Advice for buying a used car

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OP
OP
Matthew_T

Matthew_T

"Young and Ex-whippet"
Did you mean CAN'T rather than can? The VED must be due to expire at the end of this month. You can't renew it until a certain period before expiry, presumably that is the 12th day of the month in which it expires. Renewal notice for my car must be due to fall through the door any time then. Goodbye £200 :sad:.
He said that if we come and have a look at the car before 12pm, he can tax it the same day. He said that he will tax it for 6 months. As far as I believe, the tax has run out.
 
OP
OP
Matthew_T

Matthew_T

"Young and Ex-whippet"
That mileage is ok. It's similar to what my wife's car has done. Mine is a bit higher. Those E class Mercs are rust buckets too.

A decent year 2000 car won't be rusty. Ours aren't.
My dads car is very rusty. He is taking the personal numberplates off it and will then take it down to a company who break Mercedes. His is a 2000 year car too, but has seen a lot more miles.
 

Spinney

Bimbleur extraordinaire
Location
Back up north
He said that if we come and have a look at the car before 12pm, he can tax it the same day. He said that he will tax it for 6 months. As far as I believe, the tax has run out.
If the tax has run out, shouldn't the car have been SORN'd? I thought they were much, much stricter on this stuff these days.

It shouldn't be Matt's problem, as long as he taxes it as soon as he owns it, but I was wondering if there would be any other implications. Assuming the guy had not SORN'd it, If the guy is happy having an illegally untaxed car, it doesn't say that much for his overall law-abidingness*


* if that wasn't a word before, it is now!
 
OP
OP
Matthew_T

Matthew_T

"Young and Ex-whippet"
If the tax has run out, shouldn't the car have been SORN'd? I thought they were much, much stricter on this stuff these days.

It shouldn't be Matt's problem, as long as he taxes it as soon as he owns it, but I was wondering if there would be any other implications. Assuming the guy had not SORN'd it, If the guy is happy having an illegally untaxed car, it doesn't say that much for his overall law-abidingness*


* if that wasn't a word before, it is now!
I am not sure. The checks I have done on the car say that it is unlicensed. https://www.taxdisc.direct.gov.uk/EvlPortalApp/app/enquiry?execution=e1s3
 

asterix

Comrade Member
Location
Limoges or York
Clearly, the laws of physics agree with you, but in reality I think you will find that removing the back seats will make no noticeable difference to your MPG..

It may well do as he won't be able to carry more than one passenger!

'Can you give us a lift Matthew_T?' ;
'No, dreadfully sorry only got one passenger seat'.

OTOH, he'd have to tell the insurers it was a 'modified vehicle'. Could be good, more likely to be bad.
 

Spinney

Bimbleur extraordinaire
Location
Back up north
Matt, if it is unlicenced you should not be taking it for a test drive. This is in addition to having insurance - your dad's insurance is likely to allow him - not you - to drive any car he does not own, but the car itself would still need to be taxed to go on the road.

Edit: and don't even think about the supermarket car park/beach option for testing it!

Don't buy it if you cannot legally test drive it first (or have your dad drive it).

If the guy wants to sell it he must tax it. Any other buyer would want to test drive it. He may have to pay for 6 months, but if he takes it off the road again he should be able to get 5 months of that back. Also worth asking why it isn't currently taxed.
 

Rickshaw Phil

Overconfidentii Vulgaris
Moderator
I've just dug out the check list I wrote up for my brother when he went hunting for a car. Several of the points have already been covered but for what it's worth this is it:

Engine: Should start easily (preferably from cold) without any puff of blue smoke. Rev the engine and check for blue smoke when the throttle is released. Take off the oil cap and check for water in the oil (will show up as a creamy looking emulsion).
One of the weird things I tend to do is smell the oil - a burnt or sulphurous smell suggests it's been badly overheated. A smell of fuel suggests badly worn pistons/cylinder bores or possible head gasket problems.
Do the same with the coolant - look for droplets of oil floating in it or emulsion. Coolant is usually green or blue in older cars or red in newer ones. If it looks a rust colour it has been neglected. If there is a smell of fuel there is a problem. (Don't get coolant on your skin - it's not nice stuff)
Has the car had its cambelt changed at the recommended intervals? Cambelt failure generally does a lot of damage to the engine so you need to be able to trust it.
Has it been serviced at the recommended intervals?

Tyres/suspension: Check tyres for tread depth and whether they are worn evenly. If they aren't worn evenly it indicates the suspension alignment is out. This could be suspension wear or old damage (or Kwik-Fit have done the tracking:whistle:).
Are any of the wheels dented/show signs of kerb damage. On the test drive, is the steering wheel centralised when driving straight ahead? Does the car pull to one side? Does the car feel stable?

Brakes: If the discs are visible, what is the wear like? Are they badly grooved? Is there life left in the pads? (minimum thickness for most manufacturers is 3mm).
Are there any signs of fluid leaks at any of the wheels?
On test drive, does the car shudder under braking? (indicates warped discs or drums). Is the brake pedal firm? It should not sink to the floor or need to be "pumped up".
How far does the handbrake lever pull up? 3 to 7 clicks of the ratchet is the usual range specified.

Lights and Electrics: Do all the lights work? Do all the warning lights go out correctly? Are all the lamp lenses free from cracks/breaks and discolouration? Do all the accessories work? Try everything.
Under the bonnet - give the wiring a look over. If any wires have been joined with Scotchlocks it has been inexpertly repaired. If any of the wires that go into the wings have been joined with Scotchlocks the car may have had accident repairs.

Body: Check for rust all over but especially round wheel arches, sills, door bottoms, and inner wings. If you can, lift the carpets and check the area round the corners of the floorpan - if there are any horror stories they will be here. Significant rust by any suspension mount, strut or shock absorber is a bad sign - likewise with the areas round the seatbelt mounts. Walk away if you find these.
Get close and look along the panels for any ripples that may indicate repairs. Look under the carpet in the boot - a rippled floor panel means it's been rear ended.
Panel gaps should all be even (including the panel to bumper gaps).
Large chips or cracks in the area of the windscreen swept by the wipers is an MOT fail.

Paperwork: Do the chassis and engine numbers match the V5? Is the car the same colour as stated? Is the mileage consistent with the previous MOT certificates?

Edit: Missed out the gearbox :wacko:: Does it go into all gears easily? Are there any odd gearbox noises when driving? Does it jump out of gear?
Does the clutch work smoothly? Where is the biting point? Is there any clutch slip (put it into high gear and give it a bootful of throttle from a low speed).

I hope this is of some use.:thumbsup:
 
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Spinney

Bimbleur extraordinaire
Location
Back up north
This is all getting a bit scaremongery isn't it? I expect the RFL ran out at the end of October, and the seller is talking about renewing it instantly online when he/she has found a buyer, which is not the correct way to go about things but hardly the crime of the century.

Usually when people sell cars they do the test drive themselves - why would anyone let an unknown person who might not have any valid insurance drive their car when they haven't actually bought it yet?

Not deliberately, just wanted him to be aware of possible implications. As you say, it could all be very straightforward, in which case the bloke will have no probs explaining things. And naturally if the owner does the driving, no insurance problems and it's up to him if he chooses to drive it untaxed. Matt just needs to make sure that if it is being driven (by the owner) untaxed, and in the very unlikely event of this being spotted, that he can demonstrate that he didn't buy the car until after the test drive...
 
OP
OP
Matthew_T

Matthew_T

"Young and Ex-whippet"
I could give my opinion on the legality of taxation of cars but I dont want this thread to be locked again.

But I will probably get the seller to drive the car and then sit in the front passenger seat so I have a better feel of what the car is like without being in the driver seat. The majority of checks can be done when the car is stationary anyway.
 

LimeBurn

Über Member
Location
Sheffield
Hi, just my 2 penneth some of which has already been said - I'm a qualified mechanic & MOT tester, and these are the basic checks I would do when looking at a car.
The obvious stuff like V5, test cert and past certs if you can (these will tell you of any advisorys that it has had), also if they have old tax disks (some people keep them for some reason) you can tell whether its been off the road for any length of time. Check the service history, unless its silly cheap then there are always more cars about that will have a service history to persevere for the right car. Test drive it!!

Then the mechanicals.
brakes - does it make a noise when braking - does it brake in a straight line. does the handbrake work or have excessive travel.
Steering. make sure no excessive play when rocking the steering wheel a little in your hands, then put it on full lock and make sure it goes round in circles with out knocking (a sign of CV joints/drives shafts), you can also get hold of the wheels and rock from side to side to check for play in wheel bearings, you can also check the tyres are in good condition here, make sure the wearing evenly especially on the fronts check the inner edges to make sure theyre the same depth as the rest of the tyre.
Suspension - the car shouldnt knock or rattle when driving over bumps (speed bumps are a good check for this), the suspension should also return to where it is without bouncing when you put your body weight on each corner of the vehicle and then let go.
Engine - check for emulsification in the oil cap (creamy consistency) a little is ok as this is normal due to condensation but a lot means head gasket problems, you can also check in the coolant resevoir for the same but this time it will be more oily than anything if there is problem, I also dip my finger in the reservoir and taste the coolant - it should taste sweet if antifreeze has been maintained, if it just tastes like water its a sign that the car has not been serviced properly or has an overheating problem where the owner just keep topping it up over and over again with water. I always make sure the engine is cold when I get there, if its not ask them if you can come back tomorrow when it is, check that it starts well from cold with no smoke. then leave the engine running while you do the rest of the checks and chat, if its going to overheat you need to know dont leave until the car has reached normal temperature and you hear the fans cut in from under the bonnet.

Bodywork - sills, bottom of window frames especially in corners the front windscreen especially, suspension mounts, dont be afraid to pull the carpet back in the boot to check. boot floor and also the Ka can rust badly between the back window and boot at chest level so check for bubbling under the paint.

Electrics - check everything works, make sure there are no warning lights on the dash that stay on, engine management, abs, airbags etc. make sure aircon works if it has it.

My final check would be the engine mounts and gear box - put the hand brake on, lift the bonnet, and then get someone to watch the engine, with the engine running lift the clutch to just beyond biting point quite sharply and you will feel the engine move, if this is excessive or knocks (especially with a metallic sound) it means the engine mounts are shot - you can also repeat this through each gear including reverse which will make sure the gearbox doesnt jump out of gear under load.

Hope this helps, but dont use it as a bible common sense prevails - if the car feels wrong it probably is.
 
OP
OP
Matthew_T

Matthew_T

"Young and Ex-whippet"
About the seller: He is an individual but seems to work for a garage/company. He gets car in regularly to sell. The photos taken of the car were on an industrial site which I can imagine his garage is on.
 

Rickshaw Phil

Overconfidentii Vulgaris
Moderator
About the seller: He is an individual but seems to work for a garage/company. He gets car in regularly to sell. The photos taken of the car were on an industrial site which I can imagine his garage is on.
For me this rings a little alarm bell. He might just be doing it for a hobby or he might be trying to get rid of the cars the garage couldn't sell any other way.:dry:

Either way he is looking to get the car, make it presentable and sell it on for the best profit and because he isn't doing it in the guise of a trader you won't have any comeback if there is a problem later on.

I'd prefer to buy either from a forecourt where you have at least some protection if it is a dud or from a genuine private seller who can give you some history of the car.
 

swee'pea99

Squire
For me this rings a little alarm bell. He might just be doing it for a hobby or he might be trying to get rid of the cars the garage couldn't sell any other way.:dry:
Me too. My alarm bells already gave a wee tinkle at news of 'I'll buy you 6 months tax if you get here by 12.00'. Sounds like a chap keen to do a deal. Too keen?
 

Brandane

Legendary Member
About the seller: He is an individual but seems to work for a garage/company. He gets car in regularly to sell. The photos taken of the car were on an industrial site which I can imagine his garage is on.
This being the case, I would be wanting to contact the previous owner (from the V5) to try and establish some of the cars recent history, and most importantly, the reason why THEY sold it to the guy who is now trying to get shot of it. I would do this BEFORE parting with any cash. All might be genuine with the car, but don't get stung.
 

gavroche

Getting old but not past it
Location
North Wales
If your dad has fully comp insurance, he will be covered 3rd party to drive any car, provided it is road legal ( tax disc in your case). Yet another tip: put the car in 3rd gear and move off. It should do it, although slowly. If it does not, the clutch is on its way out. Also, switch all the lights on and then turn the engine on. The lights should dim slightly and the starter motor should be strong, otherwise the battery is no good.
I doubt if you will be able to put a bike in it as it is a very small car with very little room at the back.
Japanese cars are very well built and reliable but the downside is that spare parts are very expensive when something goes wrong.
 
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