklist:
- handlebars? You can tour with drop or flat bars;
- gearing? Low gearing but depends on where you're riding and your riding style ( high cadence or low cadence)
rack mounts? There are workarounds for bikes without them (and of course trailers) but a good thing to have;
- tyre clearance. You can tour on bikes with skinnier tyres, but it's best to have the flexibility to fit fatter tyres (eg 38c). Look for a chainstay length of at least 410mm.
- handlebars? You can tour with drop or flat bars;
- gearing? Low gearing but depends on where you're riding and your riding style ( high cadence or low cadence)
rack mounts? There are workarounds for bikes without them (and of course trailers) but a good thing to have;
- tyre clearance. You can tour on bikes with skinnier tyres, but it's best to have the flexibility to fit fatter tyres (eg 38c). Look for a chainstay length of at least 410mm.
sgw
New Member
If you read that thread that Vernon linked to you will see that there are almost as many opinions on weight as there are riders. You will need to decide what is right for you.
I am surprised you were looking at that Boulder if your budget is 1700-1800USD. How much is the Boulder out there? It's available for around £200 here in UK! What is the situation on importing second hand components? If it is less tax than new you could save quite a bit that way. Between the various forums sale boards and the bigger auction site you could find all you need.
What are the roads like you expect to cover btw, that could affect the type of bike you need.
And don't forget the sun creme next time.
I am surprised you were looking at that Boulder if your budget is 1700-1800USD. How much is the Boulder out there? It's available for around £200 here in UK! What is the situation on importing second hand components? If it is less tax than new you could save quite a bit that way. Between the various forums sale boards and the bigger auction site you could find all you need.
What are the roads like you expect to cover btw, that could affect the type of bike you need.
And don't forget the sun creme next time.
I will definitely swap flat bars for drop bars, makes for a more comfortable ride IMO.
The boulder costs ~700-800USD locally. As for importing second hand equipment, they charge VAT & Duty on the open market value & what they believe is the actual value. So most likely would be charged the full (new) value of the bike.
I know i can drive to South Africa and import up to USD350 of goods duty-free, but the cost of driving there and back would drive the bikes cost up immensely! Bus's are out the question, as they don't allow bikes on board.
Looking at a mix of dirt & road cycling.. Most people will say a Zimbabwean dirt road is better than a tarred one!
Racks would be the only way forward for me, i don't like the idea of a third wheel.
Was looking at importing panniers, but i think it will be considerably cheaper to go to a tailor and get them made!
As for the 135mm hubs, possible to change hubs after purchasing the bike? Pricing and recommendations on a
decent model? If its small enough i could probably get it send via post/FedEx.
Will definitely be using fat tackies, as the potholes in Africa are very bad. I have hit a few when racing down the high way on my TCR, gave me quite a fright each time! My bike gets a full service once a month, just to make sure everything is 100s
The boulder costs ~700-800USD locally. As for importing second hand equipment, they charge VAT & Duty on the open market value & what they believe is the actual value. So most likely would be charged the full (new) value of the bike.
I know i can drive to South Africa and import up to USD350 of goods duty-free, but the cost of driving there and back would drive the bikes cost up immensely! Bus's are out the question, as they don't allow bikes on board.
Looking at a mix of dirt & road cycling.. Most people will say a Zimbabwean dirt road is better than a tarred one!
Racks would be the only way forward for me, i don't like the idea of a third wheel.
Was looking at importing panniers, but i think it will be considerably cheaper to go to a tailor and get them made!
As for the 135mm hubs, possible to change hubs after purchasing the bike? Pricing and recommendations on a
decent model? If its small enough i could probably get it send via post/FedEx.
Will definitely be using fat tackies, as the potholes in Africa are very bad. I have hit a few when racing down the high way on my TCR, gave me quite a fright each time! My bike gets a full service once a month, just to make sure everything is 100s
sgw
New Member
The boulder costs ~700-800USD locally. As for importing second hand equipment, they charge VAT & Duty on the open market value & what they believe is the actual value. So most likely would be charged the full (new) value of the bike.
As for the 135mm hubs, possible to change hubs after purchasing the bike? Pricing and recommendations on a
decent model? If its small enough i could probably get it send via post/FedEx.
I see what you are up against.
What other manufacturers models are available to you? I am sure someone would be able to recommend something better than the Boulder within your budget.
OK, now the picture is much clearer. What you need is a rugged expedition tourer with 26 inch wheels and sturdy tyres. What you do not want is front suspension, inferior racks or cheapo machine built wheels. Those are the parts that fail in the third world. The cheapest fullly expedition ready bike that I can think of is the German Fahrradmanufaktur T400, but it is above your budget. They do a cheaper Deore version at 699 euro (minus vat in your case).
The alternative would be to look around locally for a good quality older mtb with rigid front fork. Spend most of your budget on importing high quality handbuilt wheels (ExalSP19/Sputnik rims with LX hubs) and a Tubus Cargo rear rack. The Bikebuddy is great for fitting large water bottles to your frame. The 26x2.0 Schwalbe Marathon Plus Tour is a heavy and slow but indestructable tyre for your purpose. With luck, you may still be able to get the older Marathon XR. The modern Marathon Extreme is wonderful, but will wear out much faster, and is very expensive.
I hope this helps a bit.
The alternative would be to look around locally for a good quality older mtb with rigid front fork. Spend most of your budget on importing high quality handbuilt wheels (ExalSP19/Sputnik rims with LX hubs) and a Tubus Cargo rear rack. The Bikebuddy is great for fitting large water bottles to your frame. The 26x2.0 Schwalbe Marathon Plus Tour is a heavy and slow but indestructable tyre for your purpose. With luck, you may still be able to get the older Marathon XR. The modern Marathon Extreme is wonderful, but will wear out much faster, and is very expensive.
I hope this helps a bit.
Rather spend more now on a better bike that will last longer, than spend less on an inferior one and end up spending more than the difference on spares & repairs.
I could prob get a bike through the south Africa-Zimbabwe border without duty as its not for resale, could claim it was a gift etc..
The Fahrradmanufaktur T400 looks good, any ideas on what they normally go for?
I could probably get a second hand rigid MTB frame here for 300-400 bucks.
I'm no bike guru, but what are the things to look out for when getting a second hand bike? Normally i always check for dents, cracks in the frame, damaged rims, check the derailer+cassete. Normally don't stress about brakes, as those are easy to fix/replace.
Found out that drop bars are 150-300USD locally.
Was having a debate with a mate over the pros&cons of disk brakes vs calipers, personally think calipers are more reliable and easier to fix. That said disk brakes are less affected by water, which is a huge plus.
I've done some inquiring about getting panniers made locally, seems our local tailors are not keen to make custom equipment! Will have to import...
I'm ordering a UL Backpacker from Hennesy Hammocks. The reviews are excellent, it works out to ~300USD to get to Zimbabwe. Looking forward to that arriving!
Responses on cc forums have been excellent! Really appreciate the assistance guys
I could prob get a bike through the south Africa-Zimbabwe border without duty as its not for resale, could claim it was a gift etc..
The Fahrradmanufaktur T400 looks good, any ideas on what they normally go for?
I could probably get a second hand rigid MTB frame here for 300-400 bucks.
I'm no bike guru, but what are the things to look out for when getting a second hand bike? Normally i always check for dents, cracks in the frame, damaged rims, check the derailer+cassete. Normally don't stress about brakes, as those are easy to fix/replace.
Found out that drop bars are 150-300USD locally.
Was having a debate with a mate over the pros&cons of disk brakes vs calipers, personally think calipers are more reliable and easier to fix. That said disk brakes are less affected by water, which is a huge plus.
I've done some inquiring about getting panniers made locally, seems our local tailors are not keen to make custom equipment!
Will have to import... I'm ordering a UL Backpacker from Hennesy Hammocks. The reviews are excellent, it works out to ~300USD to get to Zimbabwe. Looking forward to that arriving!
Responses on cc forums have been excellent! Really appreciate the assistance guys
The Fahrdamanufaktur T 400 XT (mostly LX/SLX) is about 1200 euro, including VAT. The Deore version (with a lot of Alivio) is 700 euro, including vat. See: http://www.fahrradma....de/?page_id=62 If you are keen on drop bars, a better bet may be the Surly Long Haul Trucker with 26 inch wheels. It comes with drop bars, so there is less to swap, and it is similarly high quality for real cycling in tough conditions. See http://surlybikes.co...ucker_complete/ You will need a rear rack as well - get a Tubus Cargo 26 (unless you have very big feet): http://www.tubus.com/en/rear-carriers It is the rack of choice for third world cyclists. Ortlieb classic panniers are the best you can get - their City Line is lighter and cheaper, but lacks the straps at the top. See: http://www.ortlieb.de/index_white.php?lang=en&m1=0&m2=0&file=p-search.php Look at the Bikebuddy MK3 for transporting a lot of water (and fuel) on your frame: http://www.bikebuddy.co.uk/
Willem
Willem
