1.5 Metres in Cheshire, police education

[Hacienda71]

You liked a vid about the police letting crims off with an education session? Let's face it - they all passed the driving test, so should know close passing isn't allowed. What next? Sending axe-murderers off to 'safer woodcrafts' classes?

Better than them doing sweet fa. The legislation has been changed/clarified and not everyone is perfect and fully up-to-date. So yes I applaud the police for doing something about it. Far better than the apathy we see with a lot of crime.
Axe murderers tend to have intent, a close pass can be due to a previous lack of clarity to what a close pass actually is.

 

[Drago]

Axe murderers tend to have intent, a close pass can be due to a previous lack of clarity to what a close pass actually is.

Recklessness or negligence are every bit as deadly as intent.

When someone is on a mortuary slab it's a moot point as to whether their killer intended to put them there or not. Put them there they simply did.

Drivers make a choice as to how they conduct themselves on the road. Despite the language that is often used you cant 'accidentally' be negligent.

The choice is binary - drive diligently, or don't. There is no shade of grey that is a bit naughty but somehow understandable. Thats a fiction perpetuated by politicians because to be seen to clamp down on motorists, no matter how deserving, is a vote loser.

Every driver knows exactly what a close pass is. If they don't they shouldn't be behind the wheel in the first place.

 

[Hacienda71]

If there was no difference between intent and recklessness there would be no difference in sentencing, which there clearly is.

 

[classic33]

Indeed. I don't see shoplifters getting the benefit of opting for a "don't go shoplifiting" course to escape the consequences of their offending without sanction.

Yet a sector of society that kills 5 and maims over 80 every day enjoy just that.

I've been in the court when the shoplifter caught the month before has been given a rehabilitation course*, rather than a fine or community service order.

*Course was voluntary, and to show them where they went wrong. At least that's how it was explained at the time, to me and the shoplifter.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

Anyway, life was good 40 years ago. I had hair for a start!

You still do, it’s just migrated south …

 

[Ming the Merciless]

a close pass can be due to a previous lack of clarity to what a close pass actually is.

Bollocks they didn‘t know

 

[Hacienda71]

Bollocks they didn‘t know

It is not Bollocks or they wouldn't have defined what is safe in the eyes of the law..... 🤡

 

[Ming the Merciless]

It is not Bollocks or they wouldn't have defined what is safe in the eyes of the law..... 🤡

They had to do that as many drivers will take the piss unless chance of being prosecuted. To say you don’t know what a close pass is, is to admit your driving isn’t up to the required standard.

 

[Hacienda71]

They had to do that as many drivers will take the piss unless chance of being prosecuted. To say you don’t know what a close pass is, is to admit your driving isn’t up to the required standard.

No the wording was vague and open to misinterpretation, hence the new published guidance.

 

[I like Skol]

IMO good on Cheshire police.

I leisure cycle mostly in greater Manchester, Cheshire and Derbyshire. I commute from G.M to Cheshire and back, so will hopefully be directly affected by this campaign.

The people committing close passes fall into 5 categories by my reckoning.

1, Oblivious. These people just shouldn't have been allowed behind the wheel in the first place and have no clue what is going on in the world around them.

2, Impatient. Know they are probably getting a bit close but judge it is no/low risk, and Christ! we'll be here all day if we wait until we can leave 1.5m gap....

3, Spiteful. I'm not moving for a cyclist, they shouldn't even be on the road and they don't pay any road tax. In fact I will get closer just to show them who's boss.

4. Distracted. Looking at phones, talking to passengers, lost and looking for signs, generally not giving full 100% attention to the important businesses of piloting a vehicle.

5. Unaware. Doesn't know why or that they should give more clearance to cyclists and has never ridden a bicycle on the road so ignorant of the fear a close pass can induce in a cyclist. Similar to the driver described in #1 but also very different.

The police campaign may help enlighten/educate people who fall into categories 2, 4 & 5?

Category 1 just can't be helped and shouldn't be allowed to drive. How do you take these people off the road?

#3, all we can hope is that they offend enough to lose their licence!

The police may not be able to fix everything but this can only help make things better?

 

[Gunk]

IMO good on Cheshire police.

I leisure cycle mostly in greater Manchester, Cheshire and Derbyshire. I commute from G.M to Cheshire and back, so will hopefully be directly affected by this campaign.

The people committing close passes fall into 5 categories by my reckoning.

1, Oblivious. These people just shouldn't have been allowed behind the wheel in the first place and have no clue what is going on in the world around them.

2, Impatient. Know they are probably getting a bit close but judge it is no/low risk, and Christ! we'll be here all day if we wait until we can leave 1.5m gap....

3, Spiteful. I'm not moving for a cyclist, they shouldn't even be on the road and they don't pay any road tax. In fact I will get closer just to show them who's boss.

4. Distracted. Looking at phones, talking to passengers, lost and looking for signs, generally not giving full 100% attention to the important businesses of piloting a vehicle.

5. Unaware. Doesn't know why or that they should give more clearance to cyclists and has never ridden a bicycle on the road so ignorant of the fear a close pass can induce in a cyclist. Similar to the driver described in #1 but also very different.

The police campaign may help enlighten/educate people who fall into categories 2, 4 & 5?

Category 1 just can't be helped and shouldn't be allowed to drive. How do you take these people off the road?

#3, all we can hope is that they offend enough to lose their licence!

The police may not be able to fix everything but this can only help make things better?

That’s a pretty reasonable summary of the driving I’ve witnessed in Aylesbury this week whilst getting my son ready for his driving test.

 

[Webbo2]

IMO good on Cheshire police.

I leisure cycle mostly in greater Manchester, Cheshire and Derbyshire. I commute from G.M to Cheshire and back, so will hopefully be directly affected by this campaign.

The people committing close passes fall into 5 categories by my reckoning.

1, Oblivious. These people just shouldn't have been allowed behind the wheel in the first place and have no clue what is going on in the world around them.

2, Impatient. Know they are probably getting a bit close but judge it is no/low risk, and Christ! we'll be here all day if we wait until we can leave 1.5m gap....

3, Spiteful. I'm not moving for a cyclist, they shouldn't even be on the road and they don't pay any road tax. In fact I will get closer just to show them who's boss.

4. Distracted. Looking at phones, talking to passengers, lost and looking for signs, generally not giving full 100% attention to the important businesses of piloting a vehicle.

5. Unaware. Doesn't know why or that they should give more clearance to cyclists and has never ridden a bicycle on the road so ignorant of the fear a close pass can induce in a cyclist. Similar to the driver described in #1 but also very different.

The police campaign may help enlighten/educate people who fall into categories 2, 4 & 5?

Category 1 just can't be helped and shouldn't be allowed to drive. How do you take these people off the road?

#3, all we can hope is that they offend enough to lose their licence!

The police may not be able to fix everything but this can only help make things better?

Just one other thing you and Ming, not twins by any chance.

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

IMO good on Cheshire police.

I leisure cycle mostly in greater Manchester, Cheshire and Derbyshire. I commute from G.M to Cheshire and back, so will hopefully be directly affected by this campaign.

The people committing close passes fall into 5 categories by my reckoning.

1, Oblivious. These people just shouldn't have been allowed behind the wheel in the first place and have no clue what is going on in the world around them.

2, Impatient. Know they are probably getting a bit close but judge it is no/low risk, and Christ! we'll be here all day if we wait until we can leave 1.5m gap....

3, Spiteful. I'm not moving for a cyclist, they shouldn't even be on the road and they don't pay any road tax. In fact I will get closer just to show them who's boss.

4. Distracted. Looking at phones, talking to passengers, lost and looking for signs, generally not giving full 100% attention to the important businesses of piloting a vehicle.

5. Unaware. Doesn't know why or that they should give more clearance to cyclists and has never ridden a bicycle on the road so ignorant of the fear a close pass can induce in a cyclist. Similar to the driver described in #1 but also very different.

The police campaign may help enlighten/educate people who fall into categories 2, 4 & 5?

Category 1 just can't be helped and shouldn't be allowed to drive. How do you take these people off the road?

#3, all we can hope is that they offend enough to lose their licence!

The police may not be able to fix everything but this can only help make things better?

Good summary

If the Police start stopping people more often one of the main effects will just be making people aware

i.e. marketing - but of a good sort
same applies to people looking at phone - the more people are stopped and it gets in the papers the better

I do remember many years ago being told that I should answer my phone when driving for work
and refusing but saying if I heard the phone ring I would pull off at the next opportunity, stop and ring back
The manager saying that I should answer was stunned that I would say this - replied with
"I always answer when I'm driving" - and this was before hand-free were integrated !

 

[Dadam]

*Course was voluntary, and to show them where they went wrong. At least that's how it was explained at the time, to me and the shoplifter.

Surely that was between the shelves and the door... they missed the bit with the tills.

 

[Dogtrousers]

On Saturday I was riding on a road with reasonable sight lines and a few bends so a little bit of diligence was needed to overtake me but not much. I was overtaken on a clear straight section by a string of, say, 4 cars. The first two, perfectly good. The third, who had obviously seen what the first two had done - skimmed past. The fourth, perfectly good again.

No 3 had to fall into @I like Skol 's class 3, spiteful. They had just watched the two cars in front make a manoevre and thought "nah, I don't need to do that". OK, being generous they could have been a 1.Oblivious.