more cycle lanes or more 'considerate' motorists?

[handsome joe]

Personally I think all of us road users have a nightmare problem, to much information!
The cyclist has to watch out for other road users, including people who step off the kerb into the road with out looking, along with trafice lights and signs, for potholes and broke glass, the list is endless.
The motorist like wise has a myriad of signs and other road users including us Cyclists to contend with, no wonder there are clashes. but lts face it so many cyclist act in a very on sociable manner on the roads, which will Pee off most drivers.

The other evening I rode through London from Euston Station down to London Bridge station, and watched cyclist after cyclist ignore red lights, swerving in fornt and across the traffic lanes, for a country boy it amassed me, and in someway angered me, cos I could see why the motorist gets so pee-ed off with us cyclist.
If I had my way I would go back to the days when i started to drive. No white lines, hardly any signs, but then there where more cyclists and not so many cars.

Exactly the right point. For too long London has had no cycling infrastructure to speak of. Over the years as cycling has increasingly become more popular this situation has arisen. The dog eat dog attitude has become the norm. When all these types of transportation are using the same road space then order breaks down. You get your cyclist running a red light because he wants to get ahead of the traffic. I've noticed when using the superhighways in London. You still get your odd moron cycling obliviously going through red lights but most people take a more safer approach because they are not in competition with other vehicles for road space. Proper, well maintained, cycle lanes brings order to roads and lessen the stress on cyclists but other road users. Its a shame its taken so long and it will take a while before attitudes catch up.

 

[dondare]

I've cycled in London for 30 years. There has always been excellent cycling infrastructure, although the fact that motor vehicles are allowed to use it too makes it less than ideal. Segregation would be good if it meant keeping the roads as they are and having motor vehicles using their own, separate tracks. The underground railway, for instance.

 

[Jaguar]

Drivers need better education...* I would like driving tests to be updated/reapproved/renewed on at least once per decade.

I totally agree.
Perhaps all learner drivers should have to spend some time cycling? Or at least being talked to about cyclists ... yeah, right.

 

[stowie]

The reality is that as in all other walks of life, cyclists make bad judgements just like everyone else. Its too easy to blame the facilities. A cycle lane runs alongside a parking bay. IF a cyclist refuses to, or doesnt take care, thats his risk. Realistically, the lane cannot be placed anywhere else. Its there to assist you, not give you a god given right to blunder on regardlessly (i'm not talking about you personally dondare, just generally)
The same applies to the second point. One of my cycle lanes is exactly like you describe. If there's a bus in front turning left, i'll wait behind him even though i COULD get through. Its risk reduction. I can, but choose not to. The problem lies usually (athough doubtless not in all cases) with bad judgement, not the facilities.

Personally. i like cycle lanes. They're not perfect, but at least there's some sort of visual seperation between me and the cars. They bring problems of their own, but overall i can make my way better with them than without.

Can you imagine the council providing facilities for cars that actively put the driver in real danger? Of course, the cycle lane can be put elsewhere - it would just involve removing or relocating the parking bays, which is something the council is unwilling to do.

I also find that car drivers who don't understand cycling will tend to assume that you will use the lane. Therefore they will either get irritated when you don't or make an assumption that it is OK to pass as you will be in the lane. Both lead to close and dangerous overtakes.

I think most people on this board have considerable cycling experience. But I remember when I was a novice, and I often assumed that if a cycle lane was provided that this was the correct part of the road to use. I am not stupid or a risk-taker, just at the time naive and a bit too trusting that the people implementing cycle provision knew the first thing about what they were doing. Of course now, I know better.

 

[Jaguar]

The only potential positive of having a cycle lane next to parking bays/on street parking is that it might increase car occupants awareness of cyclists

No, it doesn't. My OH was knocked off by someone opening a car door onto him (he is an inexperienced cyclist, and like many freshers, believed it is safest to ride as far to the left as possible). Me, I ride to the outside of these bike lanes, and even then I was knocked off by an older man who simply pulled out of his parking space and into me: he didn't look, nor indicate, just drove out

 

[Origamist]

No, it doesn't. My OH was knocked off by someone opening a car door onto him (he is an inexperienced cyclist, and like many freshers, believed it is safest to ride as far to the left as possible). Me, I ride to the outside of these bike lanes, and even then I was knocked off by an older man who simply pulled out of his parking space and into me: he didn't look, nor indicate, just drove out

It doesn't surprise me that some people can't countenance the possibility that a cycle lane might have a positive effect on driver behaviour.