RnB

[Rob S]

It's quite simple....there are two different genres R & B and RnB.

 

[Yellow Fang]

It's a bit annoying when an established term for a musical style gets re-cycled for something else, creating confusion. It also implies that the older style of music it refered to has been consigned to historical interest only by whoever's young and hip now, which I think is a bit arrogant. English is not that short of catchy words. Why can't they think of something else?

 

[Tim Bennet.]

Oh your condescending tripe doesn't puncture the balloon of anyone. It's recognised that the two RnB's are entirely different genres:

"Contemporary RnB or simply RnB is seen as separate and distinct from its cultural origins, applying only to the upbeat dance style of music innovated after the fall of disco music. During the 1980s and 1990s, musicians started to add more disco-like beats and high-tech production elements to the music, making R&B more danceable and modern. This modern form of rhythm and blues also incorporated elements of hip-hop, soul and funk."

It's the use of the same term to describe two entirely different types of music that irritates the exponents of the original R&B, especially as the heavy commercialisation of the recent upstart means it has completely usurped the other in the minds of most people.

Whether Count Basie thinks Jimmy Hendrix or Mariah Carey produces the better music is open to debate, but I don't think he would pretend they were the same genre.

 

[Fnaar]

New Jack Swing, anyone?

 

[Mr Pig]

Why can't they think of something else?

If they were capable of doing that they wouldn't just take other people's music and talk over the top of it.

 

[DJ]

New Jack Swing, anyone?

Yes I was in to that for a while. Bobby Brown........erm ..........Oh help I've forgotten all there names now!!!

 

[Flying_Monkey]

Oh your condescending tripe doesn't puncture the balloon of anyone. It's recognised that the two RnB's are entirely different genres:

You might find there is some common ground here. Indeed the developments you quote - regardless of whether you regard RnB as one outcome of the evolution of R&B or something entirely different (I favour the first interpretation) - are surely another reason why complaining that RnB isn't R&B is pointless, aren't they?

 

[Flying_Monkey]

Yes I was in to that for a while. Bobby Brown........erm ..........Oh help I've forgotten all there names now!!!

"Simply hard core beats, not a New Jack Swing" (A Tribe Called Quest).

 

[Renard]

I'm afraid to puncture the balloon of most the ageing white men on the thread, but the (mostly black) musicians who do RnB have more right to the term and what it means than you. Music evolves and changes. Is there anyone here who thinks Ornette Coleman isn't jazz because it isn't trad New Orleans style, or that large orchestras are just wrong?

And there's a thin line between knowing what you like and simple prejudice. I'm not sure how far some of you are over that line, but some of the generic comments about rap and RnB certainly smell a bit funny.

There are, as the great Count Basie once said, two kinds of music: good music and bad music.

Why do people even start threads like this?

Well since it was me who started the thread I am not sure what you are implying but if its something sinister then you are barking up the wrong tree. Since when did race have anything to do with music? If anyone has an agenda here it is you with your phrase about ageing white men.

 

[Mr Pig]

I am not sure what you are implying but if its something sinister then you are barking up the wrong tree. Since when did race have anything to do with music?

I have to agree. It's sad that it seems to be impossible to talk about any subject in which race plays a part without someone getting on their high horse and chucking baseless accusations around. I see no hint of racism in this thread. I can't stand rap music because it is rubbish, not because it dominated by black artists, and I strongly object to any insinuation to the contrary.

You can't talk about R&B without reference to black people. They were the ones who suffered the indignity, slavery, oppression and exploitation that resulted in the blues in the name. Their soul searching and fight for expression gave rise to some of the best music ever made and the foundation and root for most of the rock and pop music made since. Many of today's black artists speak only from strident arrogance and falsely claim R&B as their heritage but as I said, it's an insult. Their lives, they can do what they want, but don't ask to take it seriously.

Ever noticed how the artists who takes themselves the most seriously are the ones with the least talent? True genius is convincing enough on its own.

 

[Andy in Sig]

I would simply say (in a large generalisation) that black popular music is currently going through a dire phase which probably started with the rise of disco/fall of funk.

Think about it: Robert Johnson, Muddy Waters, Louis Armstrong, Thelonius Monk, Sonny Rollins, Jimi Hendrix and ... er Michael Jackson, Snoop Dog !!!! What a terrible cul de sac black music is currently in.

The choice seems to be utterly weak showbiz trash or desperately uncreative (apart from the odd bit of lyrical dexterity which would be better put to use as poetry) rap.

At both extremes the real guilt lies with what have become seriously slick and efficient marketing men who above all sell "product". It's dismal and is enough to drive one to despair. Fortunately it probably won't last for ever.

 

[alecstilleyedye]

what annoys me is the description 'garage' for the bland rubbish á la craig david when the term was formerly used for bands such as the jesus and mary chain.

 

[Fnaar]

what annoys me is the description 'garage' for the bland rubbish á la craig david when the term was formerly used for bands such as the jesus and mary chain.

I agree B) Craig David is more 'cheese shop' than 'garage'. But then of course there were the 60s garage bands too... http://www.60sgaragebands.com/

 

[darkstar]

All i have to say is 'Bluey Robinson'. He's gaining popularity and is a awesome singer, check him on youtube.