Oops..

[PBancroft]

I like this, but at the same time I feel frustration. I am frustrated because it is obvious that the driver isn't that bothered about the extra 3 points. Therefore, it is unlikely to act as a deterrent.

However, a gold star is in order for pulling the chap over in the first place .

Absolutely a Gold Star, but just in case anyone hasn't yet got sick of me saying it, I do agree with Mags, and still think that the whole points malarkey is a bit ridiculous.

"Oi! You're breaking the law! So, um, carry on..."

 

[Cubist]

Absolutely a Gold Star, but just in case anyone hasn't yet got sick of me saying it, I do agree with Mags, and still think that the whole points malarkey is a bit ridiculous.

"Oi! You're breaking the law! So, um, carry on..."

Yes, agreed, it does seem a bit lenient at first glance, but what's the alternative? Do you ban everyone who commits an endorsable offence? That seems harsh. The deterrent of points adds up if you think that get more than 3 and your insurance goes up, get nine points on your licence and the next speeding/phone/duecare/red light offence WILL get you banned under totting up.

The proliferation of ticketable offences means that the courts are less busy and it takes an awful lot less to bring an errant but contrite driver to justice.

What makes my blood boil is the sheer number of drivers who continue to use the mobile phones. Some will get all guilty if you stare at them, and tuck the phone away, but amazingly if you take the trouble to point out that they are committing an offence a huge number seem to think it's none of your business to tell them. I particularly enjoy the ones who tell me to **** off etc etc, then watch their faces change when I take my warrant card out of my jersey pocket and ask them whether they would like to tell me to **** off now?

 

[Vikeonabike]

I've read somewhere that the penalty for using a mobile is going upto 6 points and two hundred pounds in January. Anyone else hear this?

 

[Rhythm Thief]

I particularly enjoy the ones who tell me to **** off etc etc, then watch their faces change when I take my warrant card out of my jersey pocket and ask them whether they would like to tell me to **** off now?

Cor, that must be so much fun.

 

[magnatom]

What makes my blood boil is the sheer number of drivers who continue to use the mobile phones. Some will get all guilty if you stare at them, and tuck the phone away, but amazingly if you take the trouble to point out that they are committing an offence a huge number seem to think it's none of your business to tell them. I particularly enjoy the ones who tell me to **** off etc etc, then watch their faces change when I take my warrant card out of my jersey pocket and ask them whether they would like to tell me to **** off now?

I thought taking your warrant card out when off duty was frowned upon. However, I must admit, I would love to have one. I could have lots of fun with that!

 

[goo_mason]

Yes, agreed, it does seem a bit lenient at first glance, but what's the alternative? Do you ban everyone who commits an endorsable offence? That seems harsh. The deterrent of points adds up if you think that get more than 3 and your insurance goes up, get nine points on your licence and the next speeding/phone/duecare/red light offence WILL get you banned under totting up.

The proliferation of ticketable offences means that the courts are less busy and it takes an awful lot less to bring an errant but contrite driver to justice.

What makes my blood boil is the sheer number of drivers who continue to use the mobile phones. Some will get all guilty if you stare at them, and tuck the phone away, but amazingly if you take the trouble to point out that they are committing an offence a huge number seem to think it's none of your business to tell them. I particularly enjoy the ones who tell me to **** off etc etc, then watch their faces change when I take my warrant card out of my jersey pocket and ask them whether they would like to tell me to **** off now?

That would be excellent seeing their faces & attitude change.

Mind you, I've not yet come across anyone sheepishly putting a phone down. Whether I've made comment as a cyclist or as a pedestrian, all I've had is a abuse or they continue regardless.

9 points plus a £1000 fine is probably more likely to make most of the idiots think twice in future. The current level of points / fine is not a deterrent in the slightest.

 

[PBancroft]

Yes, agreed, it does seem a bit lenient at first glance, but what's the alternative? Do you ban everyone who commits an endorsable offence? That seems harsh. The deterrent of points adds up if you think that get more than 3 and your insurance goes up, get nine points on your licence and the next speeding/phone/duecare/red light offence WILL get you banned under totting up.

The proliferation of ticketable offences means that the courts are less busy and it takes an awful lot less to bring an errant but contrite driver to justice.

What makes my blood boil is the sheer number of drivers who continue to use the mobile phones.

That's kinda my point - three points and/or a fine isn't a deterrent enough to stop people from doing it. You need to get caught four times in order to lose your licence - and the sheer number of drivers doing it would indicate that even with totting up its a pretty remote chance of that happening.

One alternative would be to reduce the points required for a ban. Another would be mandatory offence-related retraining for all road offences (and I would roll that out to other road users too) at the expense of the person committing the crime, so they wouldn't immediately lose their licence.

There are loads of alternatives other than banning someone outright for any endorsable offence. To do so may be harsh - but similarly I don't really see how allowing dangerous drivers to continue with merely a slap on the wrist is an appropriate answer either.

 

[BentMikey]

I have a few times. Once a chap said he thought I was a copper. I told him no, but perhaps he should be thinking how he'd feel if he killed someone.

 

[BentMikey]

That's kinda my point - three points and/or a fine isn't a deterrent enough to stop people from doing it. You need to get caught four times in order to lose your licence - and the sheer number of drivers doing it would indicate that even with totting up its a pretty remote chance of that happening.

I disagree. It's the lack of enforcement that's the problem, not the punishment.

 

[PBancroft]

I disagree. It's the lack of enforcement that's the problem, not the punishment.

I wouldn't say lack of enforcement isn't part of the problem, but I do think the lack of punishment is as well.

 

[Vikeonabike]

I particularly enjoy the ones who tell me to **** off etc etc, then watch their faces change when I take my warrant card out of my jersey pocket and ask them whether they would like to tell me to **** off now?

Or turning up at thier home address a little while later and saying "I'd like to discuss the reasons why you felt the requirement to tell me too Funk off when I asked you to stop using your mobile!"

 

[summerdays]

Well I saw one bloke travel 400 m + on the phone driving a lorry (well large industrial street cleaner one), and I'd love to report him to his employers but I've forgotten what the company is (don't worry I regularly see those lorries and it will be obvious from their records who would be working that day in this area).

Has anyone got any examples of stock letters that they have sent to a company to complain about using the mobile phone whilst driving? - letter writing isn't my forte.

 

[Cubist]

I thought taking your warrant card out when off duty was frowned upon. However, I must admit, I would love to have one. I could have lots of fun with that!

Not frowned upon. As the holder of a warrant card I hold the office of constable throughout England and Wales, whether on or off duty. If it was an accident I came across, I'd be obliged to stop etc. etc. In this instance I'm simply identifying myself to the idiot to stop him getting himself into more trouble. If they want to play from then on I would be obliged to take appropriate action, so it has to be a considered action rather than hoping it's a "shield of steel".

 

[Amanda P]

I wouldn't say lack of enforcement isn't part of the problem, but I do think the lack of punishment is as well.

The two can be balanced against one another.

What would make you obey a law?

If you know you are very unlikely to be caught, and even if you are, the punishment will be derisory, and you gain some benefit or convenience from breaking the law, you'll go ahead and do it. And this is why people routinely speed, phone while driving, throw litter and so on.

If you're likely to be caught, but the punishmnet is trivial, you're less likely to break the law, purely because of the embarassement and inconvenience of being caught.

If it's unlikely you'll be caught, but the consequences if you are will be severe punishment, again you're less likely to break the law.

This is my argument for short-term driving bans as punishment for speeding, phoning while driving and so on. If we can't increase the numbers of police to the point where people are much more likely to be caught doing these things, we could make the punishments seriously inconvenient for the culprits if they ever are caught.

The punishment would also fit the crime. Driving is a privelidge that must be earned, showing that you can operate a motor vehicle responsibly by passing a test. If you demonstrate that you cannot operate it responsibly by speeding or whatever, it's quite fitting that that privelidge be removed from you for a period.

Of course there are those people who will carry on driving no matter what, ban or no ban (we see them every week on Road Wars, and it's not hard to catch them). For driving while banned, punishments would have to escalate to prison time. Why not? - there's no possible excuse. You know you're banned!

 

[downfader]

I've read somewhere that the penalty for using a mobile is going upto 6 points and two hundred pounds in January. Anyone else hear this?

I read something similar but I'm completely unsure if or where and what, LOL!

TBH it needs this deparately! £60 is nothing to the average fool on a mobile, saw one today - student and trying to turn a corner whilst holding the phone against his ear. He also had his GF in there - so he obviously he thought little for her safety.

Vike, sometimes I'd love to be like you and deal with these plebs. I sadly dont think I have the stamina for it and have the greatest of respect for guys like you and Cubist (and the guys on the BRforums). I had an "incident" today when I was jogging, a car mounted a pavement by me so I politely told the driver off.

For this I was threatened with a flurry of swear words by their passenger. I didnt feel in any danger as the guy wouldnt get out (not that I invited him to). So I read out their plates aloud and then filled out a crimestoppers form.

It would be SO satisfying to pull out some credentials and see justice.