Team BKool CycleChat

[Baldo Mero]

Baldo, don't get to drawn into the watts thing.
Look at the speed stats instead as that is what is measured.
The watts is just a theoretical calculation based on speed, gradient, weight and any wind set.
Average watts are also driven high by calculated watt spikes which occur during gradient transitions as you take your speed, which is measured, into a steeper gradient, which is measured.

Well now that confuses me more, is that right? To my understanding the watts are measured, with more or less precision by the trainers, but not "calculated" according to the terrain. It is the other way around, isn't it?. At least the vortex does have an internal power meter and it broadcasts its power data data, which I read in my computer as well. Of course these are just simulators and trainers, but they do attempt to measure the watts that you are pushing for a given resistance. And this resistance is what is "calculated" from the terrain and conditions (slope, resistance, wind, etc). So even tough watts are not all, watts/kg in the virtual world should also give an idea of the performance of the rider and somehow be good predictor of the outcome of a race, just like in the real world (more so, since the aerodynamics, different gear, drafting and team work, etc., do not affect differently in the virtual world). As a matter of fact, this ratio is what ranks the riders in different categories in Bkool and that is also a good predictor of their average performance.

Out of interest what happens when you ride in Bkool and go from a slope below 7% onto one that is steeper, say 15%. Do you get a higher indicated wattage than your effort.
You may not if the watts calculation comes from the trainer and not the PC hardware

No, in my case I never see a wattage higher than my perceived effort. Sometimes, if slope is sustained >8-10% uphill, I do feel that the speed is higher than it would in the real world for the watts that I can push, but just because the resistance of the trainer is overpassed. But the watts indicated do not rise over the "real" watts pushed. I hope that it makes sense, it is difficult for me to explain with my Spanish superpower.

Anyway, don't think that it bothers much to me or that I am overthinking the matter, I am just curious by nature and fascinated by the whole virtual reality mechanics. The virtual bike training is a completely new discovery for me

 

[IrishAl]

I only started back riding a few weeks ago and i;m really struggling with the rides over 30mins. Any tips?
I'm finding the heat of the turbo really doesn't help the legs.

I've noticed that a lot of top riders also have high cadences. Sadly i've also noticed that in my case a high cadence are a good way to kill my legs quickly.

If you want to work on your cadence here's a cadence drill from a programme I'm following...
First do the bkool FTP test to set your power zones. (Not the same day as you plan this cadence set)

10 min Warm up Z1 to Z2
5 mins 100rpm, max. of Z3
2 mins 90rpm, max. of Z3
5 mins 100rpm, max of Z3
5 mins 110rpm, max of Z3
2 mins 100rpm, max of Z3
5 mins 110rpm, max of Z3
3 mins 125rpm, max of Z3
Cool down 10 mins recovery, Z2 into Z1.

The 110 and 125rpm section are difficult to hold your form but do your best. Imagine wiping your feet on a mat when your pedal at the bottom of its stroke rather than just powering down on the down stroke. Once your stamina is built up the you can repeat the whole set but for now once will be enough.

It's best to do this on a steady gradient of say 2% so you have some resistance to push into - ive set this up...http://www.bkool.com/profile/detail/924153?durationType=DISTANCE&lapCount=1

 

[IrishAl]

School boy error tonight. Killing myself on the goats league ride on Peyresourde and the battery died on my tablet with less than 500 metres to go. Sickener as i was just about to pip Baldo's time to take first place on the stage.

 

[AAAC 76C]

To my understanding the watts are measured

I can't speak for the vortex but the Bkools trainers have nothing to measure power, just speed.
Based on the fact that you can't buy a decent power meter for a bike for under £500 650 euro then I doubt if the Vortex has anything in it that directly measures power.

What you tell me regarding your climbing stats tells me that it is proably the turbo that calculates the power and sends the info to the PC and this may be the same for BKools and 'virtual/smart' turbos in general. I assume therefore that once you exceed the turbos gradient threshold your power stays constant and so does your speed as the turbo knows you are still climbing say 7% regardless of the course.

Some time over the weekend I am going to find a session with a good steep descent into a climb and cycle into the climb with high speed and low effort (that is my descending effort, but I understand you cannot do this) and see what my power stats do as I hit the climb.

I predict I will see 200 watts or so on the descent and then say a 400 watts spike decreasing as my speed drops off to my 200 watt effort level.

If this does not happen than all I said before might be a load of rubbish

 

[AAAC 76C]

I can't speak for the vortex but the Bkools trainers have nothing to measure power, just speed.

I do go on so!

Wine and too much use of the laptop setting in.
I think this is one of the coolest looking trainers going
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Tacx-Neo-...332470?hash=item4d3e196136:g:kFQAAOSwFqJWl81U

 

[AAAC 76C]

School boy error tonight. Killing myself on the goats league ride on Peyresourde and the battery died on my tablet with less than 500 metres to go. Sickener as i was just about to pip Baldo's time to take first place on the stage.

Should think youself lucky, if I don't take my tablets I die!

 

[AAAC 76C]

If you want to work on your cadence here's a cadence drill from a programme I'm following...
First do the bkool FTP test to set your power zones. (Not the same day as you plan this cadence set)

In the olden days we used to just train on a fixed wheel in the winter with some roller racing on the dark evenings.
There is nothing like flying down a steep slope with your feet strapped to the pedals in a medium gear to force the legs to spin.
The alternative was to take your feet out of the toe clips and straps and risk taking the skin off of your shins or calves with your metal rat trap quill/track pedals!

 

[Whorty]

I only started back riding a few weeks ago and i;m really struggling with the rides over 30mins. Any tips?

I only started cycling recently, and I'm very much the wrong side of 40, and at first I struggled. Really the only way around it is keeping at it. The first few rides I tried I couldn't finish. I must have tried Alpe d'huez 3 or 4 times before I finally finished it. Very painful! But doing that climb was one of my first targets when I got the Bkool. Now, I can ride climbs (like current Goat #2) that are twice as far as Alpe, and I'm twice as long in the saddle. Still very hard and painful, but staying with it over the weeks (and the encouragement from the guys on here) really helps. At first don't kick yourself if you don't finish a ride ... be proud that you got on the bike in the first place

 

[RickB]

I only started back riding a few weeks ago and i;m really struggling with the rides over 30mins. Any tips?
I'm finding the heat of the turbo really doesn't help the legs.

I've noticed that a lot of top riders also have high cadences. Sadly i've also noticed that in my case a high cadence are a good way to kill my legs quickly.

Just picking up on what you said about heat killing your legs. Sounds like you need a bigger fan! Heat can drain you pretty drastically and the average house temperature in winter is like a good summers day in the UK.

As for the longer rides, if you've only started back recently don't stress as the more you work at it the more it'll come but just make sure you rest plenty too. Battering away at tired legs will only hinder progress. Whorty's words are very wise. He's really giving it his all on some serious hills and certainly seeing the fruits of his labour.

 

[Baldo Mero]

School boy error tonight. Killing myself on the goats league ride on Peyresourde and the battery died on my tablet with less than 500 metres to go. Sickener as i was just about to pip Baldo's time to take first place on the stage.

Sorry to hear that!

 

[LBHIFI]

I hope that it makes sense, it is difficult for me to explain with my Spanish superpower.

Sorry,not an answer about watt/speed (Bkool speed is always too high if you ask me).
Population in Denmark is less than the population of London so we have to be able to speak another language.That is not the case with spanish.
I run everything I write through Google translate to catch the worst spelling errors, but Google can't help you with sentences. From my point of view, your english is extraordinary for a spanish guy.

 

[Baldo Mero]

From my point of view, your english is extraordinary for a spanish guy.

Hahahhaha ! you should see my Spanish then!. I think that your observation says more about the average English of Spaniards than about my own. But thank you, anyway! I lived a couple of years in Oregon and I learnt a lot from a cute girlfriend there

 

[Add]

I am just coming back from a 12 month Bkool leave of abscence, and a niggling knee injury, and if I'm honest, after my first turbo session reintroduction, I am quite sure, that had it fitted in my recycling bin, it would have been out on the road, covered in a light dusting of snow, awaiting collection from the Council.

But regrettably, with a slightly maniacal giggle and a few snorts of drowsy contempt, I hit <RETURN> the other night, twice, and entered not only Velethon Wales, but also the Long Weekend in Tenby.

Now, sober, and slightly more alert, I have kicked myself in the pants, and will force myself into the training regime required to complete both these.

But I can see it is going to take time to reachieve where I,was when I left off. Who'd have thought Ben and Jerry's ice cream and Coors could be so destructive? It said 'Light' on the bottle, and I incorrectly assumed I was as good as fasting.

But it's good to be back, and I look forward to boring you all with my nonsensical whitterings, and complete lack of useful advice. My perfectly crafted training regime, which I have moulded over the last few decades consists of just getting on the turbo as often as my body will permit, and going balls out every time, until I either require hospitalisation or at least help to get me upstairs and into bed.....it worked before, so I hope it works again.

 

[bobinski]

I am just coming back from a 12 month Bkool leave of abscence, and a niggling knee injury, and if I'm honest, after my first turbo session reintroduction, I am quite sure, that had it fitted in my recycling bin, it would have been out on the road, covered in a light dusting of snow, awaiting collection from the Council.

But regrettably, with a slightly maniacal giggle and a few snorts of drowsy contempt, I hit <RETURN> the other night, twice, and entered not only Velethon Wales, but also the Long Weekend in Tenby.

Now, sober, and slightly more alert, I have kicked myself in the pants, and will force myself into the training regime required to complete both these.

But I can see it is going to take time to reachieve where I,was when I left off. Who'd have thought Ben and Jerry's ice cream and Coors could be so destructive? It said 'Light' on the bottle, and I incorrectly assumed I was as good as fasting.

But it's good to be back, and I look forward to boring you all with my nonsensical whitterings, and complete lack of useful advice. My perfectly crafted training regime, which I have moulded over the last few decades consists of just getting on the turbo as often as my body will permit, and going balls out every time, until I either require hospitalisation or at least help to get me upstairs and into bed.....it worked before, so I hope it works again.

Welcome back!
I thought you lived on a diet of snickers

 

[kipster]

I am just coming back from a 12 month Bkool leave of abscence, and a niggling knee injury, and if I'm honest, after my first turbo session reintroduction, I am quite sure, that had it fitted in my recycling bin, it would have been out on the road, covered in a light dusting of snow, awaiting collection from the Council.

But regrettably, with a slightly maniacal giggle and a few snorts of drowsy contempt, I hit <RETURN> the other night, twice, and entered not only Velethon Wales, but also the Long Weekend in Tenby.

Now, sober, and slightly more alert, I have kicked myself in the pants, and will force myself into the training regime required to complete both these.

But I can see it is going to take time to reachieve where I,was when I left off. Who'd have thought Ben and Jerry's ice cream and Coors could be so destructive? It said 'Light' on the bottle, and I incorrectly assumed I was as good as fasting.

But it's good to be back, and I look forward to boring you all with my nonsensical whitterings, and complete lack of useful advice. My perfectly crafted training regime, which I have moulded over the last few decades consists of just getting on the turbo as often as my body will permit, and going balls out every time, until I either require hospitalisation or at least help to get me upstairs and into bed.....it worked before, so I hope it works again.

Hi Adam, good to see you back on the bike and Bkool.

Even riding over the past 12 months hasn't made Bkool rides any easier, I think my tolerance to pain has increased though. I did Velothon Wales last year, it was a brilliant sportive. The first 50 miles are flat, then you go up the tumble, down the other side, it's then rolling for a bit before Caerphilly mountain, once that is done its seven miles down hill to Cardiff. The worst bits were the huge numbers of riders which meant the feed stations were a nightmare and so were the hills. I was forced to stop on Caerphilly mountain as the riders in front of me stopped and I had nowhere to go.

Mountain goat rides are far worse than the hills in Velothon Wales, and the chain gang rides will help for the flatter bits.