What's a good headset?

[PpPete]

OK so I know my around brakes, drive-trains, wheel-building, etc but my knowledge has a big black hole. There that's my shameful secret out in the open.

All my bikes to date have used old-skool threaded steerers & quill stems.
My knowledge of threadless systems is pretty rudimentary.... but I want to get "up to speed" on this, and I've struggled to find the right information from manufacturer's & retailers ebsites.

I'm looking at new frames which take 1-1/8 (not integrated type) headsets.
I believe that the ordinary star-fangled nuts should not be used on carbon steerers?
But most headsets seem to have these star-fangled nuts. So which models are suitable for carbon sterers?
Is the Hope Hed-Doctor system suitable for carbon?

Any particular recommendations from you good peeps ?

TBH budget constaints will probably mean I get carbon forks with aluminium steerer so star nut will be OK (?) but it looks like a horribly crude piece of engineering to my untutored eye. What (if anything) is better ?

Fitting it - this is probably the only job I'll take to LBS, even though I've fitted threaded headsets on steel frames in the past, (with a home-made headset press) I think on a new bike it's too much of risk without the proper tools.

 

[accountantpete]

Basically I'd get the LBS to select and install the headset and forks - once they have been set up you can take them apart and understand the set up far better than any reading about it can convey.

Forks with a carbon steerer use a bung instead of the star fangled nut to achieve exactly the same purpose ie draw the forks up tight. You also have to be careful when tightening up the stem so as not to crack the carbon steerer.

CF forks with alloy steerers work perfectly fine but are slightly heavier - though you don't need to worry about the stem tightening bit.

If you are buying a frame without forks then you need to do a bit of research as to what offset or rake you need on the forks so as to avoid toe overlap when turning etc.

 

[e-rider]

are you talking about road forks? Most carbon road forks are now designed for use with internal or integrated headsets

you can buy a carbon bung type plug anywhere to replace the star fangled nut (don't worry about having to have one included with the headset - although that would save a few quid)

Apart from extra weight, carbon forks with alu steerer makes much more sense in every other way.

 

[RecordAceFromNew]

OK so I know my around brakes, drive-trains, wheel-building, etc but my knowledge has a big black hole. There that's my shameful secret out in the open.

Blimey, only one black hole! They are more like a constellation here...

This might help a little in terms of standards and choices.

 

[PpPete]

Blimey, only one black hole! They are more like a constellation here...

This might help a little in terms of standards and choices.

Too modest RAFN.... your posts on Know How have generally been

• accurate
• better worded than mine would have been
• faster than I could reply

Thanks for that link - very thorough.

______________________

Thanks to Tundragumski too - another prince among posters on here. I hadnt realise one could just ditch the star nut and replace it with a bung. All beginning to make sense now.

 

[RecordAceFromNew]

Pete you are too kind. A problem of mine, is that the lack of real knowledge, or going off topic, have never stopped me giving an opinion either!

A prime example is this, although I have no idea which frame and fork you might have in mind, if I were you I would probably steer well clear of a fork with a carbon steerer if I can. The reasons?

1. As far as I can see the only advantage a carbon steerer can have over an alloy one is weight, and nothing else, while there are a number of potentially serious disadvantages.

2. In terms of weight, I have absolutely no knowledge what the saving is, but I figure it is 50 grams plus or minus a little. Why? Firstly I suspect a steerer has to be made rather like a seatpost, to withstand huge bending moment and clamping force, and it is not difficult to show that decent, cheap alloy posts are at most say 50g to 100g heavier than the expensive carbon counterparts, and they are longer than steerers. Secondly, a quick look at the weight weenie database comparing the few where there is a choice confirms it.


On the other hand, since you are in the market for one, there can be quite a difference in weight between a "standard" headset and a light headset, which imho carries little or no serious safety risk. For example, if you look at fsa's catalogue, some Orbits are half the weight of the trusty Pig, saving 100g, and they only cost a couple of £s more on the net. I have no experience of the 100g Orbits, but if they are in any way similar to my 100g Campag Record, one does need to take care installing it. The Record's alloy shell is made of cheese, albeit nice cheese.

 

[PpPete]

I'm with you most of the way ... would always rather spend less ££ if the only advantage is a few grams, especially if the lighter, more expensive item is potentially less robust anyway. Which is why I'm tending towards Ti frames for new bike rather than CF.

But since Ti forks are pretty much non-existent I'm assuming that I'll have to compromise and go CF for the forks.

What puts me off about carbon forks with alloy steerers - is not the weight at all but the join between the two materials. I'm sure it's all been properly thought out, but my gut instinct is that join is always going to be a potential weak point.

 

[RecordAceFromNew]

I understand your concern. If you are weighing that risk, if not already you might want to know that even some carbon forks with carbon steerers, as shown by Easton here, are two-piece construction. Certainly a complex matrix of pros and cons is present, not least when they all come with different rake, weight etc...