Beyond commuting... losing the car.

[DrSquirrel]

I'm not sure the best subsecton for this.


I've always wondered about the idea of going carless, I doubt I will for some time at least - it's just annoying to cut down on it's use but still have to pay the same Insurance, Tax, Maintence (yes limited but a car sitting for periods isn't good either) on it. Which overall, cost more than the petrol I am "saving".

Usually the likes of commuting and shopping are the first trips we can remove the car from, and can easily be planned for.


What gets to me is the other small and less frequent things we might forget... which I couldn't list them all obvious reasons.


Some of my immediate concerns are...

a. The wife - she doesn't cycle (yet) so it limits her range for going to stuff like doctors, dentists and odds - granted I currently take her everywhere like that.

b. The baby (3mo) - needs checkups, vacinations etc in town (10miles). Not sure if he is ready for a trailer yet, but getting there (if I could get a car seat in the trailer then that would be ace). We are working on getting changed to the doctors in the village (didn't even know they were open full time) so this isn't an issue, same for the above).

I know its a few years down the line but school shouldn't be a problem for primary etc as its only a mile.

c. Emergencies - well I know this from the other day taking the wife to A&E, not immedeately life threatening so an Ambulance would have been okay but I reckon we would have left it longer before calling one which could have made it a different story. In an immediate emergency I could probably get to the hospital quicker than an ambulance let alone wait for it to arrive.

I have possible acess to a car (parents) although not having my own DOC (Drive any car) insurance means I would need to add onto theirs which for some reason isn't cheap and the point of not having to pay for the car insurance is mostly lost. I could drive without insurance in their car (risk it, and/or take the rap) or get them to take me but obviously they are the car are not always near by.


d. Travel - cheap flights (etc) tend to be at unsocialable hours which is hard to get trains and buses at them times, also they tend to be from smaller airports which don't have as good links. I could go for the "more expensive" flights, and then use buses and trains - again the cost of all this (and the lack of flexibility) against just driving. I have thought of hiring a car, which isn't so bad for a weekend sometimes but still need to pay for petrol (and parking which sounds a waste), also I have to drive the car back home first (local one is in the city that will pick you up and take you to the car).

I do want to do a bit of touring (in country first) which could take up some of our "holiday time" which I don't mind not flying abroad etc (although want to see family sometime in the next 12 months).




Commuting is 10 miles, been doing that for a while now. Village shop is 3/4 mile and we often do that just for a walk anyway. Shops are 10 miles to town or 13 miles to the city, don't often go there anyway as we do our shopping same time as the parents, even without that wouldn't be that hard for me to do it on the bike so no problems with commuting + shopping.



Anything else I am missing? any suggestions here and there? Experiences from others that are carless? (and possibly rural).


For my living position, I live rural just outside a village 3/4 mile (nearest bus stop), 10 miles from town (where I work - I could do shopping on the way home etc although cycle light day to day), 13 miles from the nearest city.

 

[magnatom]

Are you looking to have more kids in the future? If so, not having a car does limit you. Having three there is no way I would chose not to have a car. Now they are getting older you need to get them to trampolining, gymnastics, football, swimming, etc. And that is just our 7 month old! (I should add that my wife does the majority of this transporting, and often has to move 3 kids at once to get one kid to where they need to be. Not efficient I know!)

Seriously, though, think hard about how you might use the car in the next year or two. If you really think you will be fine without it, go for it.

 

[HaloJ]

A thought on shopping. Whilst it's not so good for fresh produce (due to short shelf life) you could use a superstore's delivery service. We tend to do so and then we each pick up the odd bit here and there if needed.

Vehicle use itself, as long as you book plenty in advance could be accomplished with hire vehicles or those new fangled shared use schemes.

The main issue is trading off between convenience and cost. Do you have a spare bike that you can use if you're unable to use your main one? Are you or do you commute in all weathers? Snow? How often do the buses run through the village to town?

I think it's all perfectly feasible to do these days especially with the shared ownership schemes. How about keep it for a month just in case but do everything as though you had only the cycles?

Abs

 

[DrSquirrel]

See - told you I'd be forgetting something. And yes we do intend on more, but only 2 unless they're the same gender and thus we will gamble a third maybe.

My wife doesn't drive so not sure how that is going to affect things in the future.


I do have another bike, 2 3 in fact - and will have the fixed built up in a few months. I will commute in all weathers, even snow actually looking forward to it, kind of I didn't commute in last years snow (wasn't working for a while) but I went out in it just for the heck of it

Buses do not run on a time that will get me to work.

 

[Davidc]

Not going to try to answer the basic question, but you can reduce one of those costs you mention - there are insurance policies which cost very little for low use cars. In particular for annual mileage less than 1000, with a higher but still low premium for up to 5000 miles.

If your mileage is really low you can keep costs down by having an old car, buying legal requirements only insurance, and being mean with the maintenance, oil change once a year, replace anything like wiper blades and bulbs that fails the MOT, and that's it.

Although you do have some costs for any car at least you aren't paying for motor fuel when on your bike.

 

[upsidedown]

My partner has my car and does the vast majority of driving. I will do almost anything to avoid having to drive, so wil take the train and bike rather than drive any distance.

We do a big shopping trip once every 2 weeks, that wouldn't be possible without the car, i guess we could get a home delivery but the vegetables always seem a bit suspect.

As a family we walk or cycle to most places, so have only done 6000 miles in the car in the last year, but we couldn't quite do without the car.

 

[400bhp]

It's going to depend on where you live, and in particular access to and service levels of public transport. Also access to, and service levels of, car hire .

There are some car hire companies that now exist to hire a car by the hour. I think these are limited to the bigger cities though and if you're not within walking distance of their drop off/pick up points then it's not particularly convenient.

I use my car at lot less now, but I would rather have it sat there due to the flexibility. Beleive me it isn't cheap to run neither but it's a beast and I can't part with it.

 

[SavageHoutkop]

I don't have a car but am not as rural as you.... (and don't have kids, but having a kid would not make me get a car).

The times when I miss it are needing to get to a shop where the shop is not easily accessible by public transport and you can't bring stuff back from the shop on the bike. [think furniture or something like that]. If you have access to the parents' car, this wouldn't be a problem.

For the early morning holidays etc etc, isn't there a taxi service you could use? Our last trip to the station from home was £5 taxi for two of us, prebooked. [This is of course probably one of those rural/urban divides though].


I'd think that if your parents are close to where you are, it must be cheaper to have one car shared than two - tax, mot, etc. There must be someone who offers a cheaper insurance add on, especially if you are family.

I enjoy shopping on the bike for fruit/veg/milk etc. Other, heavier, things are delivered.

 

[SavageHoutkop]

We do a big shopping trip once every 2 weeks, that wouldn't be possible without the car, i guess we could get a home delivery but the vegetables always seem a bit suspect.

Buy everything *except* the veggies etc online, then buy the veggies etc fresh when you need. Much better

 

[DrSquirrel]

Cars on lower tax bands, more efficent and lower insurance tend to cost more to buy - fuel economy isn't that important if your mileage is low I guess which is one reason why I keep mine (25mpg and I don't drive like a pansy, 2l V6 200bhp). The other part is buying a new (read: second hand newish) car you don't know its history that well (I don't rely on service history) yet I know my own car very well - and maintenance is easier on it - things can be repaired rather than switching out parts at costs etc.

Car hire for a weekend can cost like £30 for 3 days (3 day weekends tend to be cheap), the company will pick me up - obviously I have to drive home (unles I leave directly from there = possible hassle).



As for sharing the parents car - they are actually looking for a second smaller car - my dad has a Shogun which he uses for towing and putting crap in the back (which is handy to borrow to lug big things around too) so they want a small one 1. for my sister to learn in 2. for running around picking up my nan etc and so they both have a car avaliable, having this means if I am on the insurance it wont cost much and there should be most of the time a car avaliable.



Taxi to the train station is about £12 each way. It's just how many places I can get and how often, granted I've never really holidayed in the UK without driving... and airports I have (nearly) always driven though I have always looked into using other transport. The only exception was once to Heathrow but that was on a longhaul BA flight and the time of day their flights are better, that time National Express bus was a good and cheap option.

 

[Eddie]

I don't have a car at the moment. I live with my girlfriend in a city center an currently have no children. I am probably in the group who least need a car but it is a massive pain in the arse not to have one. The infrastructure of this country is just not designed to not have a car. Public transport is fine to get from A to B, but most journey's arn't A to B. They are A. get to bus/train station B. Get from one main hub to another c. Get off train/bus at another main hub d. get a bus to near destination e. Walk to final destination. This is based on having no luggage or having anything to transport.

An example of this, my brother lives 19 miles away from me. It takes about 25 minutes in the car. For various reasons it takes about 1 1/2 hours on public transport and that includes him driving 5 minutes in the car to collect us from the train station.

 

[SavageHoutkop]

I don't have a car at the moment. I live with my girlfriend in a city center an currently have no children. I am probably in the group who least need a car but it is a massive pain in the arse not to have one. The infrastructure of this country is just not designed to not have a car. Public transport is fine to get from A to B, but most journey's arn't A to B. They are A. get to bus/train station B. Get from one main hub to another c. Get off train/bus at another main hub d. get a bus to near destination e. Walk to final destination. This is based on having no luggage or having anything to transport.

An example of this, my brother lives 19 miles away from me. It takes about 25 minutes in the car. For various reasons it takes about 1 1/2 hours on public transport and that includes him driving 5 minutes in the car to collect us from the train station.

This is possibly a good argument for car sharing/hire schemes (I'm looking into them at the moment but haven't found one that quite fits me), although you'd pay for the time it was not in use while (eg) at your brother's.

Of course public transport is never going to improve unless there is a demand for those types of journeys, which there won't be if everyone keeps driving...

 

[biking_fox]

I don't have a car at the moment. I live with my girlfriend in a city center an currently have no children. I am probably in the group who least need a car

SNAP and I don't find it a problem or a pain at all. I get to work quicker than I would driving. Some locations can be more difficult to access than they would with a car. *shrug*

I would say that living outside a suburban area probably doesn't help with going carless.

Holidaying is fine - a little research on choosing your destination helps, but we've not had any problems: including the time we stayed in an isolated shropshire cottage, we just arranged tandem hire for the week.

Not owning a car means that taxis are a perfectly legitimate expense, and we'll take one whenever public transport/cycling isn't convenient - especially early mornings. It's still a LOT cheaper than having a car rusting on the road waiting for the rare occasions it would be used.


About the only time I would liek a car is when I'm trying to get out intot he hills for a long weekend. But then I'm normally going with friends, and am happy to contribute petrol money, or I could hire a car. - being able to drive is avaluable skill.

 

[summerdays]

My friend is car-less but in a city. She has organised various car shares where she has been added to their insurance for only a really small token amount. She does all her shopping by bike when passing shops (much easier in a city), and plans certain trips when she borrows the car. The family (2 adults and 2 teenage children), holiday by public transport - planning well in advance to get the cheap rates. She also knows where to hire a car cheaply. Even her children's bikes have panniers and racks.

I suspect it is a lot harder to do if you aren't in a city with all the facilities near by, and various transport options.

 

[Bman]

We dont have a car on the road ATM. We (Myself, partner and 2yo daughter) live in an town with reasonable public transport. I say reasonable but as pointed out by Eddie, it is just not convenient for 90% of journeys.

The things we find the hardest are:

Getting rid of rubbish/old furniture - Yes we could pay the council to do it, but it would be cheaper to use a car.
Taking our daughter places - Every journey is harder using public transport. for instance, in order to go swimming, we need to pack all the gear into bags that we can carry. Walk 1/2 mile to the bus stop, pay £3 each for return tickets, then walk about 1mile from the bus station to the swimming pool. All while carrying everything we need. If we had a car, we would just load the gear in the boot, strap our daughter into the child seat and drive 5-10 mins down the road. Then park and walk 20 meters into the building.
Special occasions - Recently we were invited to a wedding. which meant travelling 200miles and staying in a B&B for a few nights. If we had a car, we could have driven there and back. Instead we arranged a lift there with someone else and had to book a coach journey for the return leg. The car journey took just over 2hrs. The coach journey took about 9hrs.

Most other things we plan to make as easy as possible without a car. Our dentists is 5 min walk from our house, right by the local shops. Our Dr's is two bus stops away at the closest supermarket. We do all our food shopping like others suggest, large bulky items online via delivery, fresh produce picked up regularly when out on the bike or on the way home from work.

I'm shortly about to start a new job. Instead of a 3 mile commute, it will be 8 miles. It'll take me about 30 mins on the bike or 15 in a car, but If I used public transport:
Bus to town (£3 return), walk to train station (one stop, another £3 return) then I would have a 1.5 mile walk to get to the office. When I went for the interview, I travelled like this and had to allow 3hrs to get there on time.

I can see why most people just use a car!