Are there any simpler cars around now?

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OP
OP
T

Time Waster

Veteran
I think it is autotrader that says to avoid the 3 cylinder 1.0 dacia engine. Says it is a little noisy and a few other things. Basically missing something for the size of the car, like a fourth cylinder and a bit more torque perhaps??
 

DCLane

Found in the Yorkshire hills ...
How about a Berlingo or partner.
I often see them with 200,000++ miles on and the engines are pretty basic?

Absolutely no sophistication with the basic models of those. Son no. 2's has electric front windows and mirrors and that's it. Even the rear windows are an old lever arch to jut out a bit.

No driver aids. Just an engine and speedo. Ours has done 173,000 miles and stills runs as rattly as it did when we got it at 85,000 miles. It's a base engine 1.6 petrol and is happy up to 70 but beyond that there's nothing.
 

Bonefish Blues

Banging donk
Location
52 Festive Road
I think it is autotrader that says to avoid the 3 cylinder 1.0 dacia engine. Says it is a little noisy and a few other things. Basically missing something for the size of the car, like a fourth cylinder and a bit more torque perhaps??
That's at variance with most reviews I've read. What Car says

The Dacia Jogger engine range starts with a turbocharged 109bhp 1.0-litre petrol, and it’s our pick of the range.

Badged the TCe 110, it keeps costs down but still has enough power to go from 0-62mph in 11.2 seconds. True, that’s much longer than the 8.9 seconds it takes the 1.5-litre petrol VW Touran but it's easily quick enough to keep up with the flow of traffic.

Do you have a list of contenders?
 
OP
OP
T

Time Waster

Veteran
Jeez! The joggers sounds like a terrible car overall. I think it makes me want complex after reading up on it. EURO NCAP 1! There's enough cars without drivers aids that still get 3 stars so the jogger is terrible for that. The 1.0 litre 108bhp engine in one review was described as struggling to keep up with traffic on the motorway.

I withdraw my query, I now want complex if simple gets the Dacia Jogger as a recommendation. 😆
 

Bonefish Blues

Banging donk
Location
52 Festive Road
Jeez! The joggers sounds like a terrible car overall. I think it makes me want complex after reading up on it. EURO NCAP 1! There's enough cars without drivers aids that still get 3 stars so the jogger is terrible for that. The 1.0 litre 108bhp engine in one review was described as struggling to keep up with traffic on the motorway.

I withdraw my query, I now want complex if simple gets the Dacia Jogger as a recommendation. 😆

You asked for something. You got a serious suggestion to fit the requirements that you articulated. Dacia owners love their cars, interestingly, and the brand consistently comes out rated very highly in satisfaction and reliability surveys.

What are the requirements now - do you have a shortlist?

ETA

NCAP
https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/features/opinion/tom-wiltshire/dacia-jogger-euro-ncap/
 

roubaixtuesday

self serving virtue signaller
You asked for something. You got a serious suggestion to fit the requirements that you articulated. Dacia owners love their cars, interestingly, and the brand consistently comes out rated very highly in satisfaction and reliability surveys.

What are the requirements now - do you have a shortlist?

ETA

NCAP
https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/features/opinion/tom-wiltshire/dacia-jogger-euro-ncap/

Hilarious.

"I want a simple car"

"How about this?"

"Don't be ridiculous, that's far too simple"
 

Alex321

Guru
Location
South Wales
I'd hope not.

Oops. Who stole my K"? (Post edited now to correct that)
 
We'll be looking at petrol only BTW so from what I have seen most Skodas are diesel.

Why do you think that?

Casa Reynard has had five Skodas, and all have been petrol. My bestie inherited a diesel Octavia from her partner, but since then, she's had a string of petrol Fabia estates. Another cat show friend has had several petrol Octavias.
 

Gunk

Guru
Location
Oxford
Get a normally aspirated petrol car for simplicity. Get one with cam chain not wet belt system

Many modern vehicles use timing chains instead of wet timing belts (belt-in-oil systems) due to the durability and lower maintenance requirements of chains. Timing chains are made of metal, typically last the life of the engine with proper maintenance, and are lubricated by engine oil within a sealed environment. Wet belts, while also lubricated by oil, are rubber-based and have faced criticism for premature wear and complex replacement procedures in some models.Below is a list of modern vehicles (post-2010 models, focusing on 2020 and newer where possible) that are known to use timing chains instead of wet belts or traditional timing belts, based on available information. Note that engine configurations vary by market, model year, and specific engine type, so always consult the vehicle’s owner’s manual or a trusted mechanic to confirm. I’ve prioritized manufacturers and models commonly associated with timing chains and excluded those known to use wet belts (e.g., certain Ford EcoBoost, Peugeot/Citroën PureTech, or VW TSI engines).Manufacturers and Models with Timing ChainsThe following brands and models are known to use timing chains in many of their engines, particularly in petrol (gasoline) and diesel variants, as of recent model years:ToyotaToyota is renowned for using timing chains in most of its modern engines, especially in petrol models, which are designed to be maintenance-free for the engine’s life.Corolla (1.8L, 2.0L petrol, hybrid engines; e.g., 2020–2025 models)Camry (2.5L, 3.5L V6 petrol, hybrid; e.g., 2020–2025)RAV4 (2.5L petrol, hybrid; e.g., 2020–2025)Highlander (2.5L hybrid, 3.5L V6; e.g., 2020–2025)Yaris (1.0L, 1.5L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Land Cruiser (4.0L V6 petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Prius (1.8L, 2.0L hybrid; e.g., 2020–2025) Note: Some older Toyota diesel engines (e.g., 2.2L D-4D in pre-2015 models) may use belts, but newer petrol and hybrid engines are chain-driven.HondaHonda predominantly uses timing chains in its modern petrol engines for reliability.Civic (1.5L turbo, 2.0L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Accord (1.5L turbo, 2.0L hybrid; e.g., 2020–2025)CR-V (1.5L turbo, 2.0L hybrid; e.g., 2020–2025)Pilot (3.5L V6; e.g., 2020–2025)HR-V (1.5L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025) Note: Honda’s i-DTEC diesel engines (e.g., 1.6L in some markets) may use timing belts, so verify for diesel models.SubaruSubaru’s boxer engines typically use timing chains, especially in petrol models.Forester (2.5L, 2.0L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Outback (2.5L, 2.4L turbo petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Impreza (2.0L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)WRX (2.4L turbo; e.g., 2020–2025)BRZ (2.4L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025, shared with Toyota GR86) Note: Subaru’s 2.0L diesel boxer engine (2008–2018) used a timing chain, but diesel availability is limited in newer models.MazdaMazda’s Skyactiv engines generally use timing chains for petrol and diesel variants.Mazda3 (2.0L, 2.5L Skyactiv-G petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Mazda6 (2.5L Skyactiv-G petrol; e.g., 2020–2021, discontinued in some markets)CX-5 (2.0L, 2.5L Skyactiv-G petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)CX-30 (2.0L, 2.5L Skyactiv-G petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)CX-90 (3.3L inline-6 turbo petrol; e.g., 2023–2025)Skyactiv-D diesel (2.2L in some markets; e.g., CX-5, 2020–2025) Note: Mazda’s newer inline-6 engines (e.g., in CX-90) also use chains, reinforcing their preference for this setup.BMWBMW uses timing chains in most of its petrol and diesel engines, though some older models had chain issues (e.g., N47 diesel).3 Series (2.0L B48 petrol, 3.0L B58 inline-6; e.g., 2020–2025)5 Series (2.0L, 3.0L petrol, 2.0L diesel; e.g., 2020–2025)X3 (2.0L, 3.0L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)X5 (3.0L inline-6, 4.4L V8; e.g., 2020–2025)M models (e.g., M3, M4 with 3.0L S58; 2020–2025) Note: BMW’s timing chains are generally reliable in newer models (post-2015), but regular oil changes are critical to prevent wear.Mercedes-BenzMercedes-Benz typically equips its engines with timing chains, especially in larger-displacement or performance models.C-Class (1.5L, 2.0L M264 petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)E-Class (2.0L petrol, 3.0L inline-6; e.g., 2020–2025)S-Class (3.0L, 4.0L V8; e.g., 2020–2025)GLC (2.0L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)AMG models (e.g., AMG C63 with 4.0L V8; 2020–2025) Note: Some smaller Mercedes engines (e.g., 1.3L in A-Class, developed with Renault) may use belts, so confirm for entry-level models.Hyundai/KiaHyundai and Kia use timing chains in many of their petrol engines, particularly in larger or newer models.Hyundai Sonata (2.5L, 1.6L turbo petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Hyundai Tucson (2.5L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Kia Optima/K5 (1.6L turbo, 2.5L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Kia Sorento (2.5L petrol, 3.5L V6; e.g., 2020–2025)Kia Telluride (3.8L V6; e.g., 2020–2025) Note: Some smaller engines (e.g., 1.0L, 1.2L in compact models like Hyundai i10) may use belts, and certain diesels may vary by market.NissanNissan favors timing chains in most of its modern petrol engines, though some older models used belts.Altima (2.5L, 2.0L VC-Turbo; e.g., 2020–2025)Rogue (1.5L turbo, 2.5L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Sentra (2.0L petrol; e.g., 2020–2025)Pathfinder (3.5L V6; e.g., 2020–2025)Micra (1.0L petrol in some markets; e.g., 2020–2023) Note: Nissan’s diesel engines (e.g., in older Navara) may use belts, and some small engines in emerging markets could differ.Volkswagen/Audi (Select Models)While some VW and Audi engines (e.g., 1.0L TSI, 1.2L PureTech) use wet belts, higher-performance or larger engines often use chains.VW Golf GTI/R (2.0L EA888 TSI; e.g., 2020–2025)VW Tiguan (2.0L TSI; e.g., 2020–2025)Audi A4/A5 (2.0L TFSI, 40 TFSI; e.g., 2020–2025)Audi Q5 (2.0L TFSI; e.g., 2020–2025)Audi RS3 (2.5L inline-5; e.g., 2020–2025) Note: VW’s smaller engines (e.g., 1.0L, 1.5L TSI EA211) often use belts or wet belts, so avoid these for chain preference.Other Notable BrandsLexus: Most models (e.g., IS, RX, NX with 2.0L turbo, 3.5L V6, or hybrid engines; 2020–2025) use timing chains, aligning with Toyota’s approach.Suzuki: Small engines like 1.0L BoosterJet, 1.2L, 1.4L turbo petrol (e.g., Vitara, SX4; 2020–2025) use chains.Jaguar/Land Rover: Diesel models (e.g., 2.0L Ingenium in Range Rover Evoque, Jaguar XE; 2020–2025) often use chains, as do petrol V6/V8 engines.Chevrolet/GM: Larger engines (e.g., 3.6L V6 in Camaro, Cadillac XT5; 2.0L turbo in Equinox; 2020–2025) typically use chains, but smaller engines (e.g., 1.2L in Trax) may use wet belts.Key ConsiderationsHow to Confirm: Check the owner’s manual or look under the bonnet. A plastic cover on the engine suggests a timing belt (dry), while a sealed metal cover indicates a timing chain or wet belt. For wet belts, you’ll need to consult specific engine data, as they’re internal.Maintenance: Timing chains require regular oil changes with manufacturer-specified oil to prevent wear on chains, guides, or tensioners. Neglect can lead to rattling or failure, though this is rare in well-maintained engines.Interference Engines: Most modern engines are interference designs, meaning a chain or belt failure can cause catastrophic damage (valves hitting pistons). Chains are less likely to snap but can stretch if poorly maintained.Wet Belt Issues: Wet belts, used in engines like Ford’s 1.0L EcoBoost or VW’s 1.2L TSI, are prone to degradation if improper oil is used or maintenance is skipped, leading to oil pump blockages. Chains avoid this issue.Regional Variations: Engine setups differ by market (e.g., Europe vs. North America). For example, a VW Polo may have a chain in one region (post-2009) but a belt in another.Manufacturers Known for Wet Belts (Avoid for Chain Preference)These brands use wet belts in some modern engines, so double-check specific models:Ford: EcoBoost (1.0L, 1.5L, 2.0L) and EcoBlue diesel engines (e.g., Fiesta, Focus, Transit Connect).Peugeot/Citroën: 1.2L PureTech petrol (e.g., Peugeot 208, Citroën C3, Vauxhall Grandland X).Volkswagen/Audi: Some TSI engines (e.g., 1.0L, 1.2L, 1.5L EA211 in Polo, Golf, Audi A1).Vauxhall/Opel: 1.2L petrol engines in models like Corsa, Astra (shared with PSA Group).RecommendationsIf you prioritize timing chains for their longevity and lower maintenance, focus on:Toyota, Honda, Subaru, Mazda: Reliable, chain-driven petrol engines with strong reputations for durability.BMW, Mercedes-Benz: Higher-end models with chains, but ensure regular oil changes to avoid chain wear.Hyundai/Kia, Nissan: Good options for affordable chain-driven vehicles, especially in mid-size or larger models.Larger Engines: Engines above 1.8L (e.g., 2.0L TSI, 3.5L V6) are more likely to use chains due to higher torque demands.Final NotesThis list is not exhaustive, as manufacturers may change engine designs across model years or markets. For example, a 2020 VW Golf 1.0L TSI may have a wet belt, while the 2.0L TSI in the GTI uses a chain. Always verify the engine code (e.g., EA888 for VW/Audi chains) and consult a mechanic or the manufacturer’s service data. If you provide a specific make, model, year, and engine size, I can narrow it down further.If you’re shopping for a vehicle, consider checking sites like Honest John () or FixMyCar () for detailed lists of chain- vs. belt-driven models. Regular maintenance, especially oil changes every 6,000–10,000 miles with the correct oil spec, is critical for timing chain longevity.

Got a bit of time on your hands Andy?
 

Jameshow

Veteran
How much beyond the legal limit do you require to be happy?

If a car can barely do 70 then there are plenty of hills in Yorkshire where it's patently dangerous. The M62 from Manchester is one.

You have no reserve in tricky situations.

I have 2.0 diesel octy - great car, but mine a coastal car and a bit rusty.
 

Jameshow

Veteran
You asked for something. You got a serious suggestion to fit the requirements that you articulated. Dacia owners love their cars, interestingly, and the brand consistently comes out rated very highly in satisfaction and reliability surveys.

What are the requirements now - do you have a shortlist?

ETA

NCAP
https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/features/opinion/tom-wiltshire/dacia-jogger-euro-ncap/

I had a long drive in a Dacia Logan awful car! Esp compared to the fabia of my other sister which was lovely.
 

Alex321

Guru
Location
South Wales
If a car can barely do 70 then there are plenty of hills in Yorkshire where it's patently dangerous. The M62 from Manchester is one.
No it isn't.

You have no reserve in tricky situations.
Well don't drive at 70 on those hills then.

Though if you think you need to be able to accelerate in "tricky situations" when driving at the speed limit, you really need some driving lessons.

There are very few situations where accelerating will get you out of a dangerous situation, and I can't think of any on a motorway.
 
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