BBC Breakfast item today on illegally modded ebikes

[Vantage]

The understanding I have is that non legal ebikes are not covered by any insurance company...so if I was involved in an accident and the bike was checked properly, I would indeed be in trouble.
The reasons being that because they're more powerful, faster etc they're not classed as bicycles and so cannot be insured as such. Because they won't have been checked and passed whichever test they need to comply with (fuzzy head moment) they also won't be classed as vehicles and so cannot be insured that way either.
Can't for the life of me remember where I read all that.

Wiggydiggy, I never mentioned legal ebikes being seized.

 

[Drago]

The understanding I have is that non legal ebikes are not covered by any insurance company...so if I was involved in an accident and the bike was checked properly, I would indeed be in trouble.
The reasons being that because they're more powerful, faster etc they're not classed as bicycles and so cannot be insured as such. Because they won't have been checked and passed whichever test they need to comply with (fuzzy head moment) they also won't be classed as vehicles and so cannot be insured that way either.
Can't for the life of me remember where I read all that.

Wiggydiggy, I never mentioned legal ebikes being seized.

Although ifmypure anniversary accent vocti of an ebike collision you can claim from the MIB as theyre motor vehicles.

 

[Psamathe]

Although ifmypure anniversary accent vocti of an ebike collision you can claim from the MIB as theyre motor vehicles.

My wondering was that what we are discussing we are calling "illegal e-bikes" are not bikes and as never been tested/approved are not "motor vehicles".

Cars being driven without insurance are still cars, tested and approved as cars; it's just the drivers that are at fault and they are still driving "vehicles". What we are discussing are not.

Above is my non-expert wondering, not arguing any facts.

 

[classic33]

My wondering was that what we are discussing we are calling "illegal e-bikes" are not bikes and as never been tested/approved are not "motor vehicles".

Cars being driven without insurance are still cars, tested and approved as cars; it's just the drivers that are at fault and they are still driving "vehicles". What we are discussing are not.

Above is my non-expert wondering, not arguing any facts.

They may be legal, without the extra requirements, in other countries but not the UK. Under present EPAC regulations.
They fall into Light Mopeds under UK regulations.

 

[Drago]

My wondering was that what we are discussing we are calling "illegal e-bikes" are not bikes and as never been tested/approved are not "motor vehicles".

Cars being driven without insurance are still cars, tested and approved as cars; it's just the drivers that are at fault and they are still driving "vehicles". What we are discussing are not.

Above is my non-expert wondering, not arguing any facts.

A motor vehicle is "a mechanically propelled vehicle adapted and intended for use on the road (ornother public place)."

Wherpther they meet the standards required to be registered and made legal, they are motor vehicles, and theres plenty of case law confirming that.

 

[Gwylan]

I've had a jolly week on the other side. Bits of cities I wouldn't normally visit.
Circumstances put me in a white trannie and what in my day was "streets"

Worst is I'm old, that confuses most ethnic groups. They want and do show respect. The worst are the "my country" thugs who don't really have any rules.

Spent too much time avoiding white ninja cyclists, Kami-kazi mums with prams & mobiles and kids on trotinettes. A real nightmare.
Any Amazon drivers fancy it. I'm ready for you, now.

Who thinks about who cleans up areas?

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

UK ebikes can have a throttle, but it isn't for travelling anything close to the legal 25kph assistance limit, it's walking speed somewhere under 6kph.

Apparently they can have a throttle - but it needs specific individual authorisation from the DVLA

detailed were discussed on the Pedelecs website some time ago

I think one company was able to supply ebikes with the correct documentation at one point - might have been Ribble???

quite rare though

 

[classic33]

Apparently they can have a throttle - but it needs specific individual authorisation from the DVLA

detailed were discussed on the Pedelecs website some time ago

I think one company was able to supply ebikes with the correct documentation at one point - might have been Ribble???

quite rare though

E-assist bikes supplied before the regulation changes in 2015 can have a throttle. But they're down on power compared to those supplied after the change.

Whisper were the company that would put one of their bikes through the MVSA, for a fee, before supplying it to you.

 

[Bristolian]

The current law allows a throttle to be used up to a speed what is defined as walking speed. I've yet to find a mph number as to what that is. It can also be used in conjunction with pedal assist. So as long as it only works if the pedals are being pushed, it's legal. Again to 15.5mph.

Bikes with motors fitted prior to 1985?? if memory serves can have a throttle without pedal assist but then back then a max power output was only 200w.

Have a read here - https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...cles-eapcs-in-great-britain-information-sheet - scroll down to item 2 in the legal information section.

Something I didn't find an answer to is, can you legally use "walk assist" to move along at walking pace whilst sat on the bike or is it intended to only provide assistance when you are pushing the bike?

 

[Drago]

My wondering was that what we are discussing we are calling "illegal e-bikes" are not bikes and as never been tested/approved are not "motor vehicles".

Cars being driven without insurance are still cars, tested and approved as cars; it's just the drivers that are at fault and they are still driving "vehicles". What we are discussing are not.

Above is my non-expert wondering, not arguing any facts.

The moment they ride one in public they become "motor vehicles" as opposed to "mechanically propelled vehicles" by virtue of the word intended.

The moment they're taken outside with that intent they become motor vehicles. Not type approved or legally compliant ones that can be freely sold for that purpose, but motor vehicles nevertheless.

But you're right. At face value, if you didnt know the quirks of our usually very badly written laws, it doesnt make complete sense.

 

[classic33]

The injuries from e-bike usage seems to becoming an issue in A&E's.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2ejgrw9yepo.amp

 

[Vantage]

I do have to wonder how many of these ebike riders have actually ridden a normal unpowered bike before climbing on them.
First time I had a go on one was my dad's and I found it difficult to steer till I got used to it. The weight alone was surprising to me and that's having ridden loaded touring bikes in the past.

 

[Binky]

I find it somewhat ironic that the police are having a crackdown on illegal ebikes but they have rowed back on taking action against motorists who close pass cyclists.

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

The injuries from e-bike usage seems to becoming an issue in A&E's.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2ejgrw9yepo.amp

The numbers would be more informative if they were split into
legal personal EPAC type bikes
legal bike from a rental scheme
illegal bike of whatever description

saying just "ebike" is used very widely and cover all of the above and hides the actual situation

if legal personal ebikes are causing this problem then they need ot be controlled more maybe
if it is the rental ones then the people using then need to be looked at and the companies need to be checked

highlighting problems is all well and good - but unless the proper data is there then the apparent solutions are wrong or punish people who do not cause the problem

 

[Drago]

or punish people who do not cause the problem

Punishing the innocent with a kneejek response while doing little to inconvenience lawbreakers (who are already breaking laws and wont change just because a new law comes along) is the British way of doing things.