Car v. Public transport.

[Brandane]

I have tried, honestly I have tried! Who are they kidding when they try to convince us to give up our cars and use public transport?

Example #1. Coming home to Ayrshire from London last Saturday. The London/Glasgow bit was fine, but then I got on the train to Largs, at 7.45pm. A crowd of teenagers had just got off, and the floor was a sea of beer and other "liquid". The whole train was stinking, and filthy. A drunk female was staggering up and down the carriage for a while before locking herself in the toilet for abot 20 minutes. Another crowd of teenagers got on the train, heading for Largs, and ran riot for the remaining part of the journey. This was not an isolated case, I used to do late night trains from Glasgow on a fairly regular basis and it was never a pleasant experience. To the extent that I now avoid them like the plague.

Example #2. Trying to arrange getting to Glasgow with the bike for the start of Pedal for Scotland tomorrow. Latest start time for the ride is 10am. First train to Glasgow arrives at Central station (10 mins from start point) at 9.58 . To add to the problem, there are engineering works tomorrow, with a replacement bus service for part of the journey.

Example #3. Commuting to work. A 25 mile/30 minute journey, door to door, by car. By train, 45 minutes between stations. Add in getting to/from work/home from stations and it becomes 1 hour 10 minutes. Work starts 9am, to get a train means catching 0742 train during the week. If my shift falls on a Sunday, as it does 50% of Sundays, it can't be done for reasons as per example #2. Getting home from work (shift finishes between 9 and 10pm) means another lottery with the hourly service!

Please, no advice to commute by bike! It's a busy trunk road starting with a 3 mile gut buster of a climb, and no viable alternative. Also, shift is 12 hours on a good day, 13 or 14 on a bad day. No way am I spending another 4 hours a day commuting!

 

[Paulus]

Good morning Brandane. I don't know whether you want an answer or not after your bit of a rant there. Certainly in some areas public transport is on the poor side. In the area where I live the transport links are very good, running very early in the mornings and very late at nights, and although the teenagers are much the same as up your way it is not a usual occurrence for the trains and buses to be awash with "fluids". It just happens that you live in an area where the transport links are not good for the journeys you wish to do so that forces you to use your car.

 

[wafflycat]

Where I am, (rural location) public transport provision is just about useless.

Having lived in urban and rural settings, I've found that for local stuff, if you're in a distinctly urban setting, public transport can be practical and efficient, if not always clean. In a rural setting though, it's been cleaner but of exceptionally little practical vale as there's not enough of it.

 

[Archie_tect]

It's a problem created by the freedom the car gives us, allowing us to live remote from each other and our workplaces so trying to compare the use of a car against the cost and logistics of running an efficient local transport system is never going to resolve itself.


Had we not had cars we wouldn't be in this situation and as a result some of us live and work in the 'wrong' places. It will require a massive alteration to both the way we move around and where we need to get to, to improve the effectiveness of transport for the rural population.

 

[asterix]

Early in my working life I decided never to work anywhere I couldn't cycle commute to. Must have saved thousands over 3 decades.

 

[wafflycat]

It's a problem created by the freedom the car gives us, allowing us to live remote from each other and our workplaces so trying to compare the use of a car against the cost and logistics of running an efficient local transport system is never going to resolve itself.


Had we not had cars we wouldn't be in this situation and as a result some of us live and work in the 'wrong' places. It will require a massive alteration to both the way we move around and where we need to get to, to improve the effectiveness of transport for the rural population.

MrWC & I work from home. We go to clients, not they to us. This works best for the clients' benefit. This would be the case whether we lived rural or urban. One of the problems of rural life is that increasingly, governments and too many urban-based people see the countryside as nothing more than a holiday playground for urban dwellers, whereas it is actually a lot more than this, including work and home for people.

 

[Archie_tect]

MrWC & I work from home. We go to clients, not they to us. This works best for the clients' benefit. This would be the case whether we lived rural or urban. One of the problems of rural life is that increasingly, governments and too many urban-based people see the countryside as nothing more than a holiday playground for urban dwellers, whereas it is actually a lot more than this, including work and home for people.

Wasn't a criticism of you or rural life WC just that the effect of having invented the car in the first place has led to the development of lifestyles and working practices that wouldn't be possible without one. So it's no surprise that the transport and infrastructure are weighted in favour of individual freedoms rather than public transport.

 

[marinyork]

It's a problem of expectations the car has given us. Archie_tect is also saying this in a different way imho.

Example #3 is strangely similar to a scenario I had at a job interview a while back. That was going major city --> large town.

Unfortunately a lot of the debate is hogged by people that live in urban areas that claim to live in 'rural' areas.

 

[ColinJ]

It's a problem created by the freedom the car gives us, allowing us to live remote from each other and our workplaces so trying to compare the use of a car against the cost and logistics of running an efficient local transport system is never going to resolve itself.


Had we not had cars we wouldn't be in this situation and as a result some of us live and work in the 'wrong' places. It will require a massive alteration to both the way we move around and where we need to get to, to improve the effectiveness of  transport for the rural population.

All true...


I have never driven so I don't think like a driver and I am apparently a throwback to a distant past.

I therefore choose to live somewhere close to shops, and with good transport links to the rest of the country. I am also a fan of the countryside so I chose Hebden Bridge which has direct rail links to Leeds, Halifax, Bradford, Huddersfield, Manchester, Burnley, Blackburn and Preston (among others), but is only 5 minutes from lovely countryside on foot or by bike.

Many people who used to live in the countryside hardly visited even their nearest town. I spoke to one old farmer up 'on the tops' 4 miles from here and 4 miles from Halifax. He told me that he went to Halifax maybe 2 or 3 times a year, and had only visited Hebden Bridge a couple of times in his entire life. I got the distinct impression that he had never ventured as far as Leeds or Manchester.

 

[Krypton]

Until I can get on a bus that takes me from A to B via whichever other place I fancy, then you're not going to get me to give up my car.

 

[palinurus]

Until I can get a car that allows me to read for the entire journey then I'm not going to give up my train.

 

[Smokin Joe]

Until I can get a car that allows me to read for the entire journey then I'm not going to give up my train.

You're not the driver, are you?

 

[Krypton]

Until I can get a car that allows me to read for the entire journey then I'm not going to give up my train.

Touché ...

 

[Archie_tect]

Until I can get on a bus that takes me from A to B via whichever other place I fancy, then you're not going to get me to give up my car.

Krypton,
That's exactly the point about the 'problem' which the simplicity of car use has created. Nothing can compare to the ease of use and mobility. But, that's what makes it impossible for the foreseeable future to replace it with anything else. Adaption and R+D will continue to make the car affordable in one form or another using whatever fuel is available. But this comes at a price.... which will continue to be the development of a network of local transport coupled with the resettlement of centres of population to take advantage of links and economies of scale.

 

[TheDoctor]

Going to Swansea to visit rellies for the weekend, I can leave work at 12 and do one of the following :-
Ride the Brommie to the station, go to London, ride the Brommie to Paddington, read, drink tea on the train and be in a Welsh pub by 5:45:
Drive round the M25 and along the M4 and be in a Welsh pub as a bag of nerves by 5:45 if I'm lucky.

The cost is about the same if I assume that I put no wear and tear on the car, and I travel first class.
No brainer, really, isn't it?