Bonus ball selling/bidding

[Kevoffthetee]

Has anyone else seen this done. A school friend of mine runs his own window tinting and vinyl graphics business and uses this to promote his business services, as well as other hobby items, in his case motorbikes.

He gauges interest and usually get 40-45 takers out of 49. His last one was a bike worth circa £1000 and he offered 49 numbers at £20, waited for all to cough up their money then the winning ball was from the national lotto on Saturday night.

I think it's quite a clever way to sell things as the odds aren't bad and the system can't be fiddled as all numbers and players are published before the drawer.

 

[Ganymede]

It's a cute idea, but I think you might fall foul of the Gambling Act - this is taken from a pdf downloaded from this site: http://www.institute-of-fundraising.org.uk/guidance/about-fundraising/raffles-and-lotteries/

Private lotteries

Private lotteries include:

 Private society lottery

 Work lottery

 Residents’ lottery



Work lotteries and residents’ lotteries are often sweepstake affairs and must be organised on a single site or premises. The lottery must not be run for profit and all the proceeds must be used for prizes or reasonable expenses incurred in organising the lottery.

Private society lotteries, however, can be used for fundraising:

 Promoted on the organisation’s premises by a member of the organisation, with written authorisation from the organisation.

 Tickets are sold to the organisation’s members and staff working on its premises.

 Tickets must:

give the name and address of the promoters;

give the ticket price; and

state who can buy tickets.



Customer lotteries

 Run by the occupiers of a business premises.

 Tickets can only be sold to customers on a single premises.

 The total value of the prize must not exceed £50.

 No profit can be made from the lottery.


The main preoccupation with the Institute of Fundraising is of course, raising money for charity, but I thought their advice was useful. The phrase "must not be for profit" reappears several times.... One of the unlucky punters could get the hump and bust the whole game, if your friend was also unlucky.

 

[Smokin Joe]

I'm sure there have been cases in the past where this has been done, I seem to recall newspaper reports of a house and a car being sold in this way. I don't remember any issues for the sellers.

 

[Ganymede]

I'm sure there have been cases in the past where this has been done, I seem to recall newspaper reports of a house and a car being sold in this way. I don't remember any issues for the sellers.

Yes I recall that too, though the Gambling Act dates from 2005 so it might have been before that. I seem to remember the house sale. I just had an alert go off in my head because I'd had to look up the act re raffles recently due to a charity thing.

 

[ufkacbln]

The Law Society's advice

It appears thet if you make it a competition with a level of skill then you are on less dodgy ground, although the definition of "Skill and judgement" is open to question.

Look at some of the TV competitions.....

Where does the rain in Spain mainly fall?
a) on the plain?
b) on the train?
c) down the drain?

Gibraltar's most famous landmark?
Is it:
a) a pebble?
b) a stone?
c) a rock?

There were (and I believe still are) accusations that these are so simple that they do not meet the requirements of law, or does it say something about the audience demographics when the producers claim that these are "dificult" questions for their viewers

 

[Ganymede]

The Law Society's advice

It appears thet if you make it a competition with a level of skill then you are on less dodgy ground, although the definition of "Skill and judgement" is open to question.

Look at some of the TV competitions.....






There were (and I believe still are) accusations that these are so simple that they do not meet the requirements of law, or does it say something about the audience demographics when the producers claim that these are "dificult" questions for their viewers

Yes, this is the meat of it, isn't it, quoted from that Law Society website:

"3.1 Illegal lotteries
You must determine if the proposed house competition is in fact a lottery. The Gambling Commission issued guidance on their website on the boundary between prize competitions, free draws and lotteries in November 2007.

A scheme will be a simple lottery if the following criteria are met:

• a person is required to pay to participate
• one or more prizes are allocated
• the allocation of the prize relies wholly on chance.

Under the Gambling Act 2005 lotteries remain the preserve of good causes and therefore cannot be operated for commercial or private gain. Lotteries must be licensed by the Gambling Commission, unless they qualify in one of the exempt categories. Unregistered lotteries are illegal and any funds received from them will be considered the proceeds of crime."

I think I would worry if I were OP's friend, as if someone who lost the lottery came to realise that the process was potentially illegal, it would be a big mess to sort out - and imagine if the original winner had already sold the bike on?

I also would have thought that his pool of subscribers might get quite quickly tired of sploshing out 20 quid on nothing, but then, people do love a flutter and the odds are pretty good compared to 20 tickets for the National Lottery!