Referendum petition

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Accy cyclist

Legendary Member
Or what Sturgeon wants for Scotland.


The result of this referendum is not binding on the Government, it is only advisory. The final decision to seperate from Europe will take an act of parliament. Given that half the Tory Party want to stay, 90% of Labour and all 57 SNP MPs what is the chance of that passing into law.


I notice an EU flag among the Welsh fans at yesterdays Euro championships match. We keep hearing how Northern Ireland Wales and Scotland voted to remain, yet they kept telling us that only the overall result counted, it wasn't a regional vote. Lancashire voted to leave so we wont be asking for independence!:smile:
 

Mad Doug Biker

Banned from every bar in the Galaxy
Location
Craggy Island
Or what Sturgeon wants for Scotland.

The situation has changed considerably now though.
 
[QUOTE 4339167, member: 43827"]Such an important and irrevokable vote for the long-term future of the country should have had some more thought put into it before it took place. Simple majority votes, especially by a small margin, are often decided by short-term whims, and could have gone a different way six months earlier or later. Negativity always gets more interest, and encourages a protest vote, than positive arguments (not that there were too many of those on either side). Daniel Hannan of UKIP admitted on TV the other night, after the result, that there will still have to be freedom of movement in Europe if we want a trade deal, but throughout the debate UKIP were saying that Brexit would slash immigration. If they had admitted it wouldn't during the run-up how much difference would that have made to the result?

Cameron rushed the referendum when there was no need to.

But the vote is what it is - a decision to leave.

Perhaps we should have had best of three, or five, or seven, until we get the result we want.[/QUOTE]
Sounds like a penalty shoot out would have done the trick. Oh no, your record there isn't up to much so maybe not.
 

Blue

Squire
Location
N Ireland
I notice an EU flag among the Welsh fans at yesterdays Euro championships match. We keep hearing how Northern Ireland Wales and Scotland voted to remain, yet they kept telling us that only the overall result counted, it wasn't a regional vote. Lancashire voted to leave so we wont be asking for independence!:smile:

Do you hear voices that no one else can hear?
 
I stupidly assumed there was an Act of parliament that described what voting "leave" actually meant. I didn't bother to look it up, as I was happy with the status quo, so the terms of the leaving wouldn't affect my vote. But now I see it is nothing more than an opinion poll. The Government is in no way obliged to do anything on the strength of the results. How is this anyway to run a country? There are real advantages to a written constitution.

It should have be written in law what turnout and majority was required to make the vote binding. And the vote should have set events in action. As it is, nothing will happen until at least October (as it's clear Cameron won't start things moving) and then it will be up to the next PM and the Commons to actually act (or not) on the result.
 

Vapin' Joe

Formerly known as Smokin Joe
The country voted out, so out it is.

I believe there will be a renegotiation resulting in some sort of compromise towards an economic union rather that a political one. It is not only in the UK where there is growing resentment towards Europe and this may well be the trigger for meaningful reform.

The Labour party are fecked though.
 

Vapin' Joe

Formerly known as Smokin Joe
If this has always been something that people in many countries want, how come Cameron's triumphant return with reforms was no such thing. Why did he not get other leaders also looking for the core benefits of free trade and movement but wary of political union, and build a movement with them.
The situation has changed since the Brexit vote. Eurosceptics in other countries are now gaining momentum and the Federalists have woken up to the fact they can't ignore them any longer.
 
The country voted out, so out it is.
You'd think. However, Cameron announced yesterday he was resigning, but he didn't trigger Article 50. He's obviously not going to, and he doesn't have to. Will his successor do so in October? When we will be still be experiencing the hard times that everyone agreed would be the short term consequences of Brexit? We shall see.

This is doing the rounds at the moment, I think it has some truth in it.

If Boris Johnson looked downbeat yesterday, that is because he realises that he has lost.

Perhaps many Brexiters do not realise it yet, but they have actually lost, and it is all down to one man: David Cameron.

With one fell swoop yesterday at 9:15 am, Cameron effectively annulled the referendum result, and simultaneously destroyed the political careers of Boris Johnson, Michael Gove and leading Brexiters who cost him so much anguish, not to mention his premiership.

How?

Throughout the campaign, Cameron had repeatedly said that a vote for leave would lead to triggering Article 50 straight away. Whether implicitly or explicitly, the image was clear: he would be giving that notice under Article 50 the morning after a vote to leave. Whether that was scaremongering or not is a bit moot now but, in the midst of the sentimental nautical references of his speech yesterday, he quietly abandoned that position and handed the responsibility over to his successor.

And as the day wore on, the enormity of that step started to sink in: the markets, Sterling, Scotland, the Irish border, the Gibraltar border, the frontier at Calais, the need to continue compliance with all EU regulations for a free market, re-issuing passports, Brits abroad, EU citizens in Britain, the mountain of legistlation to be torn up and rewritten ... the list grew and grew.

The referendum result is not binding. It is advisory. Parliament is not bound to commit itself in that same direction.

The Conservative party election that Cameron triggered will now have one question looming over it: will you, if elected as party leader, trigger the notice under Article 50?

Who will want to have the responsibility of all those ramifications and consequences on his/her head and shoulders?

Boris Johnson knew this yesterday, when he emerged subdued from his home and was even more subdued at the press conference. He has been out-maneouvered and check-mated.

If he runs for leadership of the party, and then fails to follow through on triggering Article 50, then he is finished. If he does not run and effectively abandons the field, then he is finished. If he runs, wins and pulls the UK out of the EU, then it will all be over - Scotland will break away, there will be upheaval in Ireland, a recession ... broken trade agreements. Then he is also finished. Boris Johnson knows all of this. When he acts like the dumb blond it is just that: an act.

The Brexit leaders now have a result that they cannot use. For them, leadership of the Tory party has become a poison chalice.

When Boris Johnson said there was no need to trigger Article 50 straight away, what he really meant to say was "never". When Michael Gove went on and on about "informal negotiations" ... why? why not the formal ones straight away? ... he also meant not triggering the formal departure. They both know what a formal demarche would mean: an irreversible step that neither of them is prepared to take.

All that remains is for someone to have the guts to stand up and say that Brexit is unachievable in reality without an enormous amount of pain and destruction, that cannot be borne. And David Cameron has put the onus of making that statement on the heads of the people who led the Brexit campaign.
 
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