Suspended sentence for lorry driver who reached for phone and killed cyclist

[Tin Pot]

Are judges explaining their thinking?

I'm guessing that they see the action itself wasn't heinous, but the impact was due to bad luck. Hence a light penalty.

If that's the case then it strengthens the argument for segregating road use, and automating trucks.

Without the law to protect cyclists and enforce safe driving, it's becoming a folly.

 

[jefmcg]

http://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/Lor...ist-A38-near/story-27991629-detail/story.html

banned from driving for 18 months.

So he is back driving before his suspended sentence is over?

 

[winjim]

"The court heard that both men were committed churchgoers, reports the Plymouth Herald, as Recorder Donald Tait sentenced Noble"

WTF relevance has that got to the case, the lorry driver was in the wrong & got off very lightly, disgusting outcome.

It appears to have been mentioned by the judge when sentencing. So working as a bit of an old boys network.

 

[jefmcg]

also this bit ....

While Noble did not himself testify to the court, one of his work colleagues said that he had confided that immediately before the collision he had reached for his mobile phone to play a sermon.

I wonder why he didn't testify? I suspect because he's a "Christian" he is superstitious about lying under oath, so got a friend to do it for him. He probably rightly believed that wanting to listen to a sermon would play well with this judge.

 

[numbnuts]

"The court heard that both men were committed churchgoers, reports the Plymouth Herald, as Recorder Donald Tait sentenced Noble"

WTF relevance has that got to the case, the lorry driver was in the wrong & got off very lightly, disgusting outcome.

I'm a churchgoer do I get an "out of jail free card" then

 

[oldstrath]

Are judges explaining their thinking?

I'm guessing that they see the action itself wasn't heinous, but the impact was due to bad luck. Hence a light penalty.

If that's the case then it strengthens the argument for segregating road use, and automating trucks.

Without the law to protect cyclists and enforce safe driving, it's becoming a folly.

The action itself was an accident precursor, which is exactly why it is illegal.
Until lawyers and judges understand risks properly there is no possibility of useful protection.

 

[Pale Rider]

The judge was following the national sentencing guidelines for death by careless.

Quoting:

Nature of offence: Careless or inconsiderate driving arising from momentary inattention with no aggravating factors
Starting Point: Community order (MEDIUM)
Sentencing range: Community order (LOW) - Community order (HIGH)

http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/s_to_u/...g_death_by_careless_or_inconsiderate_driving/

In court speak, the sentence passed was a high level community order.

 

[andyfraser]

The judge was following the national sentencing guidelines for death by careless.

Quoting:

Nature of offence: Careless or inconsiderate driving arising from momentary inattention with no aggravating factors
Starting Point: Community order (MEDIUM)
Sentencing range: Community order (LOW) - Community order (HIGH)

http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/s_to_u/...g_death_by_careless_or_inconsiderate_driving/

In court speak, the sentence passed was a high level community order.

Careless driving is hitting a lamppost. If the outcome of "careless" driving is the death of someone then it should be manslaughter.

 

[numbnuts]

Careless driving is hitting a lamppost. If the outcome of "careless" driving is the death of someone then it should be manslaughter.

Constructive manslaughter

For example, a person who runs a red light driving a vehicle and hits someone crossing the street could be found to intend or be reckless as to assault or criminal damage.
There is no intent to kill, and a resulting death would not be considered murder, but would be considered involuntary manslaughter.

 

[machew]

And if you hit a car with a bike lock you get the same sentence
http://road.cc/content/news/169121-cyclist-who-hit-driver-bike-lock-sentenced-community-service

 

[jefmcg]

And if you hit a car with a bike lock you get the same sentence
http://road.cc/content/news/169121-cyclist-who-hit-driver-bike-lock-sentenced-community-service

He hit a person with a bike lock. It's even in the link.

If you hit someone with something as heavy as a bike lock, you should go to jail.

Edit: read the link, he was fending him off with the lock, rather than attacking him. But still, the punishment was for hitting a person as well as a car.

 

[machew]

He hit a person with a bike lock. It's even in the link.

If you hit someone with something as heavy as a bike lock, you should go to jail.

Sorry I missed that bit, but hitting someone with a lock and killing someone gets the same jail term. WTF

 

[oldstrath]

The judge was following the national sentencing guidelines for death by careless.

Quoting:

Nature of offence: Careless or inconsiderate driving arising from momentary inattention with no aggravating factors
Starting Point: Community order (MEDIUM)
Sentencing range: Community order (LOW) - Community order (HIGH)

http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/s_to_u/...g_death_by_careless_or_inconsiderate_driving/

In court speak, the sentence passed was a high level community order.

I have no reason to doubt the accuracy of your comment. But, leaving aside the legalisms, can you not see why many of us are angry that this man did something illegal, killed someone as a consequence, and essentially got let off?

At the very least he should never be allowed to drive again.

Mind, if he is such a devout believer maybe he'll be so overcome with remorse he'll stop driving and devote his life to telling others of his errors. Well, we can all hope.

 

[theclaud]

I have no reason to doubt the accuracy of your comment. But, leaving aside the legalisms, can you not see why many of us are angry that this man did something illegal, killed someone as a consequence, and essentially got let off?

At the very least he should never be allowed to drive again.

Mind, if he is such a devout believer maybe he'll be so overcome with remorse he'll stop driving and devote his life to telling others of his errors. Well, we can all hope.

You're wasting your time - Pale Rider is a legal absolutist and the forum's principle apologist for the courts' failure to take dangerous driving seriously.

 

[Pale Rider]

I have no reason to doubt the accuracy of your comment. But, leaving aside the legalisms, can you not see why many of us are angry that this man did something illegal, killed someone as a consequence, and essentially got let off?

At the very least he should never be allowed to drive again.

Mind, if he is such a devout believer maybe he'll be so overcome with remorse he'll stop driving and devote his life to telling others of his errors. Well, we can all hope.

The judge followed the sentencing guidelines, so the correct sentence was passed - that's a matter of fact.

The anger is understandable, although in this case I don't share it - that's a matter of comment.

Sentencing has always been based on a mixture of the level of criminality and consequences.

The criminality of the driver in this case was he allowed himself to be momentarily distracted while driving, the consequences were he killed someone.

It's not easy to balance a sentence when the two factors - criminality and consequences - are at opposite ends of their scales.

Your remarks about remorse may have been sarcastic, but you may accept a law abiding working family man will be severely troubled by having the death on his conscience.

That is what the judge was on about in his sentencing remarks:

Recorder Donald Tait said: “I hope this case will send a message to other road users, who we see day in and day out using mobile phones or other devices.

“It perhaps takes the tragic circumstances of this case to bring home the seriousness of doing this and I just hope other people will learn the lesson.”
Read more: http://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/Lor...tory-27991629-detail/story.html#ixzz3oqIH5pue
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