POWER

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How have you found the disc wheel performance to be? Have read values of 40sec saved over a 25miler flat course but useful to hear your experiences..cheers.
Haven't really had the weather to put my experiences to test but i'd suggest the data is roughly accurate for someone travelling at 30mph. So maybe more like 30-33 seconds if you are travelling at a more human 25-27mph.

Personally i am looking to accumulate gains with several aero bits of kit. Still on the list is decent shoe covers and skin suit. All together, with aero lid etc, should amount to a more quantifiable chunk of time.

@Rob3rt might be able to give his experience between no disc and disc over 10 and 25??
 

Rob3rt

Man or Moose!
Location
Manchester
It is true, must often savings are quoted in time over a 40km TT at ~30mph. But since most of us are somewhat shy of that the quotes don't help much. Contrary to Pedro's estimate of a 40 sec saving reducing to 30-33 secs for a slower rider, I would argue that actually the time saving could be greater.

Rather relevantly, this becomes clearer if you think in terms of power saving (thread on power :smile:), rather than just time.

Consider this:
The time saving going from 25-26 mph (55 seconds for 10 mile) will be greater than the time saving going from 30-31mph (39 seconds for 10 mile).
The power needed to go from 25-26 mph will be much less than that needed to go from 30-31 mph (Google it and look at the equations, or simply use a cycling power calculator website and hold everything constant other than the speed and see the resulting power figures)
The faster rider will likely save a few W more from the disc.

If you think in terms of power savings, even if the faster rider saves more power from the disc, it is entirely possible that this saving doesn't outweigh the fact that to speed up, a hugely larger amount of power is needed than for the slower rider, so actually, while the slower rider saves a few W less, they actually gain the most speed (or even if they gain the same amount of speed) and thus save the most time.

Now I am not sure of the fine details, but in theory, if the numbers are right, it will be the case and in my experience, I gained maybe 30 seconds over 10 miles when I 1st put my disc on, let alone the time saved over 25 miles.

For reference the disc I use is a FFWD lenticular disc wheel with tubular tyres.
 
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VamP

VamP

Banned
Location
Cambs
In real world conditions it's always hard to know what did what. The disc wheel has a further peculiarity in that it's benefits are not linear, in certain wind yaw angles they can be heavily amplified.

On another note, tested FTP yesterday, fully expecting to see a reduction as I have done no threshold work since September, but tested the same as my last test in October, so that gets my campaign to boost my threshold this season off to a good start!
 
In real world conditions it's always hard to know what did what. The disc wheel has a further peculiarity in that it's benefits are not linear, in certain wind yaw angles they can be heavily amplified.

On another note, tested FTP yesterday, fully expecting to see a reduction as I have done no threshold work since September, but tested the same as my last test in October, so that gets my campaign to boost my threshold this season off to a good start!
Nice one. Should almost certainly lead to gains this year then - all going well.

My FTP actually dropped around 5% as per my last test. I tested in May 2013 after a lot of indoor training through the winter and my power had increased significantly. As i came into summer most of my riding was outdoor and only knocked out the odd TR session when the weather really sucked.

Even though i was at my lightest and fittest, by the time i retested in late Autumn i came up lower. I do though fully expect to exceed that number again over the winter months as power increase is, again, my priority.

@Rob3rt You could be right, i was just going by the 'air resistance increases as speed increases' formula. So my thought process was that the faster you go the more beneficial aero equipment becomes.
 
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Nice one. Should almost certainly lead to gains this year then - all going well.

My FTP actually dropped around 5% as per my last test. I tested in May 2013 after a lot of indoor training through the winter and my power had increased significantly. As i came into summer most of my riding was outdoor and only knocked out the odd TR session when the weather really sucked.

Even though i was at my lightest and fittest, by the time i retested in late Autumn i came up lower. I do though fully expect to exceed that number again over the winter months as power increase is, again, my priority.

@Rob3rt You could be right, i was just going by the 'air resistance increases as speed increases' formula. So my thought process was that the faster you go the more beneficial aero equipment becomes.

How often do you test, hopefully more than the two tests you mention? I don't test often enough, in fact if I have a NY resolution it's to test more often... Once a month is the plan.
 

Rob3rt

Man or Moose!
Location
Manchester
@Rob3rt You could be right, i was just going by the 'air resistance increases as speed increases' formula. So my thought process was that the faster you go the more beneficial aero equipment becomes.

I would say 'critical' or 'important' rather than beneficial, because producing the power to go faster becomes increasingly difficult, so you need to reduce the power needed with aero aids because it will become near impossible to put out the required power at some point.

But 'beneficial', you could argue that both benefit equally, or indeed the slower rider benefits more so in some cases.
 

GrasB

Veteran
Location
Nr Cambridge
On another note, tested FTP yesterday, fully expecting to see a reduction as I have done no threshold work since September, but tested the same as my last test in October, so that gets my campaign to boost my threshold this season off to a good start!
Did you do a full 1h pull or just an estimated test?
 

GrasB

Veteran
Location
Nr Cambridge
No, I do 2x20, and use the second 20 for the calculation. A full hour is too scary :ph34r:
So you might be over-estimating your low fitness FTP. What's the time gap between the two 20min pulls?
 
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So you might be over-estimating your low fitness FTP. What's the time gap between the two 20min pulls?


I always do the estimates the same way, so I doubt it. Also it's not really low-fitness, I have been doing a lot of racing and training through the cross season, I just haven't been targeting any threshold work.

Edited: I see I forgot to answer your question. Five minutes rest between sets.

Edit 2: I kept my LTS between 80 and 95 through the cross season, and even now at the end of my rest month it's still at 79...
 
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GrasB

Veteran
Location
Nr Cambridge
I always do the estimates the same way, so I doubt it.
I tend to find that my 10-30 min power is the slowest to degrade meaning 20min pulls over estimate my FTP when I've been resting/ill/injured. That just might be my body though.

Also it's not really low-fitness, I have been doing a lot of racing and training through the cross season, I just haven't been targeting any threshold work.
...
Edit 2: I kept my LTS between 80 and 95 through the cross season, and even now at the end of my rest month it's still at 79...
Okay so you may have just managed to maintain your previous fitness.
 
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I tend to find that my 10-30 min power is the slowest to degrade meaning 20min pulls over estimate my FTP when I've been resting/ill/injured.

Aha, that's interesting. I haven't really enough data yet to have that understanding of what my body does, but it's one to look out for.
 
How often do you test, hopefully more than the two tests you mention? I don't test often enough, in fact if I have a NY resolution it's to test more often... Once a month is the plan.
Hmmm, probably not enough either. I'd say...................4 times a year.

I don't know many people that actually test their FTP with a 60 minute test. That would be the worst turbo session EVER!!
The 20 minute method seems accurate enough for me to work with.
 
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