All the gear - No Idea

[CopperBrompton]

Yes, intelligence is the key to signalling, and there are some cases where not signalling is safer.

Another obvious example: two left-hand junctions ahead of you, extremely close together (eg. a junction and then the petrol station you're turning into to get some choco^H^H^H^H^H water). In the first junction, is a car waiting to turn right across your path.

Signal left on approach, and the chances are high that the car thinks you're turning into his road and he pulls out in front of you.

 

[Archie_tect]

Bike= low tech ie use your hands...

What's the problem with signalling your intent to other road users?
Mirror, signal, manoeuvre for vehicles .... without mirrors you look, signal and manoeuvre... basic road sense and good manners. Anyone who's arrogant enough not to bother provides another excuse for other road users to treat them with disdain..

 

[Rhythm Thief]

Bike= low tech ie use your hands...

What's the problem with signalling your intent to other road users?

One of the problems is that if you're signalling on a bike, you've got one hand a long way from the brake lever, and you're only steering with one hand. This is why I rarely signal on a busy roundabout, for instance. I find it much better to make it obvious where I'm going by controlling the traffic behind me by taking the middle of the lane.

 

[ufkacbln]

According to Cycle Craft - care should be taken when signalling - eg, a left signal could encourage a following car to overtake you whilst both of you turning left, but no signal would keep him behind. Anyone agree with that one in particular?

This is my experience, I also don't signal if I think my hands would be better placed on the brakes.

There is a cross roads (I have priority) in the Hospital where vehicles regularly pull out across the road in front of you. I "should" signal right, but if the vehicle approaching hasn't actually stopped rolling as I get close........

 

[ufkacbln]

I do also signal when not turning!

There are a couple of pedestrian islands on my route where the use of an extended arm, with open handed blocking gesture stops overtakes.

 

[nosherduke996]

What a hand signal ?

 

[Rassendyll]

Like others here I signal if there are people likely to cross or cars/cyclists behind, and on group rides of course.

However what I find quite difficult about signalling in London are the speed humps or raised sections which are often placed at intersections and require two hands on the bars if hit at more than the slowest of speeds.

Plus the various metal access covers which are often in the line taken by a cyclist and provide such an effective demonstration of a tangent to a circle, especially when wet.

So, given that the purpose of signalling is primarily to avoid an accident it makes sense to weigh up whether the chances are increased or decreased.

 

[Cab]

If it comes down to a choice between covering a brake or maintaining control (so, if I see something ahead that may require braking, or if the road surface is poor) then holding on to the handle bars trumps signalling. If in heavy or fast traffic I'm going to risk a left hook, and I haven't been able to maintain a good primary position to deter this, then I might only signal a left just at the turn. Otherwise, I think signalling in traffic is just good manners.

 

[jay clock]

Coming back to the OP, I am sympathetic to the guy you observed. He may have been out for his first commute. At least he was dressed up visibily and with working lights!

 

[Cab]

Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed that you see a lot of very dressed up, kitted out cylists out on the road who have no idea whatsoever how to ride?

 

[Weegie]

Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed that you see a lot of very dressed up, kitted out cylists out on the road who have no idea whatsoever how to ride?

That's a bit unfair. The experienced hands on this forum are always preaching to beginners about wearing high-viz gear, having decent lights, not cycling on the pavement etc. A lot of these cyclists you see could just be newbies following good advice about what gear to use, learning their basic skills on the open road.

Problem is, there's no way to distinguish between a bad cyclist and a new learner out on the road. I do wonder why "L plates" are not encouraged in the cycling world.

 

[shunter]

One of the first things my advanced driving tutor did was to untrain me to always signal. There are 3 main reasons for this:
1) if you're signalling to no one you've just wasted effort
2) you end up being more aware of road users around you because you need to work out if you should signal or not
3) prevents over use of signalling leading to confusing signalling

So the question is was there anyone around who needed to know what he was going to do?

I am not so sure about the three points given by your tutor. Given that motorcycles and bicycles are not that easily seen I have always seen a signal as a last life saver and it isn't really that much of an effort. Also I think the effort of decision making as to whether you signal or not would be best placed in continuing to observe the traffic around you.

The reason I have never considered advanced car training is that I have already done advanced motorcycling training. I always reckoned that the advice given for car training would to some degree conflict with that given for motorcycle training and I prefer the motorcycle approach.

At the risk of being controversial I think motorcycle training is more appropriate for cycling - but just my feelings on the matter.

 

[Cab]

That's a bit unfair. The experienced hands on this forum are always preaching to beginners about wearing high-viz gear, having decent lights, not cycling on the pavement etc. A lot of these cyclists you see could just be newbies following good advice about what gear to use, learning their basic skills on the open road.

Problem is, there's no way to distinguish between a bad cyclist and a new learner out on the road. I do wonder why "L plates" are not encouraged in the cycling world.

I didn't mean that to come across as unfair, it was a question aimed to see if anyone else has come across the same phenomenon.

For what its worth, I think that a lot of people who started out commuting as students (or children) never end up as lycra-clad-shiny-kit-monkeys, whereas many people who come to commuting later go out and get what they think is the best kit they can. Its not by any means universally true, but I think it explains why you see plenty of well kitted out numpties.

 

[CopperBrompton]

The reason I have never considered advanced car training is that I have already done advanced motorcycling training. I always reckoned that the advice given for car training would to some degree conflict with that given for motorcycle training and I prefer the motorcycle approach.

I've passed both the IAM advanced driving test and advanced motorcycling test and there were no conflicts between the two. What are you imagining would be different?

 

[Jasper the Surrea]

I am not so sure about the three points given by your tutor. Given that motorcycles and bicycles are not that easily seen I have always seen a signal as a last life saver and it isn't really that much of an effort. Also I think the effort of decision making as to whether you signal or not would be best placed in continuing to observe the traffic around you.

The reason I have never considered advanced car training is that I have already done advanced motorcycling training. I always reckoned that the advice given for car training would to some degree conflict with that given for motorcycle training and I prefer the motorcycle approach.

At the risk of being controversial I think motorcycle training is more appropriate for cycling - but just my feelings on the matter.

Some lorry drivers are now being given an ammount of cycle training. It is not practicable for all cyclists to drive a lorry, but the reverse would give a perspective on the problems faced by drivers of large vehicles and how they can be overcome. Shared road use is down to good and steady communication. I drive lorries and a car, always felt that this made me more aware as a cyclist.

If you do signal it should be complete by the time you turn. Establishing eye contact with traffic behind you is important, one last look (over appropriate shoulder) and turn whilst covering the brakes.