The Football.....

[katiewlx]

As far as I'm aware there are no penalties or sanctions in the Premier League for match postponement. There are standards all clubs are expected to match. Personally I can't see how any club can be sanctioned for a weather event. There's a huge difference between a pitch being able to drain anticipated rainfall levels and a sudden deluge.

I thought there were...but I cant find it in the 80 page Premier League rules document but when was the last time a Premier League game got cancelled for a waterlogged or frozen pitch... #justsaying

 

[PaulSB]

I thought there were...but I cant find it in the 80 page Premier League rules document but when was the last time a Premier League game got cancelled for a waterlogged or frozen pitch... #justsaying

I've no idea and think it's a very rare experience. As I said you seem to feel lower league clubs should be punished for weather events. My club, Blackburn Rovers, had two games abandoned due to waterlogging before Christmas. One because the pitch couldn't drain the torrential downpour fast enough, my son and I were soaked to the skin walking to our car. The other because the River Darwen rose to a level above the drainage outflow preventing the pitch from draining. I have known this happen once before since +/- 1992 when the stadium and pitch was redeveloped.

How would you suggest any club cost effectively legislate for such events? It's worth considering the changes in winter weather patterns that have occurred in the 30+ years since the system was designed.

 

[AndyRM]

I've no idea and think it's a very rare experience. As I said you seem to feel lower league clubs should be punished for weather events. My club, Blackburn Rovers, had two games abandoned due to waterlogging before Christmas. One because the pitch couldn't drain the torrential downpour fast enough, my son and I were soaked to the skin walking to our car. The other because the River Darwen rose to a level above the drainage outflow preventing the pitch from draining. I have known this happen once before since +/- 1992 when the stadium and pitch was redeveloped.

How would you suggest any club cost effectively legislate for such events? It's worth considering the changes in winter weather patterns that have occurred in the 30+ years since the system was designed.

I looked it up. There were two English top flight call offs in 2006: Sunderland v Fulham and Watford v Wigan (for snow and waterlogging respectively).

Part of the reason it's so uncommon in the top flight is that their pitches are largely protected by big stands (though this does have its downsides, particularly in Scotland).

Punishing less financially well off clubs makes little sense, and goes pretty much entirely against the idea that Football Associations have any sort of interest in supporting them.

 

[Mike_P]

Theres also the simple fact its rained every day this year in many places and groundwater is around the highest it can be. As such the clubs that have not installed expensive drainage systems, and probably some that have but which is a failure, have pitches where rainfall has nowhere to drain to.

 

[midlandsgrimpeur]

Theres also the simple fact its rained every day this year in many places and groundwater is around the highest it can be. As such be clubs that have not installed expensive drainage systems, and probably some that have but which is a failure, have pitches where rainfall has nowvere to drain to.

Same for fields/farmland etc. It is now becoming a public safety issue UK wide with flooding/waterlogged areas. It is only going to continue so drainage is now a major issue everywhere (or rather the complete lack of!).

 

[PaulSB]

Well then. Rovers won 1 - 3 at QPR, much to my surprise. The manager's post match interview made sense. A long time since I could say that! Add to this all the other results went our way and this has been a very good Saturday for Blackburn Rovers.

Now we have to beat the nobenders, sorry, PNE on Friday night. That would open a gap and put pressure on the other relegation threatened sides to get a result on Saturday.

PNE will bring 5000 fans. It's going to be very interesting to see how many Rovers turn up. A good win, new manager, local derby. 🤔🤔

 

[Mike_P]

Villa Newcastle is making a strong case for VAR

 

[Dave7]

Villa Newcastle is making a strong case for VAR

Indeed.
The later Lpool v BHA match also had some seemingly atrocious decisions.
It was interesting to hear the pundits view on VAR with Macca saying how much he enjoyed games without it.

 

[PaulSB]

I rarely see a game involving VAR and I haven't seen a live match yet. My impression is that what was supposed to be an improvement has proved to be the work of the devil. Goals disallowed because a player had a foot or arm in the offside position and so on. Definitely a case of be careful what you wish for.

It must be really tedious at a live game to sit around while the referee watches telly. At least at home one can make a brew.

 

[Mike_P]

Goals disallowed because a player had a foot or arm in the offside position and so on. Definitely a case of be careful what you wish for

The offside rule needs changing, clear daylight between players for example
Given the often appalling standard of officials in leagues where VAR is not in force its as if they have been instructed to make a case for it.

 

[Red17]

The offside rule needs changing, clear daylight between players for example
Given the often appalling standard of officials in leagues where VAR is not in force its as if they have been instructed to make a case for it.

There would still be the same issue though about whether there was a few mm of daylight or not depending on the players relative body/ limb positions.

 

[AndyRM]

The non penalty decision in the Villa v Newcastle game was the worst of the lot, and there were several in that game alone which were really poor. I reckon officials have got worse because they're relying on VAR to make decisions for them.

 

[No Ta Doctor]

The non penalty decision in the Villa v Newcastle game was the worst of the lot, and there were several in that game alone which were really poor. I reckon officials have got worse because they're relying on VAR to make decisions for them.

That's definitely true for linos - they were explicitly instructed not to flag in case they got it wrong and ruled out a valid goal.

The big issue is actually around what constitutes a clear and obvious error (i.e. the criteria for when VAR should be able to step in). If the ref has seen a tackle and made a judgement on it then unless he's missed something critical it's a subjective interpretation (e.g. "excessive force", "clear goalscoring opportunity" etc). That's left us with "objective" challenges, like the defender/goalie got the slightest of touches on the ball as they completely clean out the striker - including if they weren't actually trying to play the ball but it ricocheted off them. Then they don't intervene for a clear handball because the ref has seen it, but judged (very strangely in some cases) that the hand was in a natural position when replays show it's clearly not/deliberate.

What we end up with is a load of decisions that could be subjectively argued for ("seen them given") - but most of us will think are clear mistakes - not being overruled by VAR, and a host of minimalia overrules that while maybe technically correct are so far from the spirit of the game that we tend to think they should have stood.

Obviously, we'll all add a filter of club allegiance to the whole thing, and I can be happy when we get a "lucky" VAR overrule where I'd be livid if the same decision had been made at the other end of the pitch.

I don't think there's any real solution to this. Either we let VAR co-ref the match (remove the clear error criteria, maybe treat it as an extra lino) and spend the whole game looking at replays or we bin it and accept that mistakes happen. I'm currently in the second camp because I can't see how it can be fixed without making things even worse.

I'll also see that as an Arsenal fan I've seen some stuff that I genuinely don't know how to explain. A clearly deliberate off the ball forearm to the back of the head the ref completely missed that wasn't raised by VAR, apparently because "it wasn't an elbow" (this was the explanation given later I believe), Haaland throwing the ball hard into the back of Gabriel's head after he scored (how did they miss that?), Lewis Skelly having VAR overrule the ref to get a straight red rather than a yellow for a cynical trip (VAR said it was a dangerous tackle, it wasn't - the card was later rescinded). I'm sure others have had dodgy rulings for their clubs as well, but for a long time last season and the season before it really did seem like someone at PGMOL hated us (I'm still not convinced they don't tbh)

 

[Chislenko]

The non penalty decision in the Villa v Newcastle game was the worst of the lot, and there were several in that game alone which were really poor. I reckon officials have got worse because they're relying on VAR to make decisions for them.

Andy, I think the whole football world would have been made up if you hadn't conceded three second half goals.

Me personally and I think a lot of other neutrals are hoping Hearts break the Old Firm stranglehold on the SPL.

 

[AndyRM]

Andy, I think the whole football world would have been made up if you hadn't conceded three second half goals.

Me personally and I think a lot of other neutrals are hoping Hearts break the Old Firm stranglehold on the SPL.

I'm gutted about our result but not the overall performance. My biggest concern is over John-Jules' injury as when he went off we lost all attacking momentum. His replacement, Dackers, was brought in for his height and hold up play. He excels at the former, but looks less composed Bambi on ice trying to hold onto the ball.

It would bring me great joy if Hearts (or any team) manage to win the league and break the 30 year Old Firm bore-fest. They haven't had their side plundered as has happened in recent years with the likes of Dundee United and Aberdeen, which is a positive but there's still a long way to go.

If Hearts have a few points over either at the split I think they'll manage it.

There are a few Killie fans who are unable to see past their hatred of McInnes and want them to fail. My only residual displeasure is the way he left the club, but other than that he was great for us; winning a Championship and getting a club like Killie into Europe is no mean achievement.