The Football.....

[solitaire]

The history of great clubs like LFC should obviously never be forgotten but to keep judging today's side on teams gone by is just crazy.
The team should be judged on how it performs & that alone, so on current form Liverpool are a poor side and that has nothing to do with messieurs Keegan, Toshack and Heighway.

 

[SpokeyDokey]

As a Liverpool supporter, the constant banging on about us banging on about our history starts to grate a little, I dont hear many supporters I know banging on about it. We deserved to get knocked out and getting put in the Europa league is just a money making exercise which I don't agree with, it belittles the competition. Ive been guilty of it too, but calling it a mickey mouse cup smacks a little bit of snobbery. Its not the Champions league but for those competing its something they are proud to be in and compete hard to win it.

Aw - come on! Do you spend much time on Red and White Kop? Almost certainly the most retrospective footballing forum on the planet.

Don't get me wrong, LFC were a great team back in the day and tbh the tussles we had with you in the mid-Noughties was some of the best football I have ever seen live.

And I still love it when we manage to get tickets for Anfield - the atmosphere is fantastic.

But, the LFC fans I know do have a tendency to bang on and on about the great days of yor.

For sure it is fueled by the punditry love-fest that goes on - the comedy due of Tyldseley & Townsend (long disowned by me) were almost orgasming when Stevie scored his (very good) goal the other night and the after match debrief was nauseating. You'd have thought that one of the best teams on the planet had just been hammered and knocked out of the competition.

The LFC vs Real Madrid match the other week in the pre-match build up was cited as 'a great European night', 'a remake of history' and 'a battle of the European heavyweights'. Pathetic really esp' as Brenda couldn't even be arsed to field a decent team when they played at the Bernabeu as he was crapping himself about the forthcoming match with us.

It was all still going on the other night with the 'derby' this coming weekend being pitched as the biggest match in the Premier League followed by one LFC fan stating that it is the biggest football match on the planet! Sense of perspective needed somewhere.

I think your club and fans need to look forward a lot more. The glory days are gone.....for now at least.

 

[Roadhump]

My work is pretty evenly split between blues and reds with a couple of Man U fans thrown in. I can talk about football with all of them because I dont try to wind them up and consequently they dont try to wind me up either, I know some people like the banter but its not for me. There was a red here a few years back that went to of his way to wind up the blues and got a ****storm back, to each his own I guess

I get some of what you are saying with the flags but those managers contributed a lot to the club and were so successful I think its good they aren't forgotten. After all what differentiates your club from its peers if not its history as well as how you go forward.

To be fair, I think any club should be proud of its history, however successful they are, or aren't. Look at clubs like Preston or Notts County who have proud histories but are small fish today. There does seem to be a tendency with some LFC fans to go on about their past successes though, as if it somehow makes up for their difficulty hanging onto the coat tails of the oil clubs and Man Utd in recent times. That and the media over-hype tend to give an impression they have a deluded sense of entitlement, which invites quite a lot of stick.

I appreciate what you say about banter. I don't have a problem generally and don't mind a bit of legpulling, but don't like it when it gets nasty. One of my best mates is a red who like you wants both teams to do well and we slaughter each other but in a self mocking way really and just have a good laugh. On the other hand I used to have another good mate who was a red (sadly he died a few years ago), a nice bloke until it came to football where he just couldn't help himself and turned into one of the nastiest, tiny minded people you could ever hope to meet. I also know some blues like that.

 

[Roadhump]

Money has absolutely gubbed the game, and I say that without any of the misty eyed rose tinted fondness for how things used to be back in the day when I were a lad etc.

Born in 85, I've basically grown up with football enjoying more and more financial investment. Transfer fees, salaries and ticket prices in the top leagues around the world are ludicrous and stretch credulity these days. With an organisation as corrupt and morally bankrupt as FIFA controlling things, the bubble is unlikely to burst any time soon.

I have heard a few people saying that the Bundesliga is much cheaper than English football, whether it is or not I am unsure.

I don't know what the relative values are but I remember my dad giving me a maths lesson by showing me his season ticket from the late 60s, it cost 9 guineas (£9 9 shillings) and asking me to work out how much each game cost. There were 21 home games at the time and the answer was 9 shillings a game - 45p and that was in the stand, not the terraces. My season ticket cost me just under £600 this season and that was with an early bird discount and is one of the cheapest in the country, or so we are told. My son is visiting us at Christmas and I got him a ticket for the Stoke game on Boxing Day and it cost £42....ridiculous.

I have been going to footy matches for almost 50 years, and these days with the ridiculous finance involved I sometimes wonder why I continue, but I was going before it went mad and it is a big part of my social life and I love going, but away games, other than a 2 or 3 a season are off the agenda now, I just can't afford them as well now.

 

[AndyRM]

In my admittedly limited experience, the Bundesliga is considerably cheaper. Killie have an historical link with Kaiserslautern and I saw them a couple of times in the top flight when they briefly returned to the top flight. I got change from 30 euro, which included a ticket in a great area, a couple of pints through the match and the closest I could get to a pie at half time.

In comparison, I'd get nowt back from an equivalent sum at Rugby Park and I'd not have been able to have a beer, though our pies are superlative.

Similar story in Newcastle, though I'd have been able to join the scrum for a warm pint of shitty lager at half time!

I think the difference is the financial model in German football. Most clubs are fan owned, and serve the interests of the fans, rather than investors. Obviously they still make money and the system isn't perfect as there are a couple of dominant teams who pillage the others for quality, but your day out at the footy is more enjoyable because you've not been fleeced.

 

[SpokeyDokey]

I have heard a few people saying that the Bundesliga is much cheaper than English football, whether it is or not I am unsure.

I don't know what the relative values are but I remember my dad giving me a maths lesson by showing me his season ticket from the late 60s, it cost 9 guineas (£9 9 shillings) and asking me to work out how much each game cost. There were 21 home games at the time and the answer was 9 shillings a game - 45p and that was in the stand, not the terraces. My season ticket cost me just under £600 this season and that was with an early bird discount and is one of the cheapest in the country, or so we are told. My son is visiting us at Christmas and I got him a ticket for the Stoke game on Boxing Day and it cost £42....ridiculous.

I have been going to footy matches for almost 50 years, and these days with the ridiculous finance involved I sometimes wonder why I continue, but I was going before it went mad and it is a big part of my social life and I love going, but away games, other than a 2 or 3 a season are off the agenda now, I just can't afford them as well now.

Bayern Munich salaries:

http://www.tsmplug.com/football/bayern-munich-player-salaries-2014/

Comparitive ticket prices across the four big leagues:

http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2013/jan/17/football-ticket-prices-premier-league-europe

 

[SpokeyDokey]

In my admittedly limited experience, the Bundesliga is considerably cheaper. Killie have an historical link with Kaiserslautern and I saw them a couple of times in the top flight when they briefly returned to the top flight. I got change from 30 euro, which included a ticket in a great area, a couple of pints through the match and the closest I could get to a pie at half time.

In comparison, I'd get nowt back from an equivalent sum at Rugby Park and I'd not have been able to have a beer, though our pies are superlative.

Similar story in Newcastle, though I'd have been able to join the scrum for a warm pint of shitty lager at half time!

I think the difference is the financial model in German football. Most clubs are fan owned, and serve the interests of the fans, rather than investors. Obviously they still make money and the system isn't perfect as there are a couple of dominant teams who pillage the others for quality, but your day out at the footy is more enjoyable because you've not been fleeced.

Can of worms really.

The model is massively different - take city, regional and national financing for instance. A good number of clubs have had major infrastructure developments directly funded (not by way of loan) by the various levels of German government. Funding for whole stadia and surrounding infrastucture etc. In the UK the clubs pick up the tab for this (rightly so imo).

In a different vein the German clubs esp' Bayern have attracted massive funding from the likes of eg Audi on a scale not seen elsewhere - although the gap is closing.

However, as you point out average ticket prices are much lower for the fans.

Here it is a *loody expensive day out. Just two of us to City vs Chelsea last season hit us for close to £300 all in (by no means were we in expensive seats) which is plain bonkers imo.

 

[MarkF]

I go on lots of football weekenders, it's great living 10 mins from an airport. I have watched games in Holland, Belgium, Poland, Germany, Spain and Italy (Catania in Sicily too), mostly top flight but also second tier, I have always paid paid less for a ticket than it costs to watch Bradford City in Division 3! Sometimes I feel like taking in a big Londn PL game but then I always end up flying to somewhere like Amsterdam, Milan or Barcelona, staying over, for less than it'd cost me to see the UK game.

On the other hand...................the PL losing Wigan, Bolton and Blackburn was bad news for me, I often used to buy their "block deals" and see PL games for as little as £8, thiose included the top 6 clubs.

 

[SpokeyDokey]

I go on lots of football weekenders, it's great living 10 mins from an airport. I have watched games in Holland, Belgium, Poland, Germany, Spain and Italy (Catania in Sicily too), mostly top flight but also second tier, I have always paid paid less for a ticket than it costs to watch Bradford City in Division 3! Sometimes I feel like taking in a big Londn PL game but then I always end up flying to somewhere like Amsterdam, Milan or Barcelona, staying over, for less than it'd cost me to see the UK game.

On the other hand...................the PL losing Wigan, Bolton and Blackburn was bad news for me, I often used to buy their "block deals" and see PL games for as little as £8, thiose included the top 6 clubs.

All changed now - we got a pair for first match of season (Burnley vs Chelsea) and it was £85. Nice little stadium too and very friendly opposition fans. Only downer was they run out of pies at half-time. Had to make do with Mars Bars!

 

[Inertia]

Aw - come on! Do you spend much time on Red and White Kop? Almost certainly the most retrospective footballing forum on the planet.

Don't get me wrong, LFC were a great team back in the day and tbh the tussles we had with you in the mid-Noughties was some of the best football I have ever seen live.

And I still love it when we manage to get tickets for Anfield - the atmosphere is fantastic.

But, the LFC fans I know do have a tendency to bang on and on about the great days of yor.

For sure it is fueled by the punditry love-fest that goes on - the comedy due of Tyldseley & Townsend (long disowned by me) were almost orgasming when Stevie scored his (very good) goal the other night and the after match debrief was nauseating. You'd have thought that one of the best teams on the planet had just been hammered and knocked out of the competition.

The LFC vs Real Madrid match the other week in the pre-match build up was cited as 'a great European night', 'a remake of history' and 'a battle of the European heavyweights'. Pathetic really esp' as Brenda couldn't even be arsed to field a decent team when they played at the Bernabeu as he was crapping himself about the forthcoming match with us.

It was all still going on the other night with the 'derby' this coming weekend being pitched as the biggest match in the Premier League followed by one LFC fan stating that it is the biggest football match on the planet! Sense of perspective needed somewhere.

I think your club and fans need to look forward a lot more. The glory days are gone.....for now at least.

I don't spend ANY time on Red and White kop, does it show? As I said I dont see LFC fans carping on about the old days but I'll have to accept you guys do and I'll fly my little flag as a rep for sensible fans

Re townsend et al, they are just trying to hype up a match. I cant believe they seriously thought it would be a remake of history. We havent been at the races at all this season so there was little chance of that when Real are on the top of their game.

I respect your reply, I certainly wish we had the good times back but I accept where we are at the moment and hope they can use the past to inspire the team instead of it being this pressure that holds them back. Unfortunately every time it looks like we are getting somewhere we take a step back.

 

[MarkF]

All changed now - we got a pair for first match of season (Burnley vs Chelsea) and it was £85. Nice little stadium too and very friendly opposition fans. Only downer was they run out of pies at half-time. Had to make do with Mars Bars!

Burnley are still excited just be there, but I think the novelty of PL footie soon wears off when your ST provides mostly losses & struggle. All the east Lancs clubs I mentioned had been in the PL a fairly long time and offers were regularly available, particularly around Xmas, people were amazed when I'd tell them I was off to see Blackburn v Arsenal for half the cost of Bradford City v Accrington Stanley! This was only 3 years ago and the issue of PL prices was just as popular, but in reality, tickets at some PL clubs were going very cheap indeed.

 

[SpokeyDokey]

I don't spend ANY time on Red and White kop, does it show? As I said I dont see LFC fans carping on about the old days but I'll have to accept you guys do and I'll fly my little flag as a rep for sensible fans

Re townsend et al, they are just trying to hype up a match. I cant believe they seriously thought it would be a remake of history. We havent been at the races at all this season so there was little chance of that when Real are on the top of their game.

I respect your reply, I certainly wish we had the good times back but I accept where we are at the moment and hope they can use the past to inspire the team instead of it being this pressure that holds them back. Unfortunately every time it looks like we are getting somewhere we take a step back.

Sadly I don't think I'll ever get to Anfield again.

Over the years we have built a little network of people to buy tickets from and this year for LFC vs CFC we were offered a pair for "best offer over £800".

Way out of our league as with all the bits and pieces that would've been best part of £1k to watch a footy match - bonkers in my world.

 

[solitaire]

Sadly I don't think I'll ever get to Anfield again.

Over the years we have built a little network of people to buy tickets from and this year for LFC vs CFC we were offered a pair for "best offer over £800".

Way out of our league as with all the bits and pieces that would've been best part of £1k to watch a footy match - bonkers in my world.

Absolute lunacy! It's only professional footballers who can afford to go to games nowadays.

 

[AndyRM]

Sadly I don't think I'll ever get to Anfield again.

Over the years we have built a little network of people to buy tickets from and this year for LFC vs CFC we were offered a pair for "best offer over £800".

Way out of our league as with all the bits and pieces that would've been best part of £1k to watch a footy match - bonkers in my world.

£4.50 a minute... That is madness.

 

[solitaire]

Decent point for The Irons today,not an easy place to go to Sunderland so quite happy with that.
Leicester next, I can just see what'll happen now.............................?