BBC Breakfast item today on illegally modded ebikes

[ebikeerwidnes]

I was looking at Electric Trikes recently for a friend, some of them seemed to be sold with throttles. Are they legal or do they need the exception as well?

What what I know they would need the exemption as well - but I am not expert

The Pedelecs forum might have something on it

 

[classic33]

Not totally true
they can have a throttle but it requires a specific piece of paper from the DVLA
it has been covered in some depth on the PEDELEC forum

there is (or was) an ebike company somewhere that offered their bikes with a throttle - but that means they would do the paperwork for you

it pretty much has to be done on a bike-by-bike basis

I seriously doubt any of the idiots or delivery riders do this

The MVSA.

I very much doubt they have the required paperwork, as the test sets a whole raft of requirements to be met. Mentioned elsewhere on here.

 

[Electric_Andy]

Forgive me for being dumb, but why all this fuss/paperwork for a throttle on a legal ebike?

I had a legal e-bike in 2011ish and it had a throttle. I never used it. I always had e-assist on Max setting. If it's legal (250W and limited to 25km/h) then the presence of a throttle does not make any difference. Even on the flat, you can go faster pedalling than you can with WOT. Downhill, irrelevant, you'd cruise at over 15mph so e-assist deactivated. Uphill, combination of e-assist and pedalling so no need for throttle. And it wouldn't be comfy standing up and trying to hold a twist type throttle anyway. Throttle only up a hill = lucky to go 4mph if it'll even get up.

Either my £1500 Wisper was especially weak, or these newer legal bikes put out a lot more torque for their 250W power

 

[classic33]

Forgive me for being dumb, but why all this fuss/paperwork for a throttle on a legal ebike?

I had a legal e-bike in 2011ish and it had a throttle. I never used it. I always had e-assist on Max setting. If it's legal (250W and limited to 25km/h) then the presence of a throttle does not make any difference. Even on the flat, you can go faster pedalling than you can with WOT. Downhill, irrelevant, you'd cruise at over 15mph so e-assist deactivated. Uphill, combination of e-assist and pedalling so no need for throttle. And it wouldn't be comfy standing up and trying to hold a twist type throttle anyway. Throttle only up a hill = lucky to go 4mph if it'll even get up.

Either my £1500 Wisper was especially weak, or these newer legal bikes put out a lot more torque for their 250W power

Before the new regulations, which brought all European regulations into line with each other, the throttle was legal.
The updated regulations didn't include the second and third class of e-bikes as legal pedal cycles in the UK. Hence the MVSA, to get one fitted.

A throttle, other than as a walking aid, on a current e-bike is usually in place so that the riders don't have to pedal.

 

[fossyant]

My brother in law has a 'legal' throttle e-bike. He's still slower than me on a knobbly tyred heavy MTB commuter

https://pedibal.com/products/pediba...HHnz6ydwvkZKDES0BOOfLj&variant=55342417641854

 

[briantrumpet]

Well that'll teach me

after saying that I have just nearly been splattered by an modded electric thing on the High Street

I was walking back to the car - down the pedestrianised bit - and curver right a bit to pass a coplue on my left

just left a polite distance

and some k***head on an electric thing shot between us at one hell of a rate
I mean - I ride a fair bit - enough to know what FAST means and that qualifies

if he had his me I would have been in an ambulance
and worse still - my wife's pasties would have got squashed!!


his mate went round the far side a bit slower but still fast


no way he missed me or the other people by more than a couple of inches
if eitehr of us had wandered unpredictably - and we have all seen pedestrians do that - then he would have been in trouble - and so would we!!

"Pasties" isn't a euphemism I've come across before.

 

[Dan Lotus]

You have a regular "user" or "dealer" on your quiet cul de sac then, unfortunately.

Certainly a possibility, but our road is only a cul de sac for 4 wheeled vehicles, as there is traffic bollards at one end, and a way through a park there as well.
A friend who lives maybe a mile away up the hill has also seen them, so I think a fair amount of people use it as a cut through (Avoiding traffic lights, and a busyish roundabout), either on foot, on a bike, or on these electric things

 

[raleighnut]

My trike has a throttle and no sensors anywhere I built it like that on the K.I.S.S. principle and also to keep the cost down (it was still £500 for the kit) This was totally legal before the regs changed (built in 2013) speed is limited by how fast the 3 phase 'hall effect' motor will spin.
It does have one safety feature though in that the rear brake has a power cut out switch, The kit came with 2 levers but with it being a trike it needs to have a 'handbrake' to stop it rolling away so there is a little button on the front brake lever that locks it on.

 

[Chris S]

Back in the 70's loads of us had 'field bikes', generally mopeds or small capacity motorbikes that we rode around farm lanes or the local quarry*.
These high powered e-bikes just seem a new version of this, no doubt 'older folks' were just as pished off by us back then.

* even Allan Millyard did it but being him he grafted a Mini 850 engine into a BSA Bantam frame..............by his own account it was lethal.

A Mini 850 engine wouldn't fit into a Bantam frame. And why use an 850? The 1275 uses the same block put provides a lot more power.

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

Forgive me for being dumb, but why all this fuss/paperwork for a throttle on a legal ebike?

I had a legal e-bike in 2011ish and it had a throttle. I never used it. I always had e-assist on Max setting. If it's legal (250W and limited to 25km/h) then the presence of a throttle does not make any difference. Even on the flat, you can go faster pedalling than you can with WOT. Downhill, irrelevant, you'd cruise at over 15mph so e-assist deactivated. Uphill, combination of e-assist and pedalling so no need for throttle. And it wouldn't be comfy standing up and trying to hold a twist type throttle anyway. Throttle only up a hill = lucky to go 4mph if it'll even get up.

Either my £1500 Wisper was especially weak, or these newer legal bikes put out a lot more torque for their 250W power

I had a throttle on my first ebike - got it in 2011 and it was used then
They were legal on bikes made before 2016 - but the power was also lower - 200W - but mine was actually only 180W

As you say - I hardly ever used it
did find it useful for starting up sometime - especially if I stopped quickly and was in the wrong gear
but main thing I miss about it is going up very steep gravel or soil slopes on paths - it was very useful to have access to the power to help get the bike up

but it is not at all useful

The only argument I would have against it would be for people of less that ideal mobility
If I was able to I would rather have an ebike as a mobility device that a scooter before I need to have a proper one!

 

[vickster]

Border Force with plod back up do fairly regular sweeps of the delivery riders amassed around McDs etc around here...many overstayers, 'pretend students' on visas, asylum seekers, others with no legal right to work. Apparently the delivery companies got a dressing down at the home office recently about not doing frequent (ie at least weekly) checks on their riders right to work. They promised to be more compliant... hmmm yeah [having to go to Croydon was probably worse than the meeting itself]

 

[Electric_Andy]

They are all over Plymouth; 80% delivery riders, 10% masked youths and 10% middle aged men who don't want to fork out for a CBT and get legal. The delivery riders are mostly clueless but not what I'd call reckless. Those deliveroo riders who use 125 scoots are also shocking, I had following me on my scoot in a bus lane as I was slowing down for a light, he undertook me and ran through the red.

 

[raleighnut]

A Mini 850 engine wouldn't fit into a Bantam frame. And why use an 850? The 1275 uses the same block put provides a lot more power.

This is Allan Millyard we're talking about, the mini engine came from a scrap car in his parents garden and the bantam engine blew up and I think he was 14-15 when he did it, certainly before he got a road legal motorbike and don't forget he's old enough not to have been saddled with a restricted 'slowped'.............bit of work and a gearing change and most mopeds at the time would pull 60mph easy.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

This is Allan Millyard we're talking about

Who the fook is he?

 

[raleighnut]

Who the fook is he?

He's the nutcase highly qualified engineer who built a bike out of a 7 litre Dodge Viper V10 engine, he has also constructed many 4-5 and 6 cylinder Kawasaki 2 strokes and a few V12 4 stroke Kawasaki bikes from the 6 cylinder ones. He also built the 'Flying Millyard' a 5 litre V twin with cylinders from an aero engine after a conversation with Steve Parrish when he won a prize for his 100cc Honda V twin saying "well I won a prize for the smallest V-twin now I'm gonna build the biggest".

Tap his name into google and marvel at his creations, all look like 'factory bikes'.Oh he built a downhill MTB or 2 for his son with enclosed gearing and chaincase that acted as a swinging arm