E Scooter on Trains

[mjr]

E-bikes were among the items exempted from the ban - see the bottom of the press release from May 2023:
https://www.greateranglia.co.uk/abo...articles/greater-anglia-ban-e-scooters-1-june

It seems https://www.greateranglia.co.uk/travel-information/your-journey/cycling has changed too. The only quirk I spotted now is that folding e-bikes aren't allowed on bustitutions.

I've seen a few home modified or downright illegal ones onboard that I'd like to have seen refused carriage when I've used GA in the past few years.

Often, such things are not e-bikes, but motorbikes or e-scooters. Calling them "illegal e-bikes" is unhelpful and feeds the hate and punishment against legal e-bikes and their users.

 

[mjr]

True - but you would need to get you understaffed train stations to stop and check every potential ebike

That sounds like allowing perfection to be the enemy of better. Policing the motorbike ban doesn't have to be perfect. Same as they currently don't police the e-scooter ban perfectly. Heck, they don't police "you must buy a ticket before boarding the train where sales facilities exist" anything like perfectly, but almost nobody argues that it means they can't police it at all.

but my previous bike had a similar sticker - and it could easily have had a dodgy battery stuffed into the battery holder and it would have worked fine
so the plate on the bottom would still be there but would prove nothing

Yes, the batteries should have to have an official sticker with a QR code or similar that can be scanned to validate the battery, but unsafe batteries is a far more general problem than just on trains.

 

[N0bodyOfTheGoat]

Would it help weed out the homebrew ebikes by paying a LBS to inspect ebikes regularly (every 2 years?) and add legit ebikes {and banned homebrews} to a register with photo of ebike, with a QR sticker or code on the ebike, that rail staff could input on the register app?

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

Often, such things are not e-bikes, but motorbikes or e-scooters. Calling them "illegal e-bikes" is unhelpful and feeds the hate and punishment against legal e-bikes and their users.

It would certainly help if the media (etc) would stop referring to transport devices with 2 wheels and an electric motor all in the same way - as ebikes

People on here will generally know that there are legal versions which could more properly referred to as Pedalecs or EPACs

and the ones that are not compliant with these regulation should be referred to as mopeds or motorbikes - the power source is not all that relevant
nor is it relevant that the motor and battery are nailed onto some sort of bicycle


It seems that some of the more responsible media are starting to use better words to describe them but the general public seems to think of them all the same
It will be a slow process to change the way people think - as always

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

Would it help weed out the homebrew ebikes by paying a LBS to inspect ebikes regularly (every 2 years?) and add legit ebikes {and banned homebrews} to a register with photo of ebike, with a QR sticker or code on the ebike, that rail staff could input on the register app?

That would help sort out the dodgy ones
and would provide a handy source of income for LBSs


But as always enforcement would be the problem
but if all bike had to go through a aspecific gate at railway station where the QR code could be checked it might help
assuming that the rail companies are happy to do the checking

actually it wouldn;t help here - because the stations are too small to do the checking - but it would help in bigger stations like city centres

 

[mjr]

Would it help weed out the homebrew ebikes by paying a LBS to inspect ebikes regularly (every 2 years?) and add legit ebikes {and banned homebrews} to a register with photo of ebike, with a QR sticker or code on the ebike, that rail staff could input on the register app?

It might help, but who pays, does there need to be only one app, it would need to be on some sort of anti-tamper label across the battery case seal, and there are still a lot of other potentially-a-bit-flamey batteries that should be addressed. Focusing on e-bikes or even e-scooters seems like dealing with only a fraction of the danger, especially when some e-scooters can be folded and put in a backpack and some e-unicycles look like suitcases.

 

[classic33]

Leeds-Live can't even spell the bikes name right (Cerrera not Carrera): Leeds e-bike rider in hospital with serious head injury after crash

And in this one they start by calling it an e-bike, then later decide its actually an electric motorbike: Paramedics rush e-bike rider to hospital after Leeds crash

For the motorbike part it seems to be the quote from West Yorkshire Police being reported.

 

[Time Waster]

I tend to wonder if technically this attitude is completely correct.

AIUI the E-bike is derived from bike which is derived from bicycle. That is a two wheeled vehicle with pedals to provide drive. If the E-bike has pedals that work even if they have a motor or do not meet a legal requirement they are still bicycles. They can be used as a normal bicycle.

The distinction is whether it is legal or not. There are many requirements to be called a legal E-bike but that IMHO does not stop the basic premise that these are two wheeled personal transportation with pedals to drive it forwards.

It is not terminology that creates media hysteria but the media editorial position. Media often drives attitudes but also the way people use the technology. Put simply any driver that sits in traffic while they watch legal or illegal e-bike riders scoot along without delay in and among the traffic jam. That annoys and triggers many. Just like illegal e-bikes triggers legal e-bike users and normal bike users to complain about them. Perhaps they do not like the unregulated, illegal e-bike user pass them through traffic too?

 

[Jenkins]

You do t need to be qualified to look for the compliance plate/decal. If it doesn't have one its not a legal EPAC, regardless of whether it otherwise comforms to the cut out limit, etc.

Regular, ie, non specialist, bobbies are taught to look for the compliance plate/decal without any specialist knowledge or training. All it takes is functioning eyes and an idea of what they look ljke and where theyre typically found. No qualifications required.

As has been pointed out before, the compliance stickers are easily available online for a few pounds.

Put a dodgy sticker on the 'bike' on the right photographed at London Bridge station just over half an hour ago and it would pass your test.

 

[classic33]

As has been pointed out before, the compliance stickers are easily available online for a few pounds.

Put a dodgy sticker on the 'bike' on the right photographed at London Bridge station just over half an hour ago and it would pass your test.
View attachment 777681

Appears to be missing the all important pedals.

 

[raleighnut]

You do t need to be qualified to look for the compliance plate/decal. If it doesn't have one its not a legal EPAC, regardless of whether it otherwise comforms to the cut out limit, etc.

Regular, ie, non specialist, bobbies are taught to look for the compliance plate/decal without any specialist knowledge or training. All it takes is functioning eyes and an idea of what they look ljke and where theyre typically found. No qualifications required.

load of bollocks. I've converted Maz's bike and my trike 12 years ago neither has burst into flames or stopped working................BTW both were done before the regulations changed

 

[Dogtrousers]

load of bollocks. I've converted Maz's bike and my trike 12 years ago neither has burst into flames or stopped working................BTW both were done before the regulations changed

Sadly this was the last that any of us heard from @raleighnut

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

If the "bike" doesn;t have pedals then it is clearly illegal

the sticker problem is more serious
I just found a place on ebay where you can get 2 Bafang sticker for £3.50

but I doubt many people would do that for the average dodgy ebike conversion

but it still it does show that it goes back to enforcement

if a lot of people get stopped and told to show the machine is legal then they will eventually stop using the dodgy ones

and at the moment there seems to be naff all enforcement



Having said which - the number of dodgy ones I see around here has dropped greatly
I still see some that are home build one and probably >250W and all that
but they are being ridden properly and generally look like they are just being used for commuting

so something is putting the idiots off

 

[mjr]

As has been pointed out before, the compliance stickers are easily available online for a few pounds.

Put a dodgy sticker on the 'bike' on the right photographed at London Bridge station just over half an hour ago and it would pass your test.

And that's why the current compliance "kitemark" plates/stickers are rubbish. It needs to be something that can be verified as authenticated, current and valid. We know this. We've known this for ages. Commercial companies selling expensive things have been doing verifiable compliance labels for decades and the fakes basically rely on victims not verifying them carefully enough (or at all). Heck, we can verify a bank card in seconds now. Yet legislators still seem to believe in the power of magic "kitemark" symbols printed onto things, rather than realtime validation.

 

[raleighnut]

Sadly this was the last that any of us heard from @raleighnut

Nae..................still kicking here.