Either of these worth saving?

[Cycleops]

Saw these two at the same place I bought the Allan. The Raleigh has a Nottingham head badge and the only original bits look like the chainset and frame. Wrap over seat stays so I thought it may be a bit special. The other one has 105 group set on it and is quite light so may be 531. Unfortunately it’s been painted and no markings are visible. I’ve been looking for a bike for a single speed project so thought one of these might do. I particularly like the Raleigh and it’s my size. Any idea as to date?

 

[midlife]

The metallic Raleigh has a Carlton frame with Crespera lugs, usually a USA export, looks like a 25" long fellow size

The hand painted frame has shot in seat stays which required a degree of skill and the lugs, dropouts and fork crown look nice so not a shabby frame and likely good tube set.

 

[raleighnut]

If you must 'single speed/fixie' a bike then the Raleigh/Carlton is a better bet, no hanger to saw off.

 

[biggs682]

Both look good to me

The metallic one is more original so better but either would do

 

[DCLane]

Of the two I'd recommend the Raleigh. Looks like it'll need less work.

 

[Cycleops]

The metallic Raleigh has a Carlton frame with Crespera lugs, usually a USA export, looks like a 25" long fellow size

That would tie in, there's a Swiss I think dealer sticker. I've had another look and the black panel on the top tube has 'Grand Prix' on it. Ring any bells?

 

[SkipdiverJohn]

The big frame with the wrapover stays will almost certainly be made from Carlton "tru-wel" steel, a sort of hi-tensile+ quality from reading between the lines of the literature I've seen.
The smaller one I would imagine is either 531 or some flavour of Columbus, I can't see anything with those sort of seatstays being built from regular cooking-grade steel tubing.

 

[Bonefish Blues]

I'd at least be seeing what decals were under the no-name's rather inexact spray job. I sense good news.

 

[SkipdiverJohn]

If the vendor is being sensible on price, I'd be inclined to take the pair of them, if nothing else the second bike could be used for mechanical spares and the frame clearly isn't a cheap one. i know from comments previously made by @Cycleops and the bargain Colnago he sourced for Mr. Biggs, that drop bar bikes aren't especially sought after in that neck of the woods. That could work in the buyer's favour if the locals aren't enamoured of that sort of bike..

 

[Illaveago]

Both !
The dark green one looks interesting with the sloping crown forks . I would think a lot of the horrible green would wash off with some cellulose thinners . I wonder if any transfers are hiding underneath ?