FNRttC 2017 (that's next year, folks) thinking ride thread

[AKA Bob]

Having done a quick search the choice of Accomodation for 20 plus people is very limited. Interestingly a slightly run down chateau near Brix was top the list.......

 

[Moodyman]

I agree with TMN.

If we're doing a July tour it seems odd to overlook the UK. Weather is generally good, no language issues and we avoid the logistics headaches.

Sure we may lack dedicated bike paths but I didn't think the Dutch bricks or the Belgian cobbles were that great.

i'm sure a flatter, quieter route can be found on the Eastern side of the U.K.

 

[User482]

I agree with TMN.

If we're doing a July tour it seems odd to overlook the UK. Weather is generally good, no language issues and we avoid the logistics headaches.

Sure we may lack dedicated bike paths but I didn't think the Dutch bricks or the Belgian cobbles were that great.

i'm sure a flatter, quieter route can be found on the Eastern side of the U.K.

Other benefits: the travel is cheaper, logistically easier, and would allow for people doing part of the tour (say over a long weekend).

ETA: Eastern England was mentioned, but where? As a "for instance", York to Edinburgh via Newcastle, Northumberland coast and Berwick is about 400km, mostly on quiet roads, not too hilly, and has easy access to mainline trains, allowing people to join/ leave as they wish.

 

[mmmmartin]

My thoughts on recent comments:
UK - you're suggesting asking peeps to use a week of their annual holiday to ride in Lincolnshire when they could just as easily go to the continent. And, for those in the south, getting to Dover with a bike is much easier than getting to, say, Newcastle. Hotel accommodation is slightly cheaper on the continent - and in the Lowlands using the vrienden op de fiets for accommodation at €20 a night for B&B is much cheaper.
I also think that it's much easier for anyone who really wants to tour in the UK to do it themselves, while going to the continent is more daunting and going with the club makes it much easier.
Themes: nope. I'm with TMN on this, it's really great to have a short talk at a short stop if we go past something of interest but the easiest way to put people off a tour is to tell them they'll have lots of talks about historical battles.
A centre-based tour: really difficult to find one place big enough, so we'd be scattered around the countryside, some distance apart. And where to go? Near the hook of Holland for a whole week? Caen for a week? Calais? Dunkirk? St Malo for a whole week?
@srw summed up the parameters very well, and @StuartG is right in that returning to the lowlands doesn't stretch the envelope but I am rather taken by a comment from @User on this year's tour - that the Netherlands is the best cycling.
So what I'm getting at the moment is confirmation of Dover-Hook, on ground we have not covered and with Interesting Stuff to look at.
I might be able to convince someone I was going to the Lakes with to recce a possible route in October, which I'd enjoy anyway and might be useful.
More comments please.....

 

[User482]

My thoughts on recent comments:
UK - you're suggesting asking peeps to use a week of their annual holiday to ride in Lincolnshire when they could just as easily go to the continent. And, for those in the south, getting to Dover with a bike is much easier than getting to, say, Newcastle. Hotel accommodation is slightly cheaper on the continent - and in the Lowlands using the vrienden op de fiets for accommodation at €20 a night for B&B is much cheaper......

I'm on the fence, but would note that London to north-eastern England is particularly easy. I'd rather ride in Northumberland than Belgium, but would prefer France to either. Maybe we should update the options on the poll?

 

[rvw]

My thoughts on recent comments:
A centre-based tour: really difficult to find one place big enough, so we'd be scattered around the countryside, some distance apart. And where to go? Near the hook of Holland for a whole week? Caen for a week? Calais? Dunkirk? St Malo for a whole week?.

On the point of finding a place big enough: one site (first up on Google) in Netherlands has over 300 properties which accommodate 20+ people (excluding hotels). The same site has over 600 large places in Belgium. There are 89 in Brittany and 103 in Normandy. And what to do - well, depends on where you go. Brix didn't have masses of interesting places just by - but it had some, and some nice cycling, and that seemed to work OK.

 

[velovoice]

I am rather taken by a comment from @User on this year's tour - that the Netherlands is the best cycling.

That Man is Right. Again.

ETA. Basically, if the Fridays don't go to the Netherlands next year, then I'll just go without you!

 

[Flying Dodo]

I'd only suggested a loop down from Calais, simply because I'd just done that. And I'd dispute the fast roads bit, as we had lovely quiet back roads/cycle paths to ride on.

However, I agree entirely it would be too "train-spotterish" to be ticking off WWI monuments. But I definitely think there's scope for a great loop from Calais to Le Touquet and then heading east, perhaps into Belgium before heading back towards Calais and the coast, to be done at a nice leisurely pace, with things to interest a wide range of people, which is why I'd also flagged up Douai and Roubaix.

 

[Flying Dodo]

Blimey, I expect you're the sort of man who thinks one electricity pylon looks much like another too...

Lovely pylons in France.

 

[srw]

...unless you set it up as a charity ride for [insert Forces charity of choice] with two support vans and cars with orange flashy lights on their roofs.

(Many of the other cyclists on the Hoek ferry were doing exactly that)

Since it seems some people didn't see my sarcasm, I'll point out that I was being sarcastic.

And I'd also not want a series of lecturettes (sorry @ianmac62), but some sort of narrative arc is a Good Thing, even if it's subliminal.

 

[swansonj]

Lovely pylons in France.

Now this is a perfect example of what @User13710 was saying about the need for an unlike option - then I could express my opinion of any suggestion that French pylons are worthy of any respect....

 

[srw]

@srw summed up the parameters very well,

You're kind, but I forgot two.

• The tour needs to be organised by someone. That person needs to want to organise the tour in the place the tour is going to be in.
• Each day's riding needs to be coralled in some way (I won't say led) by at least one person. That person or people need to be happy to do that coralling, and able to react to circumstances and change plans on the fly, in co-operation with whoever is organising overall.

On the basis that @mmmmartin seems to be happy to organise a tour in 2017 from Dover to Hoek I would suggest that he does so. It looks from this discussion that enough people would like to come to make it viable. The question of whether he coralls all the days, or whether that's shared with other experienced or (my preference) some inexperienced ride corallers as a development opportunity can be settled later.

If other people want to step forward to organise a tour in the UK, or a centre holiday in the UK or abroad, either in 2017 or 2018, then they can - either as an independent enterprise or (with the club's permission) as a club enterprise. In fact, I think that would be an excellent idea. The Fridays needs to be a collective effort.

I'd also suggest that thoughts for 2018 begin to happen now - perhaps with some ambition for the sort of boundary-stretching journey @StuartG mentions. LonJoG and Bordeaux were both several years in the bubbling.

(All the above is my opinion, of course. And like all opinions open to challenge.)

 

[srw]

And while I'm talking about challenging opinions....

the Netherlands is the best cycling

You could not be more wrong, to coin a phrase. Horrible red concrete setts, canal crossings designed by people on drugs, cars which are very aggressive except when you're in your allotted place. And the beer is shoot. The people are lovely, and flat is nice (up to a point). I prefer Belgium and France by a country kilometre.

 

[Flying Dodo]

And while I'm talking about challenging opinions....

You could not be more wrong, to coin a phrase. Horrible red concrete setts, canal crossings designed by people on drugs, cars which are very aggressive except when you're in your allotted place. And the beer is shoot. The people are lovely, and flat is nice (up to a point). I prefer Belgium and France by a country kilometre.

Definitely not my experience of the Netherlands, both with the Fridays and elsewhere. It was Belgium who had the aggressive drivers wanting you out of the way. France is nice, but in a different way from the Netherlands.

 

[mmmmartin]

I prefer Belgium and France by a country kilometre.

France is nice, but in a different way from the Netherlands.

So - a ride that includes France, Belgium, the Netherlands but no bad cycle lanes. With beer from Belgium. And has Interesting Stuff to look at. With days of length that permit some sitting down to a spot of lunch. And not too expensive, either on travel or accommodation. And easy to get to and from. Some hills but not too many or too steep. Possibly a short talk or two to explain something now and again. Or not.
And possibly allocating days to different people so they can have a go at cat-herding for a day.
With a similar kind of feel as previous tours but also being very different.
Shouldn't be too difficult, I'll have a think.