Campaign against HID car lights

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Davidc

Guru
Location
Somerset UK
I can't understand why the laws on vehicle lighting don't specify luminous intensity, illuminance, flux, and beam pattern. Specifying input power to the lamp is an anachronism, a left over from before efficiencies rose dramatically.

If it happened though I'd not be surprised to see some of the newer bike lights come under scrutiny.
 

Night Train

Maker of Things
Beam pattern is specified and measured during the MOT test.

The usual 'get around' is to swap the original lighting back onto the car before each MOT.

For a short while back in the 80's I used 200/55W headlights on my Land Rover while I was living in London and drving off road at weekends. The 55W dip caused no problems in my day to day driving (no need for main beam in London) and the 200W main wasn't an issue off road.
I only used them a short while as the heat from the 200W main beam caused the headlight glass to crack sometimes when they got wet.
 

XmisterIS

Purveyor of fine nonsense
I can't understand why the laws on vehicle lighting don't specify luminous intensity, illuminance, flux, and beam pattern. Specifying input power to the lamp is an anachronism, a left over from before efficiencies rose dramatically.

If it happened though I'd not be surprised to see some of the newer bike lights come under scrutiny.

One reason why I don't like those super-bright bike lights (as a cyclist) is that while they are extremely bright, they're still just a spotlight like the less bright ones. So you end up with a postage-stamp sized bit of the road being lit up like daylight and the rest is pitch black. I'd much rather have the same power, but spread over a wide area like a motorbike or car headlight.
 
OP
OP
tyred

tyred

Squire
Location
Ireland
If it happened though I'd not be surprised to see some of the newer bike lights come under scrutiny.

I think they should tbh. I have a Topeak rechargeable 2W LED headlight which is eye wateringly bright but I find it useless for actually seeing where I'm going on an unlit road. I only ever carry it as a backup now and use a dynamo powered Lumotec (halogen) which although dimmer, I find it better for actually seeing the road. The Topeak is just so poorly focused in comparison and I have had people complain about being dazzled by it even though I aim it at the road. And many of the newer LED headlights are much brighter than my Topeak.
 

DiddlyDodds

Random Resident
Location
Littleborough
These lights as said earlier are self leveling , i have a V50 volvo and it failed the MOT as the beam was to high and the adjuster was broke, and as is it was a sealed unit nothing could be done to put right, so a new one was priced up - £500 FOR A HEADLIGHT & £42 for the bulb

Give me back my old lights that you undid two screws and and re leveled for cost of £0.00


Anyway these lights are nothing compared to the bullbar crew ! bullbars give no one a chance if hit and take all the crumple zone out for the car so the passengers suffer also .

Get rid of deathbars before banning lights
 

Zoiders

New Member
HID's have been on the market for the best part of ten years now, I am not certain if the recent upsurge in unfocused bright light syndrome is down to just HIDs, a lot OE units (Audi for instance) are LED.

Something we cyclists are guilty of as well.

I use a Seoul emitter LED light, I know it's going to dazzle if used in the wrong circumstances so it's backed up with a less full on headtorch. I often pass the same guy on my night loop down the lanes who has all the team kit and strangely a very clean/pricey full sus MTB. He is running something like a Lupine or Lumicycle system and he never runs it in the dipped positon, he uses it as a daylight running light as well.

It's pretty anti social even to other cyclists, I have seen him negotiate one junction with it running full blast and drivers are getting it full beam at almost point blank range in the face as they pass him going the other way through the junction, someone is going to hit him sooner or later and it's going to be his fault.
 

Will1985

Guru
Location
Norfolk
+1 for banning or tightening regulations. I find driving at night more difficult now than three years ago when they weren't as common, and I worry that one day I'll be dazzled by some of these oncoming lights and hit a poorly/unlit cyclist.

I've had a close call on my bike as well near home involving a black clad dog walker on the wrong side of the road. I often find myself looking down by the front wheel to make sure the verge is in sight when these cars come towards me.
 

henshaw11

Well-Known Member
Location
Walton-On-Thames
+1 for banning or tightening regulations. I find driving at night more difficult now than three years ago when they weren't as common,

Same here - I wondered whether it was just me...over the last 4 or 5 years, the amount of dazzle on the motorway seems particularly bad. Admittedly my eyes seem to have aged a bit in the last few years (I'm 48 and my close-up vision went from about 4" to 10" in a year), but I'm not sure that explains it completely.

Around town, dazzle from behind seems to be worse with 4x4s, and this bit of Surrey's full of the ruddy things :sad:
 

2PedalsTez

Über Member
If I'm correct I believe factory fit HID units to have a washer system fitted as well?
After market ones are very rarely fitted correctly, hence the levelling issues attached.

Easy option... remove all lowered Citroën Paxo's off the road and you'd probably address the problem in one fair swoop.:smile:
 

Norm

Guest
**ahem** "...fell swoop..." ;) :biggrin:

This is one issue which I fall out with motorcyclists about. There is, IIRC, no bike which is fitted with HID's because of the levelling issues, (it's been announced on the BMW K16 but that hasn't launched yet) but many ignorant selfish ****ers think it's fine to fit the things. It's probably too harsh to say that I won't mourn when one of them temporarily blinds an oncoming driver and gets seriously injured in the inevitable after effects, but then again...
 

PapaZita

Legendary Member
Location
St. Albans
Our new car has HID lights, and at first I was getting flashed at occasionally by oncoming drivers. The garage said that the aim was a bit high, but not so high as to have failed an MOT. They've been lowered to the manufacturers spec, and I haven't been flashed at since. It certainly suggests that the alignment is critical, and perhaps that MOT regulations haven't caught up with the technology yet. From a driver's point of view the HID lights are superb. I notice that my eyes are less tired if I drive a long way at night, and the illumination of pedestrians and ninja cyclists by the kerb is much improved. I'd like to think that these advantages go some way towards offsetting any dazzle problems. It's certainly a debate that I'll be following with interest.

PZ.
 

GrasB

Veteran
Location
Nr Cambridge
It certainly suggests that the alignment is critical, and perhaps that MOT regulations haven't caught up with the technology yet.
Having thought about this, I think with HIDs 'low' level headlights need to be aligned to the current 'high' level headlight specs. A new standard would need to be introduced which would set the aim of the higher level headlights lower than they are currently.
 
Our new car has HID lights, and at first I was getting flashed at occasionally by oncoming drivers. The garage said that the aim was a bit high, but not so high as to have failed an MOT. They've been lowered to the manufacturers spec, and I haven't been flashed at since. It certainly suggests that the alignment is critical, and perhaps that MOT regulations haven't caught up with the technology yet. From a driver's point of view the HID lights are superb. I notice that my eyes are less tired if I drive a long way at night, and the illumination of pedestrians and ninja cyclists by the kerb is much improved. I'd like to think that these advantages go some way towards offsetting any dazzle problems. It's certainly a debate that I'll be following with interest.

PZ.

No gripe with what you are saying really but it does boil down to you having a ton of car racing towards you and normally missing your car by a couple of feet now being driven by a person blinded by your lights. Not sure if this really is a disadvantage that I would accept.
 
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