Swimmin'

[Tin Pot]

Tommy I'm not diametrically opposed to your point of view, but I dont think you're taking into account the OP fully, and you aren't appreciating the difference between pool and OW. Kicking is basically, though not totally, a waste of energy. You get virtually no gain, for a lot of energy.

A "full stroke" to a beginner, and yes Im making an assumption, is likely to encourage a long stretch and glide, the opposite if what's needed in a tri.

Going hard at the start does not mean hurt yourself. It means do some fast laps to warm up and get used to the breathing. Trying to do fifty laps from the get go when you have breathing trouble ain't a good idea and will demoralise you.

You overstate the importance if bilateral breathing massively. For someone unable to do fifty continuous laps, its a luxury. First time triathletes have even got away with breast stroke. It is NOT essential to breath bilaterally.


Otherwise, we're on the same page

 

[jay clock]

I do a lot of triathlon malarkey (long distance) and my number one tip re the swim is to get technique right BEFORE upping the distance. Once you get in open water, enjoy the benefit of the wetsuit - a massive difference. To give an idea my first Ironman was 1h20 swim, second was 1h50 as non wetsuit due to warm conditions.....

 

[screenman]

I do a lot of triathlon malarkey (long distance) and my number one tip re the swim is to get technique right BEFORE upping the distance. Once you get in open water, enjoy the benefit of the wetsuit - a massive difference. To give an idea my first Ironman was 1h20 swim, second was 1h50 as non wetsuit due to warm conditions.....

Yep! I get it you like dressing in rubber! No need to make excuses.

 

[screenman]

Full stroke is more efficient so use it, the tricep extension phase at the end of the stroke is where a lot of the power is produced. Don't swim like a hamster whether in the pool or open water.

The ability to breathe Bi lateraly is almost essential in race conditions if somebody is swimming on your preferred breathing side.

Don't jump in the pool and go hard from the start you won't have full mobility in your shoulders resulting in poor stroke or at worst an injury, warm up with back stroke and breast stroke.

You will kick in a tri swim, but get a coach to show you what an efficient kick is so as not to waste energy (don't bend at the knee).

A mix of pull bouy and kick board work is best to isolate upper and lower to focus on technique.

Warm up set, 5 sets at just above race pace with 15 seconds rest between, swim down set.

In short, get a coach.

Slight differences going on here, I have been coached by 4 coaches so far, none suggest a kick board, in fact they give reasons against it. I struggle with breast stroke due to knee problems, so I just warm up slowly with front crawl. I do agree with not going out hard, and I would suggest a stretching regime before entering the water helps.

 

[Monsieur Remings]

Okay, another question...nose clips? Worth it or nay?

And thanks again people.

 

[Monsieur Remings]

I do a lot of triathlon malarkey (long distance) and my number one tip re the swim is to get technique right BEFORE upping the distance. Once you get in open water, enjoy the benefit of the wetsuit - a massive difference. To give an idea my first Ironman was 1h20 swim, second was 1h50 as non wetsuit due to warm conditions.....

Yep, this is the philosophy I've started to adopt; I've swam 3 times since the first post, going back to 20 lengths but concentrating entirely on breathing and technique. To me, unless I can do the distance without having to rest, there's no point in attempting it. Needless to say, these lengths are not non-stop but are giving me more experience per session.

 

[jay clock]

Okay, another question...nose clips? Worth it or nay?

And thanks again people.

No. PersonallY I think you have to butch up and exhale trhough the nose and the mouth. As you are going forwards and exhaling all the time I think it is unnecessary. And it is another bit of kit to worry about on race day

For anyone who wants good swimming advice I strongly suggest the Swim Smooth website

 

[Monsieur Remings]

Thanks mate, from a seasoned triathlete that's sound advice. I do in these early stages find myself experimenting with both mouth and nose exhalations under the water.

 

[buggi]

don't try and breath in on every other stroke. Most people come up too soon. The correct way is the 3rd or 5th stroke (whichever is comfortable) so that you breath either side reducing rolling, but for beginners this can be hard as they find one side is always easier, so breath on the fourth stroke whichever side is easier.
it's a quick intake on stroke 1 and then a long breath out on stroke 2, 3 and 4. Its important to get in a rythym.
so, at the side, take a deep breath and push off. Swim for 4 strokes and on the 4th stroke, as your arm comes out the water, turn your face to that side and take a breath. As your arm goes over, the opposite arm is pulling stroke 1 (get it?). As your over arm goes back in, your face goes back in and this pull is stroke 2. Breath out slowly through stroke 2, 3 and 4 but as the 4th stroke comes out the water (and your other arm is then pulling stroke 1 again) turn head and breath in quick, etc etc. It's a rythym.

1...2...3...4, 1...2...3...4, etc

remember that your head creates a bow wave, which creates a dip behind the wave and this is the space where you breath. Its easier if you look back towards your hand coming out the water when you take a breath in.

hope that helps. Once you get it you can then try it from either side (breath on 3rd or 5th stroke) and breath out through mouth or nose, whatever is more comfortable to you. As you are going forwards you are less likely to get water up your nose anyway.

 

[Monsieur Remings]

Okay, will certainly bear that rhythm in mind Buggi, nice one.

 

[Tin Pot]

don't try and breath in on every other stroke. Most people come up too soon. The correct way is the 3rd or 5th stroke...

The correct way to breathe is when you need to.

Every third is great in ideal conditions, given a certain level of swim fitness.

For whatever reason (stroke rate, swim fitness, weather, ...) use whatever rate is good for you at the time. Forcing a breath rate is a fools errand.

 

[fimm]

I use a nose clip, because otherwise I get a blocked nose for a day or two due to a reaction to the chlorine. Once I got used to breathing out through my mouth (which IIRC only took a session or two) it was fine.
I learned to swim crawl aged 35ish. I've done triathlons up to Ironman. I'm still slowish by triathlon standards (though I'm having a swim focus this winter and trying to swim 3 times a week, which I think is helping).

My advice: +whatever to SwimSmooth which has already been mentioned several times.
Get someone who knows what they are talking about to watch you swimming. It is very hard to work out what you are doing wrong, but much easier for someone else to spot it. So see if you can find a tri club or stroke improvers' class or something along those lines.

 

[jay clock]

The correct way to breathe is when you need to.

Every third is great in ideal conditions, given a certain level of swim fitness.

For whatever reason (stroke rate, swim fitness, weather, ...) use whatever rate is good for you at the time. Forcing a breath rate is a fools errand.

I agree. Buggi is right than being able to bilateral breathe is good but in my view it is not essential. I have done 2 Ironmans and 4 or 5 halves with breathing every stroke )right hand side only). I can just about breathe to the left if pushed, and the main benefit is to be able to breathe away from the waves in sea swims partic.

 

[screenman]

I thought bi lateral gives you a smoother stroke, well that is what my Swimsmooth coach tells me.

In truth I am happy not to drown.

 

[jay clock]

I thought bi lateral gives you a smoother stroke, well that is what my Swimsmooth coach tells me.

In truth I am happy not to drown.

yes, agreed. It is an excellent goal but there are a lot of triathletes who don't.