Face to Face With History

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Mattonsea

Mattonsea

Über Member
Location
New Forest
I have been lucky in meeting people who have been part of those defining points in history. On the ferry over the channel to watch the Le Mans 24 , I struck up a conversation with an American veteran of D day.He grew up in the mid west on the family farm and joined up to fight in Europe. He was going back for the first time since 1944.
 

ASC1951

Guru
Location
Yorkshire
...Changes nowadays are incremental rather than world changing and yes kids today are immune to them because the fantasy world that they inhabit via online games and films dulls their appreciation of innovation.
No, I don't think that's right. It only looks incremental to us because we are living through it - you can't usually tell what is truly world changing until time has passed and the world has changed. IMO genetic modification of plants and insects will turn out to be in that category, as will gene therapy.
 

vernon

Harder than Ronnie Pickering
Location
Meanwood, Leeds
No, I don't think that's right. It only looks incremental to us because we are living through it - you can't usually tell what is truly world changing until time has passed and the world has changed. IMO genetic modification of plants and insects will turn out to be in that category, as will gene therapy.

Poor phrasing on my part. I should have written, "Appear to be incremental"
 

ayceejay

Guru
Location
Rural Quebec
I dunno but the change I wish I could have witnessed is a change in the cruelty we show to others who are ostensibly the same as us.
I was there through some of the recent technological changes but when my Dutch friends told me of their life in Indonesia before the Japanese and after I never witnessed change like that. The Burma railway - intense cruelty from Japanese guards at their 'camp' - a memory that sixty years later wakes you in the middle of the night - no I only know about that from them.
Yet still torture seems to be OK for some today.
 

swee'pea99

Squire
Benny had been in Auschwitz, but he never talked about it and neither did we. Every now and then he'd lean out over the desk and his sleeve would ride up and you'd glimpse the tatoo'd number on the inside of his forearm...

I just finished watching the film of Cider with Rosie, where Lee says something like: 'I was of the last generation to live a life that hadn't changed for 500 years, a life of quiet ad isolation, where few people left and fewer came, and none for pleasure, and the fastest thing in life was a horse.' History rolls on, of course, but I think that is a real and fundamental change between Lee's (WW1, give or take) generation and today's: their lives were essentially changeless, in a way that is now utterly gone. The young today take change of even the most radical kind absolutely in their stride...it's just where they live, the air they breath.
 

asterix

Comrade Member
Location
Limoges or York
My eldest is studying the Holocaust this term and the school organized a meeting with Mala , a 89 year old polish lady who survived the genocide. Parents had a separate meeting . Obviously her story was harrowing , and has left a massive impression on me. Have any of you had a meeting with some one who lived through history?

Only mum (WRNS, 1944-5) and dad (Royal Artillery, 1939 - 1946). And my cousin, R.A.F. Cold War pilot. On the 15th he and I are meeting up to try to finalise a book based on the account my dad left. Pre-publication reviewers seem to think it's historically important.

One aspect that surprised me was that the Liberating Army were told quite early on about concentration camps, unlike the 'Band of Brothers' version where it was a sudden revelation. The camps held not just victims of racism but all sorts considered 'undesirable' by the occupiers. It's not in the least strange that this would have included racists.

Certainly we are all living through history, but what is our contribution to the time we live in or the times we hope to live in later on? Vegetables live through history, maybe only genetically modified ones MAKE history!
 

gbb

Squire
Location
Peterborough
I recently had the great pleasure of meeting and talking to Sir John Hall DFC who was a veteran of 60 sorties as rear gunner in a Lancaster during WW2.

After cheating to join up at 17, he underwent training then joined in a strange selection process where about 120 men were basically left in a large hall and told to form themselves into flight teams of 5 - pilot, navigator, front gunner, rear gunner and bomb-man.

He had lots of funny and poignant stories, with one involving Sir Winston Churchill taking a ride in his plane during which he insisted on sitting on a flight crate to and refusing to move to a normal seat until John informed him that the crate contained explosives which - if jolted- could give Winnie a rather sore posterior.

The most moving story was of a crew-mate and very great friend of his - more like a brother - who had been with John since day 1, however, he had a medical condition which grounded him following his 59th sortie, and both he a John were to return to stop flying after their 60nd flight. The average lifespan for a crew member was 5 sorties!

On johns final flight, his plane's controls/flaps froze over Eastern Europe and the only way they could steer was by throttling on or off the port or starboard engines.
Before ditching the plane, They had to use as much fuel as they could by flying straight across England and Wales then take a slow port steer to bring them back over land toward Devon before jumping out (with parachutes) so the plane would eventually ditch into the channel - amazing!!!

John was then scheduled to work as ground crew and remembers seeing his old crew-mate friend off on his final flight from which he never returned as his plane was downed somewhere over Germany.
For nearly 3-years John kept trying to find out what happened to his friend to no avail.

In 2011 at an old army friends gathering, John was telling another old airman his story, when he was introduced to a lady whose father had been shot down over Germany - she was the daughter of his friend and told John that her fathers plane had been found in Belgium in '47 and that his grave was in a Belgian war cemetery.

A support group for ex servicemen in the North East helped raise funds for John to go over there in 2012 where he was eventually able to say goodbye to his old friend.

A very moving, poignant and heart-warming story of a regular bloke who just did his bit and made a deep and lasting friendship.

Edited: I had the number of missions/sorties wrong
We had a Lancaster rear gunner in a former employer of mine...in his 60s he was a very bleak, morose fella who was an alcoholic.
nce you got to know him, he was a nice chap, but until you did you'd just think..miserable git. He did (the figures arent correct, a rough estimation based on something said 20 plus years ago)..3 tours. Each tour was around 20 or 30 missions, so he did 60 to 90 missions and survived...and bear in mind the life expectancy was 5 missions (based on Tonys post above)...its astronomically good luck, yet it seemed to have changed him for the worse.
 

gbb

Squire
Location
Peterborough
I'd a relative in the RFC, who specialised in Zepplin hunting and another that was on the "Cambletown". Both were considered outcasts/black sheep because they fought on the wrong side.
Same but different, Denis Markovic, Yugoslav who worked alongside me in the 70s, was an aging man. We talked about his home..i asked if he went back, on holiday perhaps. Noooo, i can't, he replied. Why ?, because he fought on the wrong side in the war, not for the Nazis, but not for the Communists, so after the war he feared retribution so he left Yugoslavia, his home and family, to live in the UK. He did go back after he retired, some 50 years after leaving, but he was very worried about getting past border controls etc.
It might be boring, but i'm glad i live now, not sometime between 1900 and 1945.
 

EltonFrog

Legendary Member
My eldest is studying the Holocaust this term and the school organized a meeting with Mala , a 89 year old polish lady who survived the genocide. Parents had a separate meeting . Obviously her story was harrowing , and has left a massive impression on me. Have any of you had a meeting with some one who lived through history?

Back in the 70's I had an art teacher who's name was Mala, she had a number tattooed on her arm, it wasn't until years later I realised the significance of that number. I don't remember being told about the holocaust in school.
 
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Mattonsea

Mattonsea

Über Member
Location
New Forest
Back in the 70's I had an art teacher who's name was Mala, she had a number tattooed on her arm, it wasn't until years later I realised the significance of that number. I don't remember being told about the holocaust in school.
It could of been her, where was your school??
 
Slightly OT, but when cycle touring I stopped overnight at a small village called Blaxhall and spent a delightful evening at a Ceilidh in the Ship Inn.

There was a ocal project there, where school children were interviewing and recording the older members of the community as part of a local history project aiming to preserve the local history

There is such a wealth of memory and knowledge being lost when the memories die with the indivisua and it is importantthat this is passed on
 
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