summerdays
Cycling in the sun
- Location
- Bristol
I think it sounds good news on the face of it ... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-13356057 but how many will actually get fined based on the amount of driving whilst on the mobile phone that still goes on.
Fixed Penalty Notices for Careless Driving
- Thread starter summerdays
- Start date
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campbellab
Senior Member
- Location
- Swindon
The video they played along with the news article showed lots of driving that didn't seem that bad. 
2Loose
Guru
- Location
- Loughborough, Leicestershire.
All I see is yet another law that cannot possibly be policed due top a lack of police.
Mobile phone usage while driving is still rife, yet that has been punishable by fine for years.
It is all fine and well for the Govt. to make these laws up - great PR - but if they cannot provide the resources for it to be enforced, then it is nothing more than smoke and mirrors. Ultimately the police will get the blame when this new law isn't enforced, so they are being set up for another fall imo.
Mobile phone usage while driving is still rife, yet that has been punishable by fine for years.
It is all fine and well for the Govt. to make these laws up - great PR - but if they cannot provide the resources for it to be enforced, then it is nothing more than smoke and mirrors. Ultimately the police will get the blame when this new law isn't enforced, so they are being set up for another fall imo.
400bhp
Guru
Possibly, yes. I haven't read the detail but could such fines be imposed externally, ie by the use of CCTV?
Saw this on BBC news this morning. While the interviewer was chatting to the RAC spokesperson on a traffic island a flatbed truck rolled past and someone in the rhs (drivers?) seat hung out of the window and shouted "ygggbredorwagaddub" at the camera.
The RAC chap was good, effectively saying it was great in principle but no resources = no policing. He also mentioned the positive impact good road quality has on road safety.
Interviewer then went on to say that there were limited resources to do this and the govt was trying to do this as cost-effectively as possible, and he basically replied "look, we're going to have to make up our minds how much money we're prepared to spend to save lives, and we could do a lot better than we're doing today".
This will be another toothless piece of legislation, I think. And what does it do that the Driving Without Due Care and Attention charge doesn't? It is because that charge is harder to make stick?
The RAC chap was good, effectively saying it was great in principle but no resources = no policing. He also mentioned the positive impact good road quality has on road safety.
Interviewer then went on to say that there were limited resources to do this and the govt was trying to do this as cost-effectively as possible, and he basically replied "look, we're going to have to make up our minds how much money we're prepared to spend to save lives, and we could do a lot better than we're doing today".
This will be another toothless piece of legislation, I think. And what does it do that the Driving Without Due Care and Attention charge doesn't? It is because that charge is harder to make stick?
gaz
Cycle Camera TV
- Location
- South Croydon
As i've blogged about. The roads are unpoliced, how can people get fines if no one is out there to give them out?
DrSquirrel
Guest
On the spot fines, what about points?
Will you be allowed to drive away if you get over 12 points? Just like Miss 39pts...
If you can drive like a twat, and get a £60 fine, there is no incentive to drive properly... specially if you're well off.
Oh, and this is a war on motorists.... of course
Will you be allowed to drive away if you get over 12 points? Just like Miss 39pts...
If you can drive like a twat, and get a £60 fine, there is no incentive to drive properly... specially if you're well off.
Oh, and this is a war on motorists.... of course
Wankelschrauben
Guest
I am against the idea personally, the police are enforcers of the law, but they are not judge, jury and executioner, it takes years and years studying law to achieve that status.
It wasn't very long ago that Police effectively had powers removed thanks to new legislation preventing the regular reasonless abuse towards particular groups of our motorists in our society, giving them this power will not only re-instate that old abuse but exceed it.
Where will these powers end? It won't be just motorists, cyclists will be targetted also. There won't be any excuses and no higher power will care.
With no court process in place, who is going to police the police?
It wasn't very long ago that Police effectively had powers removed thanks to new legislation preventing the regular reasonless abuse towards particular groups of our motorists in our society, giving them this power will not only re-instate that old abuse but exceed it.
Where will these powers end? It won't be just motorists, cyclists will be targetted also. There won't be any excuses and no higher power will care.
With no court process in place, who is going to police the police?
mcshroom
Bionic Subsonic
- Location
- Egremont, Cumbria
If you read the comments on the BBC article this is either a measure to turn coppers into Judge, Jury and Exocusioner or a personal raid on the commenter's piggy banks. A few guilty conciences methinks 
BentMikey
Rider of Seolferwulf
- Location
- South London
I'm with gaz, all we need are more traffic police and enforcement of existing laws.
pshore
Well-Known Member
- Location
- Last contour N of Cambridge
Philip Hammond was on Radio4 briefly this morning. Around 8:20am I think. There was no huge debate.
I can't quite remember all the arguments in detail (so listen to it yourself), but I am left with the impression that the police tended not to prosecute as much as they should because the court process is very costly especially in terms of officer time. If you free up some officer time they will be policing the streets more.
With regards to cycling, I can't see us benefitting in the short term. The biggest issue we have (ok for me) is close passing and I don't feel the police really understand what is dangerous and what is not. This is compounded by some very thin cycle lanes that effectively legalise close passing.
They also talked on Radio4 about the backup of video evidence (shot from the police car) if a driver chooses to object and go to court. It makes me wonder if helmet cams can play a part in capturing bad drivers but given what I have read on previous threads, I doubt it.
I can't quite remember all the arguments in detail (so listen to it yourself), but I am left with the impression that the police tended not to prosecute as much as they should because the court process is very costly especially in terms of officer time. If you free up some officer time they will be policing the streets more.
With regards to cycling, I can't see us benefitting in the short term. The biggest issue we have (ok for me) is close passing and I don't feel the police really understand what is dangerous and what is not. This is compounded by some very thin cycle lanes that effectively legalise close passing.
They also talked on Radio4 about the backup of video evidence (shot from the police car) if a driver chooses to object and go to court. It makes me wonder if helmet cams can play a part in capturing bad drivers but given what I have read on previous threads, I doubt it.
MrHappyCyclist
Riding the Devil's HIghway
- Location
- Bolton, England
Part of the problem is that close passing isn't illegal (in this country), whether there is a cycle lane or not. As long as they don't hit you, they haven't broken any laws.
