KMC Chains, specs, speeds and wear-resistance

[fossyant]

Can't believe Wafter never covered the finish. I buy X8's alot and get the all silver version. My 10 speed MTB runs SRAM so I use SRAM chains and I have Ultegra 10 chain on my CX as they were on offer. Key point for me, the chains are silver.

 

[sevenfourate]

Can't believe Wafter never covered the finish. I buy X8's alot and get the all silver version. My 10 speed MTB runs SRAM so I use SRAM chains and I have Ultegra 10 chain on my CX as they were on offer. Key point for me, the chains are silver.

Absolutely concur.

The alternative is sometimes Black (Blurgggghhh). And often Brown:
Which is the colour of rust, dog turds and Austin Alegro’s……

 

[wafter]

Am I mis reading the above because it seems contradictory
Paraphrasing...

'Some advocate the fitting of higher speed chains (9sp on an 8 etc etc)'
But later
'Apparently theres nothing to be gained by fitting say a 10 sp chain to a 9 setup etc etc'

The one thing that always occured to me was, as I progressed through bikes and increasing speeds was how the higher the speed, the more often you find yourself replacing chains.
If I think back to my 8 speed (and definately before that), I rarely remember chains.
As I got up to 10 speed, 1800 miles was about all i vould get no matter the chain manufacturer.

Now this can be offeset/explained by the fact I got progressively stronger, more force and wear through the chain...but the one abiding thought I stuck with was chain width decreasing. Tgis literally gives you a shorter pin and therefore the contact point between pin and roller is decreased...therefore HAS to increase wear.

So technically, flitting a higher speed chain to a lower speed setup is theoretically defeated by increased wear on the shorter pin. Equally, better wear resistance on better chains may offset that.
Clear as mud eh
So many variables...

It's not actually contradictory but I can see how it might easily be misinterpreted as such.

The first bit is correct, the latter you quote me incorrectly. To confirm:

As the number of speeds increases so the external width of associated chains decreases proportionally to reflect the shrinking pitch between the sprockets - which may or may not lead to functional compatibility issues.

My statement about "nothing to be gained..." is relative to fitting a 9sp chain to anything running fewer speeds, or an 11sp chain to 10sp... since it appears (at least in the case of KMC chains) that there's a significant disconnect in material quality / tolerances / price between 9sp chains and below, and 10/11sp chains.

It seems that 10 & 11 speed chains are made to a better standard than 8/9 speed items - hence from this perspective there's an argument for fitting say a 10 or 11sp chain to an 8 or 9sp setup, but not for fitting a 9sp to an 8sp setup, or 11sp to a 10sp setup for example. If this makes sense

You make an interesting observation about wear, although I think your reasoning is flawed (as mine was for a long time). While the external width of the chains shrinks with increasing no. speeds, this is because the pins and plates are getting thinner. However the internal width, and hence the associated wear surfaces / bearing areas are the same so from this perspective longevity should be unaffected.

It's my suspicion that it's this shrinking plate thickness that's precipitated a move to higher grade materials to retain enough strength to prevent them failing in tension.. a possible side effect being that there has also been a corresponding improvement in wear characteristics thanks to said improvement in materials.

 

[fossyant]

I have 9 speed Dura Ace chain on my 8 speed Dura Ace equipped bike. Just reduces chain rub a bit with the front mech cage.

 

[wafter]

Can't believe Wafter never covered the finish. I buy X8's alot and get the all silver version. My 10 speed MTB runs SRAM so I use SRAM chains and I have Ultegra 10 chain on my CX as they were on offer. Key point for me, the chains are silver.

This wasn't covered at the time since:

a) I'd had little experience of different finishes, and
b) There was enough to cover just with the different variations otherwise

I have since had a bit more experience of the finishes available (although it may surprise you to learn than I've not paid a massive premium to make my bike look like it belongs at a pride march).

Having run both a silver / black and grey / grey chain in rotation under similar conditions, interestingly the former (which is typically more expensive) shows a lot more corrosion than than the grey one (which isn't the expensive "corrosion proof" EPT).. so in future these will by my go-to.

One of the reasons for running different finishes was to make identification easier for waxing / rotation - still not sure how I'm going to get my head around that if I end up using all the same finish eventually..

 

[Ajax Bay]

Don't your hands get sweaty wrapped up like that?

Welcome back!

 

[fossyant]

This wasn't covered at the time since:

a) I'd had little experience of different finishes, and
b) There was enough to cover just with the different variations otherwise

I have since had a bit more experience of the finishes available (although it may surprise you to learn than I've not paid a massive premium to make my bike look like it belongs at a pride march).

Having run both a silver / black and grey / grey chain in rotation under similar conditions, interestingly the former (which is typically more expensive) shows a lot more corrosion than than the grey one (which isn't the expensive "corrosion proof" EPT).. so in future these will by my go-to.

One of the reasons for running different finishes was to make identification easier for waxing / rotation - still not sure how I'm going to get my head around that if I end up using all the same finish eventually..

Not a waxer, so corrosion isn't an issue using Finish Line Ceramic wet - it's better suited to wet commutes and mud etc.

 

[sevenfourate]

It seems that 10 & 11 speed chains are made to a better standard than 8/9 speed items - hence from this perspective there's an argument for fitting say a 10 or 11sp chain to an 8 or 9sp setup, but not for fitting a 9sp to an 8sp setup, or 11sp to a 10sp setup for example. If this makes sense

Your thoughts and logic sound entirely sensible to me. I’m going to order a 10 speed chain for my Carrera 8 Speed; and try it - just for the hell of it.

I’d like to imagine me then scientifically comparing against the last 8-speed KMC. And the KMC on there now and recently fitted. But with different routes, speeds, weathers, lubing regimes, amount of ingrained road dirt etc etc - I’m really not sure how valid any of us Amateur riders thoughts really are ?

Won’t stop me having a go and trying to get a feel for any perceived gains. Or losses 🤣

Thanks for the continued chain education.