Rule no. 1

[BentMikey]

I didn't get as far as the filtering on my first view (I was more concerned with a possible dooring when Jon passed the first vehicles on the left!).

I'm not sure why - it looks like he's at least your std 4 feet out. I would personally be slightly wider, but not a lot.

 

[BentMikey]

B) Don't talk a load of rubbish. If the driver's thought about it at all, he's thought "what's his problem?" or something similar. While I agree that the overtake was pretty pointless, it really didn't strike me as worth getting all worked up over. In that sense, it was definitely confrontational; the driver gave the cyclist plenty of room and overtook legally and considerately. If he chooses to then come to a stop 50 yards up the road, that hardly seems like something to go blowing your horn and waving your arms around for. (I know it wasn't you, by the way.)

I've regularly seen signs of driver embarassment when they've realised how pointless their overtake was. I've even seen regular drivers on my commute stop attempting to overtake like this, so drivers are clearly capable of learning. Of course some might be like you suggest, but that won't change the fact that it's worth offering education like Jon did here because many drivers do learn.

Perhaps it's not me talking rubbish?

 

[Cab]

There seems to be a clear divide between those of us who believe that it is reasonable to communicate small errors to other road users and those who do not. I don't have any problem with it, nor do I have a problem with people expressing to me, on the road, if they think I've made an error. I wonder whether there is a link here between having a willingness to criticise and be criticised?

 

[Weegie]

I've regularly seen signs of driver embarassment when they've realised how pointless their overtake was. I've even seen regular drivers on my commute stop attempting to overtake like this, so drivers are clearly capable of learning. Of course some might be like you suggest, but that won't change the fact that it's worth offering education like Jon did here because many drivers do learn.

Perhaps it's not me talking rubbish?

Speaking as a beginner cyclist but an experienced driver, I think in this case the driver would have been sufficiently embarassed when he had to slam on the anchors and Jon sailed past him a mere 100 yds down the road B)

Horn-blasting and arm-waving can often be interpreted as aggression by many drivers, and any chance of re-educating them evaporates in their resulting red mist.

 

[Origamist]

I'm not sure why - it looks like he's at least your std 4 feet out. I would personally be slightly wider, but not a lot.

He's riding far closer to 3ft than 4 ft - look at the pass on the 2nd white van and blue van.

 

[BentMikey]

Jon, I have a question for you:

With the arm waving, what were you trying to do? Was it the thing where you stop next to the gap, point with one hand at the vehicle in front and make a beckoning movement to the driver who overtook? The sort of direction a standing helper gives to someone reversing so that they can get to within inches of an obstacle?

 

[hackbike 666]

Bad overtake by lorry this morning coming from Woodford so blast on the horn....Then I catch up with the mug at Whipps Cross and he gets the drift as I overtake him.Gives me a blast on his airzound (yes made my horns seem like childs play) but what does the mug think im going to do in heavy traffic?...Look round?

So he overtakes me while he is not concentrating on the road and then shows me his displeasure....So I pull in at the bus stop...He goes past but I notice as there is a cycle lane there the lorry gives more space than what he did with me near Whipps Cross even though there is no cyclist in said cycle lane....Which begs the question do these people actually think they have given more space then they have actually given and also is it that hard to judge?

Not being a car or lorry driver I can only guess that that is the answer to my queestion.

 

[BentMikey]

I think that most of the time with the too-close overtakes, the drivers haven't realised how much room we need and want. That's why I give the pushing out motion and a little toot. The feedback may not always be welcome, but it's an obvious sign to that driver, and all the others on the road that also witness it, that they need to give more room.

 

[hackbike 666]

That's true I really think he didn't have a clue as the second time he gave me more space but I did make more of a thing of getting out of his way.
How many times did I catch that lorry up though? 3 times.

Noticed other motons gave me much more space or were more patient so I generally let them past when I can.

 

[Rhythm Thief]

Speaking as a beginner cyclist but an experienced driver, I think in this case the driver would have been sufficiently embarassed when he had to slam on the anchors and Jon sailed past him a mere 100 yds down the road

Horn-blasting and arm-waving can often be interpreted as aggression by many drivers, and any chance of re-educating them evaporates in their resulting red mist.

Exactly.

 

[Rhythm Thief]

Jon, I have a question for you:

With the arm waving, what were you trying to do? Was it the thing where you stop next to the gap, point with one hand at the vehicle in front and make a beckoning movement to the driver who overtook? The sort of direction a standing helper gives to someone reversing so that they can get to within inches of an obstacle?

That really would be ridiculous.

 

[Rhythm Thief]

There seems to be a clear divide between those of us who believe that it is reasonable to communicate small errors to other road users and those who do not. I don't have any problem with it, nor do I have a problem with people expressing to me, on the road, if they think I've made an error. I wonder whether there is a link here between having a willingness to criticise and be criticised?

I don't think so. I'm quite happy to have the error of my ways pointed out to me (as long as there isn't a glaring misunderstanding at the root of it: "you should be on thecycle path", or whatever), but I'm pretty sure that most drivers on hearing a horn and being on the end of some gesticulating from a cyclist, don't think "goodness me, he's right!"
Overtaking him was more eloquent than anything else you could have done, mr redhornet.

 

[BentMikey]

How then would you rate pulling out in front of traffic on a roundabout in your artic just because they are not indicating?

 

[Rhythm Thief]

How then would you rate pulling out in front of traffic on a roundabout in your artic just because they are not indicating?

Wrong but fun. The thing you have to remember is that once you've stopped 44 tonnes of tanker and liquid, it's not easy to get going again. So anyone indicating I don't mind stopping for; anyone not indicating is going straight on and they can argue with the trailer. I don't push this to the limit: if it's obvious that they're coming round (indicating or not), then I'll let them go. Usually.

 

[thomas]

I can't see a fault with the cycling style in the video.

Complaints on overtaking the cars too closely. I don't really agree. Possibly more room could be given but it's hard to get an accurate idea from videos.

Filtering. I would have done the same. The speed was low, so he could of easily stopped if anyone had randomly pulled into their drive way. Jon was very considerate at the junction...it's much better just to let people across like that, than carry on...just because of the car/van flashes people across they won't wait for the filtering cyclist to carry on.

Which begs the question do these people actually think they have given more space then they have actually given and also is it that hard to judge?

I think there are different types of people when it comes to bad overtakes. IMO judging the size of a car isn't difficault.

There are those who just don't give a damn about your saftey. Missed you by a milimeter? Well, then you had plenty of room!

Others who just don't realise what it is like to be a cyclist and honestly don't know that overtaking closely isn't pleasant.

There are also those who are embarressed. This one plays on the fact that basically no one like to be thought of as a bad driver. On my old commute, there was a road which just about had enough room for a driver to overtake, if they did it sensibly! There were times on the road when drivers should just wait a moment for the road to widen even though there would be enough room to give me a foot or so of space. Now, some people just waited (a few, mainly women, waited for the entire road - which was nice!) but for some people they would have to pass with the foot of space so they don't look like they cannot judge the size of the car.

I'm a little hungover so you'll have to excuse my random overtaking personalities

Wrong but fun. The thing you have to remember is that once you've stopped 44 tonnes of tanker and liquid, it's not easy to get going again. So anyone indicating I don't mind stopping for; anyone not indicating is going straight on and they can argue with the trailer. I don't push this to the limit: if it's obvious that they're coming round (indicating or not), then I'll let them go. Usually.

Would you do the same on a bicycle?