Concerned about future growth potential.

[dude7691]

Hi All
This is not a pessimistic post. I'm just trying to get a picture of what I can expect from my coming year on the bike. A bit of background:
I am 57kg, 175cm, 20. Body fat percentage around 8% (based on measuring waist). I cycled last year for 2 months relatively seriously, putting in at least 100km a week for 2 months. I was fine with the endurance, however my average speed has always remained low.
My bike is a Triban 520, weighing 10kg. I carry 2kg of luggage and 2 water bottles weighing 600g each (with water). So total bike weight is around 13.5kg once you count computers and lights e.t.c.
On a 12 mile ride across hilly terrain (last year) I could average around 14mph, give or take. I started at 10mph, but never got any faster than 14mph in the final month I was training (of my 2 months I was riding). I also did a 60 mile ride, and averaged 13mph on that, when I was in peak shape.
Now that I'm back at it again, weighing 57kg vs the 52 I used to (mostly muscle gains) I am averaging around 12mph which is not too bad considering I've been out for a year. However, the extra weight has made climbing noticeably harder. However I know the only way to gain more power is either acquiring more muscle mass, making those muscles more efficient (training) or by getting more oxygen to fuel them. The roads where I am are fairly rough by road standards, very aged and uncomfortable over long distances.
On flat ground, for around 30 minutes (I rarely get a chance to test this) I'm comfortable at 17-18mph.
I constantly see people talking about 16-20mph averages (I don't have a power or HR monitor so I have very little else to compare with). And I can't even imagine averaging that on my roads. On flat roads sure, but my roads are extremely inconsistent and people seem to think hills don't affect averages. You might be able to go faster downhill sure, but if I pedaled at the same intensity downhill as I do uphill, I'd be in a ditch! Also to add, surely it's easier to cycle at a constant power e.g. 200W for an hour rather than going 200W, 350W, 100W e.t.c depending on gradient and fluctuating all the time. After a year of training, do you think an improvement from 12-14mph (where I'm at now) to 16-18mph is possible?
Just to add as well, I'm stuck on whether I should gain some weight or not. I know weight is objectively bad on a bike, but if I was putting on weight AND increasing my power more, surely that would help. Heavier riders could probably beast me on the flat. I know hills are important but the majority of all rides are done at a gradient of under 5%, where I assume raw power is the most important thing to get a high average speed. Please do correct me if I'm wrong, I'm here to learn.
Reading off the internet, the average pro male rider is 68kg, which I am 10kg or so below. Would I benefit from eating like a pig for the next few months, and getting myself up by 10kg to give myself the ability to increase my power output? I might weigh nearly 20% more, but if I'm putting out 50% more power then who cares right? On the flat I'll be faster, and on the hills I'll have all out power to give me that boost I need.
I appreciate all advice, I research cycling a lot but want to know if anyone started from my position (10-12mph averages) and managed to get up to 16-18mph within a year or so. Thank you.

 

[Tom B]

Where do you get your average speed from?

I'm very wary and skeptical of stravas average speeds.

Do you know you are comparing apples with apples? I was out on Thursday and found myself in amongst a few bunches of cyclists / club runs. Surprised me that many of them paused their rides everytime they stopped at a red light or behind a car turning right etc. I can only imagine this was to keep the average pace up.

I never do that, and I'm also a crawler to red lights and stops rather than steaming up to the stop line and anchoring on last min. Same in the car where I think they call it defensive driving. All that will drag your average speed down. But then again I rarely chase average speed. I do have it on my garmin display as it's useful if I'm on a schedule.

 

[Racing roadkill]

If you want to improve, you do actually want to vary power. It’s known as ‘interval training’ chewing along at a target power, won’t improve your stat’s.

 

[rivers]

Structured training, whether that is a coach or following a training plan from the likes of training peaks, sufferfest, trainer road, zwift, etc. More time on the bike, with a variety of different types of workouts, endurance, and recovery rides, will make a big difference. Be prepared for it to hurt, and work through the pain. Get a heart rate monitor so you can measure how hard/easy you are working.
I spent lockdown working through a training plan combined with twice weekly zoom turbo sessions put on by my club. I am a stronger rider than pre-lockdown. I rode 120 miles over the past 2 days, faster and with less perceived effort than prior to lockdown. No long rides in the past 10 weeks, but had several long rides before lockdown. This weekends' rides were easier.

 

[dude7691]

Where do you get your average speed from?

I'm very wary and skeptical of stravas average speeds.

Do you know you are comparing apples with apples? I was out on Thursday and found myself in amongst a few bunches of cyclists / club runs. Surprised me that many of them paused their rides everytime they stopped at a red light or behind a car turning right etc. I can only imagine this was to keep the average pace up.

I never do that, and I'm also a crawler to red lights and stops rather than steaming up to the stop line and anchoring on last min. Same in the car where I think they call it defensive driving. All that will drag your average speed down. But then again I rarely chase average speed. I do have it on my garmin display as it's useful if I'm on a schedule.

I just use my bike computer, which is calibrated correctly or failing that just do s = d/t if I think it's wrong. I have strava, but mainly use it for tracking the gradient on my routes as opposed to the speed as I don't trust GPS, it differs wildly from my computer and calculations.

That doesn't surprise me, although I live in the countryside (Pembrokeshire, Wales) so I never have to worry about that.

 

[dude7691]

Structured training, whether that is a coach or following a training plan from the likes of training peaks, sufferfest, trainer road, zwift, etc. More time on the bike, with a variety of different types of workouts, endurance, and recovery rides, will make a big difference. Be prepared for it to hurt, and work through the pain. Get a heart rate monitor so you can measure how hard/easy you are working.
I spent lockdown working through a training plan combined with twice weekly zoom turbo sessions put on by my club. I am a stronger rider than pre-lockdown. I rode 120 miles over the past 2 days, faster and with less perceived effort than prior to lockdown. No long rides in the past 10 weeks, but had several long rides before lockdown. This weekends' rides were easier.

That sounds great, I'll definitely get a heart rate monitor as currently I find myself going into the red far too often. My legs don't hurt anywhere close to my lungs, I have asthma which even with my pumps can be problematic. My lowest gear is a 32/30, so I don't feel my cadence is the problem there.

Sounds like you've had great success with those training plans, congrats! I'm more about pace at the moment as my main goal is getting to a 200km a week commute (40km per day, 5 days a week). Easy I know, but getting the speed up on those rides will be hard.

What's your opinion on the weight thing? Do you think an extra 10kg would beneficial based on my current weight? (Provided I didn't just pile fat on).

 

[rivers]

That sounds great, I'll definitely get a heart rate monitor as currently I find myself going into the red far too often. My legs don't hurt anywhere close to my lungs, I have asthma which even with my pumps can be problematic. My lowest gear is a 32/30, so I don't feel my cadence is the problem there.

Sounds like you've had great success with those training plans, congrats! I'm more about pace at the moment as my main goal is getting to a 200km a week commute (40km per day, 5 days a week). Easy I know, but getting the speed up on those rides will be hard.

What's your opinion on the weight thing? Do you think an extra 10kg would beneficial based on my current weight? (Provided I didn't just pile fat on).

Don't worry about your weight. A structured training plan will give you the gains you are after, especially if you want to commute 200k/week . As someone who commutes that distance (25k into work, 16k home) when not in lockdown, it's a tall order to do every week. I generally commute 4 days/week, have a rest day and do a longer ride at the weekend. I also listen to my body, and might knock it down to 3 days/week or take my wife's e-bike a day or two to give my legs a break. I don't hammer it every ride to work. Some days are recovery, some are my endurance pace, and some are a workout. When I started the commute, it took me nearly 90 minutes on the way in. I'm down to about 60-62 minutes when the weather is nice (58 minutes if I really hammer it), winter is a bit slower at around 68-70 minutes.
Speed isn't free. It takes work and commitment. So for now, find a training plan. Stick to it. When clubs start riding again, join a club, ride with people faster than you. You need to put some effort in.

 

[DCLane]

Why the focus on weight?

It's your power you need to develop; intervals / structured sessions have been mentioned above and I'd recommend adding in appropriate gym training. As your power increases muscle also increases = weight gain

 

[dude7691]

Don't worry about your weight. A structured training plan will give you the gains you are after, especially if you want to commute 200k/week . As someone who commutes that distance (25k into work, 16k home) when not in lockdown, it's a tall order to do every week. I generally commute 4 days/week, have a rest day and do a longer ride at the weekend. I also listen to my body, and might knock it down to 3 days/week or take my wife's e-bike a day or two to give my legs a break. I don't hammer it every ride to work. Some days are recovery, some are my endurance pace, and some are a workout. When I started the commute, it took me nearly 90 minutes on the way in. I'm down to about 60-62 minutes when the weather is nice (58 minutes if I really hammer it), winter is a bit slower at around 68-70 minutes.
Speed isn't free. It takes work and commitment. So for now, find a training plan. Stick to it. When clubs start riding again, join a club, ride with people faster than you. You need to put some effort in.

That sounds great, my commute is identical each way, the same route. It's slightly downhill on the way in (-300ft over 20k is not much) and I could do that in 52 minutes at my prime. The way back was just a tad over one hour, and the main reason was a 10 minute, 16% hill on the way home, which was a 350ft climb if I recall. The main road was always an option, but I hated it.

I got you, speed is much harder than distance fully appreciate that. I've never ridden in a club before, or alongside anyone for that matter. I'm also just in a t shirt and shorts, I wouldn't fit in with the guys in lycra I know how significant slipstreaming is in terms of saving power, but I would want to be at 16mph solo at least before I'd feel comfortable mixing with the clubs.

 

[dude7691]

Why the focus on weight?

It's your power you need to develop; intervals / structured sessions have been mentioned above and I'd recommend adding in appropriate gym training. As your power increases muscle also increases = weight gain

My main reason for focusing on it is a low BMI, my BMI is just 18.7 which is technically underweight. Thought maybe by packing on some pounds I'd have a bit more energy to work with. I'm only 8% body fat as it is, so not like I have a huge amount of energy reserves. Understand what you're saying though, I'm sure once I have more muscle I'll be nudging 60kg's which I would be content with.

 

[mjr]

The other things that will make big differences to your speed besides power are tyre selection (see www.bicyclerollingresistance.com but the easiest tyres have other drawbacks) and aerodynamics: IIRC air resistance increases with the square of the speed increase beyond a certain point, so reducing your frontal area is very beneficial, as long as you can still put the power out.

 

[PaulSB]

I'm unsure as to why you're worried. I'm 66 years old, 168cm, 68kg. So weight apart we are similar in build. I ride +/- 300km/week. People are kind enough to say I'm a good climber.

I've checked a couple of recent rides for distance/climb/average. One included a UK top 100 climb, the other a notorious local hill. I got 28 miles/2700 feet/13.6 avg and 40 miles/3200 feet/15.1 avg.

I've had a look at one of the top riders in my club. This guy is seriously good. 107/4700/19.9 another was 104/7700/17.6.

On a flat ride, round here anything of 60+ miles and less than 2500 feet is flat, I would average 16/17mph. It's only the top guys in my club who average 20 or more.

You don't give distances and feet climbed but I'd say 14mph on hilly rides is decent. You'll have to be very good to improve that significantly. I don't see a problem with 12mph but you've already proven you can hit 14. It won't take long to get there.

You mention power and raw power. Climbing hills is as much about technique as power. I think you need to understand the benefits of sitting in and spinning up a hill. I've been mentoring a friend on this recently. Her climbing style was to grip the hoods hard and tight, drop her body forward, and push hard. She's now learnt to relax her grip, sit up, use the centre of the bars, spin and generally relax. She now picks up PBs on every ride, has several local QOMs and arrives at the top able to speak!! 😄 She's often on my shoulder now, that never happened three months ago. ☹

The distances you mention are low and good for training. When I commuted 240km/week I was very fit and strong without even thinking about structured training. The only real way to get better on hills is to ride them. If you can design a good local hilly circular route and ride repeats. Lockdown has limited my riding to 5 x 30/35 miles a week. I'm currently fitter and stronger than I have been for 10 years.

As an aside I don't understand why you don't trust GPS for data. I recently undertook a climbing challenge. Out of interest I used four different recording methods - the variation in climbing data was 37 feet. Average speed was 0.1mph variation.

Good luck I'm sure you'll get there but don't kick yourself if you don't. You are aiming to be a very serious rider if you're hoping to hit averages of 20mph in hilly terrain. Nothing wrong with targets and ambition but be realistic and don't beat yourself up over it.

Relax!

 

[screenman]

Stick a number on your back, that will always make a difference.

 

[PaulSB]

Stick a number on your back, that will always make a difference.

 

[fossyant]

You need to ride more. Simple. Riding for 8 or 9 weeks in a year isnt enough. These things take time, and you've got to keep riding, otherwise you lose it.