Pollution, polution, pollution!!

[Drago]

The carbon footprint of the clothing industry dwarfs that of the airline industry. But how many even consider it when buying clothes, having thrown the old ones away?

Our very own @numbnuts does his bit to reduce clothing industry pollution.

 

[cookiemonster]

It's the dry season here in Hong Kong and the pollution here has been awful. Not helped that due to the mask ban, I can't wear my anti-pollution mask either. No rain to wash the pollution away.

At times, you could chew the air here. It has improved this week though.

 

[Beebo]

I think indivually, we as humans are a lot less polluting than we were years ago. The problem is that our population is growing at an alarming rate, and no matter how environmentally friendly we become, are shear numbers will never stop us polluting collectively.
By nature we will always leave a carbon footprint to some extent, and the more we grow in numbers the more it will impact on our surroundings.
Its all very well us being more environmentally friendly, but i think its only delaying the inevitable if our number's continue to grow.

Here’s a hand graph.

We all need to live like people in Chad. Which is unacceptable to us.
The average Indian is far less polluting than we are.

 

[mudsticks]

Here’s a hand graph.
View attachment 494794


We all need to live like people in Chad. Which is unacceptable to us.
The average Indian is far less polluting than we are.

We do need to reduce our consumption lots for sure, but no we can't be expected to live like the frugal folks of Chad.

My carbon footprint is pretty low, its taken a fair amount of effort, and a little bit of sacrifice maybe.
Could be better for sure.

But I still have a pretty nice, acceptably comfortable life, I'm not living in a cave, wearing a hessian sack, or gnawing on sticks.

There's an enormous amount we can do to improve things, sometimes as individuals yes, but there also needs to be some more centralised top down help, which is where long term, well thought out, gov policy can help.

We, the people, need to get behind those policies though.

I'd have thought the members of a cycling forum could get behind promoting public, and person powered transport, and seriously restricting private car use for example.

Edit.. Also bear in mind that a lot of the per capita emission of the Chinese, for example is down to the power used to make the cheap as chips stuff we buy from them, so that's an energy cost we are externalising onto them.
We've just moved the pollution elsewhere, it makes us look better, but doesn't give a true picture.

Unless the graph maker has corrected for those shifted consequences.

 

[MontyVeda]

...

I'd have thought the members of a cycling forum could get behind promoting public, and person powered transport, and seriously restricting private car use for example.

...

A few years ago i started a thread about restricting private car use... I was quite shocked how many members of CC were totally against it.

 

[mudsticks]

A few years ago i started a thread about restricting private car use... I was quite shocked how many members of CC were totally against it.

Hmmn, interesting.

But I think we need to look at putting viable alternatives in place, and redesigning our transport system, so that taking the car is the most expensive, and least convenient option.

Rather than the easiest, and often cheapest, as is the case right now.

Until we do that with some conviction, then there will doubtless be resistance.

 

[ColinJ]

Hmmn, interesting.

But I think we need to look at putting viable alternatives in place, and redesigning our transport system, so that taking the car is the most expensive, and least convenient option.

Rather than the easiest, and often cheapest, as is the case right now.

Until we do that with some conviction, then there will doubtless be resistance.

Perhaps we should all accept that certain options should pretty much be priced out of range! A colleague once told me that he had driven from Leeds to Bristol for the evening for a meal with his girlfriend - on what planet does that kind of indulgence make sense?

 

[BoldonLad]

Perhaps we should all accept that certain options should pretty much be priced out of range! A colleague once told me that he had driven from Leeds to Bristol for the evening for a meal with his girlfriend - on what planet does that kind of indulgence make sense?

While not disagreeing with your example, who decides what is an "indulgence" vs an acceptable (energy hungry) leisure activity?

 

[ColinJ]

While not disagreeing with your example, who decides what is an "indulgence" vs an acceptable (energy hungry) leisure activity?

Yes, I wouldn't like somebody sitting in judgement over me deciding that!

 

[mudsticks]

Perhaps we should all accept that certain options should pretty much be priced out of range! A colleague once told me that he had driven from Leeds to Bristol for the evening for a meal with his girlfriend - on what planet does that kind of indulgence make sense?

i must dig out the article / paper - but some clever bod has done a 'carbon tax' costing and outcomes scheme proposal.

And other clever bods who have analysed it seem to think it would work.

I think the basic premise is that carboniferous activities get heavily taxed - the revenue is then redistributed directly back among all citizens regardless of their activities - which means there is then a direct incentive for that money to be re- spent on lower carbon activities - making those 'greener' goods and services things relatively cheaper and more ubiquitous / available

So basically your colleague has to pay a relatively large amount for his romantic indulgence.
the revenue, or tax collected on that then goes back into the collective pot , and is redistributed , so all the other folks not driving there, have a bit more dosh to spend on the lower carbon ( and now much relatively cheaper) alternative of taking a train to Leeds instead.

Its obv far more complicated than that, but it seemed to make sense as a way of turning around the pricing system that we have at present where doing 'the right thing' is so often more expensive.

In my field of farming - diesel and aggro chemicals are relatively cheap, compared with human skilled labour -
Far more of which, is generally required in running a complex, low input, but more beneficial to ecology, and climate system of food production.

The 'cost' of fuel and chemical use consequences in non organic systems can be externalised to the environment - the polluter doesn't really pay - so food produced that way is seen as 'cheap' - as it is, in £ at the supermarket.

More responsible farmers and growers internalise their costs - labour etc - but if they charge anything like the true cost of production - they are accused of being 'too expensive' - even though the production of that food has done far less damage to the environment.
Add on top of that the cost of organic certification, and the whole playing field has become really slanted against the farmer trying to do the right thing..

.

 

[mudsticks]

It's the dry season here in Hong Kong and the pollution here has been awful. Not helped that due to the mask ban, I can't wear my anti-pollution mask either. No rain to wash the pollution away.

At times, you could chew the air here. It has improved this week though.

Yuk poor everyone there..

Is the mask ban because of the protests?

 

[ColinJ]

Yuk poor everyone there..

Is the mask ban because of the protests?

The police want to be able to identify protesters from photos and CCTV.

I saw one young woman who had an ingenious solution - she simply tied her long hair round the front of her face instead of behind her head!

The Chinese government is developing super-high-res cameras for crowd surveillance - scary stuff!

 

[MontyVeda]

... taking the car is the most expensive, and least convenient option.

...

For someone like me, taking the car is the most expensive, least convenient option.

After forking out for driving lessons and at some point sitting and passing the tests, I'd have to find the money to buy a motor, find the money to get some insurance... only then can I take the car. 👎

 

[mudsticks]

For someone like me, taking the car is the most expensive, least convenient option.

After forking out for driving lessons and at some point sitting and passing the tests, I'd have to find the money to buy a motor, find the money to get some insurance... only then can I take the car. 👎

If you live in a city i'd stay car free if i were you - save ££ and tonnes of stress.

Country living makes it harder not to have a car - but i'm sure it could be done.

I'd like an electric delivery vehicle - and the time to do more trips by bike .