Wheelbuilding

[winjim]

If anyone's been following my posts, they'll realise that I have two bikes with damaged rear wheels, so now seems like a good time to start having a go at wheel repair and building. The Genesis has knackered spokes due to a badly adjusted rear mech, and the Bianchi has a broken freehub. I intend to replace the spokes on the Genesis, keeping the existing hub and rim, and replace the hub on the Bianchi, keeping the existing spokes and rim.

So, what do I need? I was thinking of getting a Campagnolo Record hub http://www.wiggle.co.uk/campagnolo-record-10-speed-rear-hub/ as I know very little about hub manufacturers but I trust that a Record hub will be pretty decent, and it goes with the groupset on the bike anyway. If I'm successful at the rear I may do the front as well, and future plans for the Genesis may include fitting a dyno-hub. As far as spokes go, what should I look for? Barring aero blades, is a spoke a spoke essentially? And I assume I'll need replacement rim tape. Anything else?

Regarding tools, I'll obviously need a good trueing stand, so any recommendations? I don't really want to spend more than about 100 quid. I've seen some folding stands that appeal as they would be easy to store, but I'm concerned that the folding nature of them might make them prone to error. Or how about this one from CRC? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/x-tools-pro-mechanic-wheel-truing-stand/rp-prod122322 It looks a similar style to the Park TS2.2 but more within my budget. Any other tools? Is a spoke tension meter necessary? I have a spoke key.

Advice welcome as always

 

[Yellow Saddle]

You can't do that. Not in that way, in anyway.
Of you change the hub (with a different one) , the new hub will have different dimensions than the old one and you can't re-use your spokes.
Same for rim. You have to exchange like for like.
On the wheel with the chain damage to the spoke, only replace the set (8 for 32 spoke, 9 for 36 spoke etc) that gets damaged by the chain, i.e. the outbound spokes. This is relatively easy. You'd simply remove the old ones, measure, order and replace. You'd use common sense and mark what goes where, take photos of the crossings on the old wheel etc for reference. Then, do exactly the same to every spoke. If you turn the nipple ten times on the first spoke, you do that for each spoke. That will give you a reasonable true wheel before even staring to true it.
Replacing a hub is a different story. It is a complete wheelbuild.

 

[Yellow Saddle]

I had a look at the link. That hub is superb. The best of the best. Mine (same design) is from 2002 and has done about 140 000 km on its original bearings. However, it differs in that it has a grease port - just inject fresh grease and go.

Tools. You can build your wheel on an upside down bike and improvise for the guides or get a folding stand. The accuracy isn't reliant on the stand unless it is a really rubbish, floppy one. You do need a dishing tool though. The ParkTool current one is crap but their original one (WAG-1) is superb, if you can get that somewhere. You don't need a spoke tension meter, ever. Spoke key? If you have one with multiple slots for different sized nipples, chuck it. Get a Spokey. Yellow.

 

[winjim]

Having just looked at my rims, they are 28H so i couldn't use that hub. My choice then I suppose is either find a 28H hub to use with my existing rim or to buy a new 32H rim to use with that hub. I think it depends on whether I want a repair job that will do for now, or to try and make the best wheel I am able to. I don't really want to spend a ton on components and end up working beyond my expertise though.

Do you have any thoughts on rim choice? They all just look like loops of metal to me at the moment. Is weight a crucial factor? Strength?

Tool wise, if i can get away with using a cheaper folding stand then a dishing tool and a spokey will be within my means I'm sure.

 

[Smokin Joe]

You do need a dishing tool though.

I've never owned a dishing tool, though it would be convenient to have one. Just turn the wheel in the stand to make sure the rim is central. You can also cut your own dishing tool out of stiff cardboard once you know the OLN dimension and the width of the rim.

 

[RebornBumbler]

If it's a first attempt, and just for two wheels, I wouldn't bother getting a truing stand or dishing tool either.

I replaced two rims (Alex R500) with a pair of Mavic CXP22s (pretty much identical diameter) using the original spokes and hubs.
I Just used a couple of cable ties on the rear stays and forks as my 'stand', and flipped the rear a few times to check dishing as I went along.

Of course, If you're going to make a habit of wheelbuilding, then buy all the tools!

 

[lpretro1]

if you are new to it t'would be better starting off with the front first as you don't have to worry about dish and spoke length is the same either side. That would give you a feel for spoke tension which is critical to building a good wheel - too slack no good too tight no good. Whatever you do go slowly slowly - don' try and rush and be patient. It would be worth buiybf Roegr Mussons book available on line which is very good and keeps it simple

 

[winjim]

if you are new to it t'would be better starting off with the front first as you don't have to worry about dish and spoke length is the same either side. That would give you a feel for spoke tension which is critical to building a good wheel - too slack no good too tight no good. Whatever you do go slowly slowly - don' try and rush and be patient. It would be worth buiybf Roegr Mussons book available on line which is very good and keeps it simple

I know building a front wheel would be easier and a good place to start. The issue is that my front wheels are fine, it's my rear wheels that are bust!

 

[Spoked Wheels]

Having just looked at my rims, they are 28H so i couldn't use that hub. My choice then I suppose is either find a 28H hub to use with my existing rim or to buy a new 32H rim to use with that hub. I think it depends on whether I want a repair job that will do for now, or to try and make the best wheel I am able to. I don't really want to spend a ton on components and end up working beyond my expertise though.

Do you have any thoughts on rim choice? They all just look like loops of metal to me at the moment. Is weight a crucial factor? Strength?

Tool wise, if i can get away with using a cheaper folding stand then a dishing tool and a spokey will be within my means I'm sure.

If the rim is still good and have plenty of miles in them then you should consider keeping it. If the hub is still OK then replace the damaged spokes and away you go. If either rim or hub need replacing then you need to see if you can find the same or it's very likely you will need to get new spokes too.

The truing stand you are referring to was on offer at £56 at Planet-X a couple of months ago and it looks a really good one for the money. Still worth having a look I think. If you're likely to want to do your own wheel building again then I'd say get a wheel truing stand, you wont regret it.

As for the dishing tool, I have the Park Tools 3 ( I think) it's not the latest but I like it better than the latest, version 4 I think.

Spoke key, I have a few and my favourite is the Spokey Pro in Red (Europe and USA). DT Swiss and Sapim nipples take the Red key, some spokes from the far east (Japan mainly I think) take the Yellow key but we see very few of them here.

 

[winjim]

If the rim is still good and have plenty of miles in them then you should consider keeping it. If the hub is still OK then replace the damaged spokes and away you go. If either rim or hub need replacing then you need to see if you can find the same or it's very likely you will need to get new spokes too.

The issue with replacing the hub with an identical one is that the freehub has suffered a catastrophic failure, I believe due to a manufacturing defect, causing me to lose faith in the brand.

I seem to be convincing myself to attempt a full build with all new components as I was eventually going to upgrade the wheelset anyway.

It would be worth buiybf Roegr Mussons book available on line which is very good and keeps it simple

Just downloaded it . Interesting that he seems keen on a basic 32H 3 cross wheel pretty much to the exclusion of all others.

 

[winjim]

Quick update in case anyone cares. Hubs (Campagnolo Record) and rims (DT Swiss RR440) have arrived, but LBS won't have the spokes in for another week, which should give me enough time to finish off my Roger Musson trueing stand and dishing tool.

 

[Thegreatthor]

Keep us up to dat how it goes. Been thinking of a similar task myself.

 

[S.Giles]

You can't do that. Not in that way, in anyway.
Of you change the hub (with a different one) , the new hub will have different dimensions than the old one and you can't re-use your spokes.

There is some leeway. I just replaced a worn out no-brand front hub with a Shimano and was able to re-use the Sapim Race spokes from the previous build with no problems, even though the hubs' measurements weren't identical. The geometry involved makes hub diameter less critical than would be imagined. There is an element of luck involved, I would concede.

Those silly wheels with totally radial spokes will be much more sensitive to spoke-length, though.

 

[andytheflyer]

That's odd Winjim - the RM trueing stand you made looks just like the one I made last year from RM's book. Except mine's white because I painted it. Must have got something right.

And the wheel I built isn't bad either. Mavic OpenPro 36H rim, Tiagra hub, double butted 3x spokes.

 

[winjim]

That's odd Winjim - the RM trueing stand you made looks just like the one I made last year from RM's book. Except mine's white because I painted it. Must have got something right.

Or we've both got it horribly wrong! I'm going to paint it up while I wait for the spokes to arrive, and I've got an idea for a dishing gauge I want to try. It's reassuring to know that you managed to build a good wheel with it